“GOP embraces natural immunity as substitute for vaccines”

Not true, plus I included ten sources, and your "bbc" article is talking about a possible ten percent, not a whole lot to bank on given the millions who have already died from the virus

And forget the "freedom" thing, it wasn't that long ago that one posted here that the Golden Corral being shut down violated his "freedom," amazing how the right has managed to take an abstract concept as freedom and reduced it to a bumper sticker cliché

 

So you are against researching this Covid resistant group? Science does 't use vague terms like "Millions" or "Many". Results are shown as a percentage. What percent of healthy people are hospitalized or die from Covid?
What percent of children are hospitalized or die from Covid?

 

Any moron can throw a hundred links chanting the State Sponsored Propaganda mantra -- all quoting the some dumb study .. bad statistics .. some of the commentators don't even know what the data they are commenting on means .. data they put in the posts. ..

regardless ..it is also moronic - hence why against forum policy -- to post a link but not cite from the link "DATA" .. like the DATA I gave you - that backs up your claim .. not some propaganda headline..

You claimed "Science" but have yet to come up with the number of people who have shown up in hospital after having covid once -- from the not immuno- compromized group.. - like was done in the Study I gave you .. where Natural immunity was found to be 27 times more protective .. actual people showing up sick .. not the laughable PCR test study that one of your links had ... which of course is why you are hiding .. because it is so blatantly pathetic ..

Israel Study - London Study ..

CDC
CDC: 74% Of People Infected in Massachusetts COVID-19 Outbreak Were Vaccinated

Don't have folks who have had covid showing up in those numbers .. not even close .. we are talking "Breakthrough infection" not a positive PCR test which is a joke

So not only are large numbers of vaccinated showing up to the hospital .. they transmit just as easily as unvaccinated people.. and what little protection they do have .. has waned significantly after 3 months....

Thats "The Science" mate ..

 

Ah yes, "state sponsored", another conspiracy.

 

Thats all you can muster .. "conspiracy" -- Not my fault you produced a "fake news" link ... Which is correct .. your laughable link .. or the Israeli Study and the CDC Study .. one of them is lying .. as they both can not be correct...

Are the Israeli's and the CDC involved in some big anti vax conspiracy .. and the London Study as well which found the poor vaxed transmit just as easy ..

Tell us about these conspiracy theories of yours .. lets see who the liars are in the crowd .. The Fauci-Biden Clownshow on one side .. Science on the other ... which one is telling you lies mate.

 

I think there's a difference between opposing the mandate and thinking natural immunity is better than being vaccinated.

Even if the vaccines did confer immunity there's legitimate arguments to be made that it is overreach. And since they don't, there's no question that it is.

Should people get vaccinated? Absolutely. You're a complete idiot if you don't, with the exception of those who can't for legitimate medical reasons.

Should the government be forcing it when it doesn't make you immune? Absolutely not.

 

When you have two scientific studies which are looking at the same thing with two different results, one of them or both of them have to be wrong but they both CANNOT be right.

Therefore we have to look at which study is better. The Israel is far and away a better controlled and more effectual study not to mention grossly outpaces the cdc in sample size.

 

Too many words? Too many thoughts? I guess you're the one who wants to vomit forth information and just presume the volume of it means people won't engage it. You get someone who does engage it and you dismiss it and double down. You're not acting in good faith.

The "default position" isn't absolute. It is the prior science. Also my "position" doesn't fall into the lines you care to paint with your link dump. The CDC at this stage has gotten just about everything wrong. They aren't acting as a science organization. They are a political organization at this stage.

Posting ten links that all report on the CDC study is just saying the same thing ten different ways. Every OTHER PEER REVIEWED study notes that natural immunity is better, more robust and longer lasting. At this stage we have conclusive proof including FROM the CDC that vaccine immunity barely lasts six months in a best case scenario. You can argue my sources (every other study) and I can argue your source but the reality is that the CDC is recommending boosters for everyone and that isn't because their vaccines are working just fine. It is because they have stopped working and they are hoping the "booster" will get them through the long and cold winter descending on the northern part of the country.

One thing yourself and others often fail to address is that the vaccine efficacy isn't great for those that are most vulnerable. Even when having just completed the second dose those with obesity, diabetes, high blood pressure, the elderly, etc the efficacy is often in the low 70's.

