Dealing with the illogical perceptions of White America

First unless you count everything Homeland security does as military, a completely bogus assumption you don't get to one trillion or even close. And of course there is a difference about three trillion of it is bogus.

 

Yes, because they get some help with food stamps, you conclude they’re content with that. Would you be ? So sad that you see poor people with such contempt[/QUOTE]

Of course, only a leftist would think freebie's begin and end with FOOD STAMPS

 

Much appreciated

 

Homeland security is part of total military spending - but it only accounts for 50 Billion or so. The VA is a big one 190 Billion or so and the Overseas contingency is big as well (war spending)... and there is a bunch of other stuff that is not included under defense spending.

You should look it up sometime ... its quite ridiculous ... and the amounts are ridiculous. 50 Billion for homeland security ? That is more than the budget of many countries. Ethiopia's budget is 13 Billion/year. Then you have our intelligence agencies accounting for another 70 Billion. That is an absurd amount - as much as we spend each year on the food stamps you hate so much.

The amount for Intelligence agencies is not even included in this summary (it is in others) - and nor is veterans pensions and it is still over 1 Trillion/year. http://www.pogo.org/straus/issues/d...as-1-1-trillion-national-security-budget.html

Ad in the 70 Billion for intelligence agencies and another 80 Billion for Veterans retirement and you are over 1.2 Trillion. It is the beast that just keeps on growing.

 

As I've said before why the hell do we even need thirteen or whatever it is intelligence agencies? We have an economy bigger than some continents. Homeland securities fifty billion covers the FBI, border patrol, and a host of things not even remotely related to the military. Most of our intelligence are not part of the military and the ones that are are paid for in the military budget. Again most of the stuff not included in the defense budget shouldn't be and calling it all military spending when most of it barely even acknowledges the military and competes with it for dollars is disengenuous at best. And the military budget has been shrinking as a per cent of GDP for over fifty years. Mean while state federal local and county non military spending is at all time highs as a percent of GDP. And please note a lot of dpending at state and lower levels is driven by unfunded federal mandates.

 

You know what so funny? I heard the exact rhetoric in the 70s..we were man haters, shrill etc...and look at the changes. the label feminist was attacked by Limbaugh so women didn’t like the label. Now more and more women are identifying themselves as feminists. In my groups years ago I asked how many are feminists and very few hands went up. Then I would ask how many of you believe in equal rights for women? And all the hands went up and I would tell them congratulations you are feminists. More and more young women are taking the term back and with pride and solidarity

 

I am applying something unheard of in lib la la land where you reside - common sense

The more welfare you offer the more takers you will get

And like bears in a park welfare bums get used to the handouts and become too lazy to provide for themselves

LBJ declared war on poverty in the mid ‘60s and since then the bleeding heart liberals have thrown trillions into the boondoggle

Yet we have more poor people today than when the effort to erase poverty started

You are spouting failed ideas

 

As far as I can tell the FBI are not included under the HS umbrella. HS is part of our domestic defense and is included in Total Military Spending.

Intelligence agencies are separate from the HS budget - which was given above. Foreign intelligence and CIA operations are part of - and work in conjunction with the military.

This is not part of the "Defense" budget ... it is part of Total Military Spending - gathering foreign intelligence and conducting covert operations (often directly including the military) is part of Total military spending. It is part of the defense of the homeland. The CIA has been involved in numerous wars - Which war were they not involved in.

Regardless - even if we took out these organizations from the pie we are still near 1 Trillion in total Military spending.

Getting back to the topic under discussion - Food stamps protect civilians in this nation. That chaos that would ensue by letting the poor go hungry is not fiction .. not some made up fantasy as you would seem to like to believe. It is not something that serious people - with any knowledge of the issue - debate. We have seen this movie play out before - hundreds of times throughout history.

Sure we could become a totalitarian police state to stem the chaos that would erupt - but there is no doubt that chaos would increase.

People will go to extra ordinary lengths to survive when they are starving- Sociologists and Psychologists do not debate this - it is well understood.

What is a topic of considerable debate is whether or not we need to spend 1.2 Trillion dollars per year on the Military and Defense of the Homeland from foreign threats.

 

You have not addressed any of my ideas so it is rather disingenuous to call them failed - again without even mentioning what failed ideas you are referring to never mind showing that they are "failed".

This is not "common sense". This is avoidance and denial.

I have already granted that the welfare system in general is a mess - much is due to the high cost of administration and how welfare is delivered.

Food stamps are not a big part of that mess - except for stupid attempts to increase the administration costs by drug testing and so on.

 

I addressed all of your ideas

Your policies encourage people on the margin to be irresponsible

 

You ignored all my ideas - all you have done is repeated your premise over and over as if this constitutes proof of claim. I have never disagreed that welfare encourages some on the margin to be irresponsible.

You on the other hand have completely ignored the factors other than "irresponsibility" that are responsible for poverty.

You are in a myopic haze of avoidance and denial.

 

Yes, people like to make minimum wage so they can get welfare.
You rather see money to help the needy go to billionaires so the can more mansions , we just have different values.

 

It makes it easier to show contempt for the poor .....

 

My premise is the basis of poverty in the richest nation on earth

An end to the flood of shoeless foreigners would help poor Americans

As would balanced trade that brings manufacturing jobs back to this country

But ultimately success or failure depends on the effort and smart choices of the poor themselves

 

You mean people who can barely read and write and never show up for work on time

 

So FEMA js part of the Military? They are not technically a part of the military that isn't what they were conceived or sold as as.

 

No gary - FEMA is not part of the Military.

 

No kidding .. ignorance is bliss.

 

So you agree that there are factors "other than irresponsibility" that contribute to poverty - this is a start. The problem is that you agree only with things that fit in with your agenda. This is not how objectivity works I'm afraid.

Trumps trade war is pushing manufacturing out of this country - just look at Harley Davidson and China (not sure if they have done this yet) saying they are going to put a tariff on oil - Which is why just about everyone on both sides of the aisle that takes trade seriously is against this trade war.

Ultimately - success or failure is dependent on many factors. Irresponsibility is a factor for some but not all - and in fact I would claim that probably not for most. It is hard to justify the claim that someone who is working 40 hours a week or more - but whose earnings put them below the poverty line - are not responsible. You have not even addressed this issue with anything coherent never mind proved your claim.

 

There is no excuse for abject poverty

Bad government policy on immigration and trade make it harder to succeed but no able bodied person has a built in excuse for total failure

 

It is however under the dept of homeland security umbrella as is the corps of engineers among other such things. It was intended to be a sort of information clearing house for our various spy agencies. But they rolled in a lot ugly step children that really had no place to call home, even if memory serves the US coast guard.

 

The US coast guard is part of defense of the homeland.

 

You left out they are all rapists..you should’ve the guys busting their asses in my garden ..getting ready to rape me.
You’ll whine when your produce skyrockets ..

 

There is no excuse for you not to be a multimillionaire...if you’re not, you’re a failure
Bet you fight against raising the minimum wage