I suspect in a nuanced public conversation we would get a much stronger focus on GOOD HEALTH and not just on SHOTS. You can't generate a good immune response via vaccination when your immune system is already maxed out dealing with system wide inflammation and other factors related to lifestyle choices that generate poor health outcomes.

Those of us who have managed our health and also who have had COVID want the right to assume that risk for ourselves. The risk of reinfection is low enough to assume that risk.

Too long didn't read.... oh wait, that's you. Trump brags about vaccines, pushes vaccines and claims to be the vaccine savior. Those are facts. You are claiming this is political when the de facto leader of the Republican Party pushes vaccines.

Natural immunity hasn't become political. The vaccine MANDATES have become political. They've been slapped down in courts. Biden himself initially said he couldn't do them. There is no prior history of the federal government EVER acting in this manner before. It is a state level matter. Folks like yourself are trying to provide cover for this matter. The politics are coming from the vax passers, the vax mandates, the authoritarians who want their "emergency powers" to extend infinitely. You do understand that BY NOW, any executive be they a governor or president has had time for their legislatures to address COVID via legislation.

You DO UNDERSTAND that when some like yourself dogmatically chants that this is just like OTHER required vaccinations that those vaccinations did not just get mandated via executive orders or emergency powers.

This is political in part because authoritarian executives are BYPASSING the checks and balances built into our governments at all levels. They are not having their legislatures, even in blue places like New York or California, send them legislation to sign that moves the vaccination INTO LAW.

There is a reason for that. It is very political and when you care to address it do so with more than a link dump citing the same one thing from ten different sources.

 

https://brownstone.org/articles/a-review-and-autopsy-of-two-covid-immunity-studies/

Ultimately, 191 patients in the vaccinated group and 8 in the Covid recovered group got symptomatic Covid disease. These numbers mean that the vaccinated were 191/8=23 times more likely to have subsequent symptomatic disease than the Covid recovered. After adjusting the statistical analysis for comorbidities in a logistic regression analysis, the authors measured a relative risk of 27 with a 95% confidence interval between 13 and 57 times more likely for the vaccinated.

The study also looked at Covid hospitalizations; eight were in the vaccinated group, and one among the Covid recovered. These numbers imply a relative risk of 8 (95% CI: 1-65). There were no deaths in either group, showing that both the vaccine and natural immunity provide excellent protection against mortality.

This is a straightforward and well-conducted epidemiological cohort study that is easy to understand and interpret. The authors addressed the major source of bias through matching. One potential bias they did not address (as it is challenging to do) is that those with prior Covid may have been more likely to be exposed in the past through work or other activities. Since they were more likely to be exposed in the past, they may also have been more likely exposed during the follow-up period. That would lead to an underestimate of the relative risks in favor of vaccination. There may also be misclassification if some of the vaccinated unknowingly had Covid. That would also lead to an underestimate.

 

Another internet statistician expert. !!!!

 

And yet, there are several studies that disagree with the narrative. We have created a political hot potato on a illness that the vast majority of people have a 99.9% survivability and several therapeutics proven to reduce the severity for high risk people.

81 Research Studies Confirm Natural Immunity to COVID ‘Equal’ or ‘Superior’ to Vaccine Immunity

It's science deniers like you and Brandon that prevent people access to such treatments which actually lead to peoples deaths to continue to fear. It's about power. That's all this is!

DeSantis slams Biden for 'really huge cut' in Florida's critical COVID antibody treatment

JACKSONVILLE, Fla. — Republican Gov. Ron DeSantis said the Biden administration has slashed in half the state’s supply of monoclonal antibody treatments that have been critical in reducing deaths and hospitalizations from COVID-19.

“This is a dramatic reduction,” DeSantis said Thursday at a Fort Lauderdale press conference with healthcare providers. “We are facing a massive cut in antibody treatments. Abruptly.”

 

It will evolve into a common cold. Many current human pathogens have animal origin.

You are a human, but it doesn’t change the fact that you are a primate. So, yes, covid is common cold.

Yes. It only kills very few.

Wasn’t that Bidens claim from last summer?

True. 98% survive. If you exclude those who are over 65, the odds are significantly better.

Are you confusing Biden with someone else?

My kid had it and didn’t even display any symptoms. In Florida only 30 kids under 16 died over the last 2 years, and I have a high degree of confidence that they all had some serious preexisting conditions.

If they worked - why is there an epidemic in Illinois where masks are mandatory pretty much everywhere, while in Florida almost no one uses them and it has one of the lowest positivity rates?

They are inconsistent because there is no single standard of how these cases are counted among states and nations.

Absolutely true!

Well, there are lots of examples out there of people catching it, even though they faithfully followed mask guidelines.

That statement is mathematically accurate.

True.

They don’t. 10 months ago we were told they are over 90% effective, but now we know that the immunity wanes so fast, it’s hard to call this shot a vaccine. I personally know people who had breakthrough infection, yet I don’t know of anyone who caught a disease they were immunized against in their childhood. What’s the point of taking the vaccine? Protection for 8-10 weeks? Then what? Keep shooting up and risk atrophying your immune system?

 

To respond similarly;

Irrelevant

Has the common cold killed close to 800,000 Americans in two years?

Tell that to the families of the 770.000+ dead Americans

Trump's for over a year

Again, tell that to the families of the 770,000+ dead Americans

No

Antidotal narratives are irrelevant

Unvaccinated spreading the virus

Yes there is

Right reporting on how close to 800,000 Americans have died isn't worth reporting

And more where they aren't

Not true

Right, just like people never really die from auto accidents

Inaccurate, and by the fact it is largely the unvaccinated who are filling hospitals and dying from Covid proves your understanding incorrect

Want to break it down by articles and adjectives next?

 

You cited all these studies but didn't include a single source to these studies, nothing personal, but how does one know you just didn't make up the numbers and studies?

 

Looks like someone missed the gigantic links embedded in that post…. And it wasn’t me. Click the links. Follow the other links inside the articles. Keep on scrolling and you’ll find links to those 81 studies.

 

LOL, it's incredible. The anti-science anti-vaxxers are so unfamiliar with studies, that they don't even notice that all the studies the other poster quoted, were clickable hyperlinks. Too funny! This person accused the poster of making up the studies! Unbelievable!!!

Hey, don't overwhelm them by mentioning that studies have a number of other references... it will be too much of a knot in their tiny brains. You know, if they need to, gasp, actually read something and explore! It's so much easier to just watch what Tucker Carlson says on Fox News! No complicated studies to read and click on.

 

Not more than a vaccinated person unless that vaccinated person had covid as well.

 

Those that caught CV-19 have no Scientific reason they should take the vaccine. Forcing them to do so is pure Authoritarianism.

 

Maybe someone already mentioned this but the AP News link you provided below, https://apnews.com/article/coronavi...ous-diseases-92c435268078edced2a22068feb4fb3c, states

"Unvaccinated people who had been infected months earlier were 5 times more likely to get COVID-19 than fully vaccinated people who didn’t have a prior infection, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention concluded in a new study.,"

But the study they link actually determines your likelihood of getting hospitalized, not of getting an infection. It also includes people who both had covid and were vaccinated as people vaccinated. It's not a direct comparison between naturallly obtained immunity vs vaccine obtained immunity.

link. https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/mm7044e1.htm

 

I'm not sure what your motivations are on espousing such blatantly false information, but you realize there is studies and data out there now showing EXACTLY opposite of what you are claiming.

And since you have trouble identifying links

LINK↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓LINK
Comparing SARS-CoV-2 natural immunity to vaccine-induced immunity: reinfections versus breakthrough infections
LINK↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑↑LINK
In Israel, vaccinated individuals had 27 times higher risk of symptomatic COVID infection compared to those with natural immunity from prior COVID disease [95%CI:13-57, adjusted for time of vaccine/disease]. No COVID deaths in either group.

This is becoming a disease of the vaccinated as studies are now showing natural immunity is the way out of this pandemic. Or.. maybe lets take the Pharmaceutical companies out of the equation as their motives do not have our best interest in heart.

Some interesting news out of Japan.

 

This is what actual denial of science looks like. Mandating that folks who already have natural immunity also get vaccinated goes entirely against the medical science literature. Fauci was humiliated trying to defend this ridiculous position in front of congress. Why do we have folks who seemingly "hate big pharma" out here cheerleading for their bottom lines on these forums?

 

The science is clear by providing anecdotal pseudo science? You just said you don't believe an anecdotal evidence, yet provide anecdotal evidence. It's like having a conversation with Rachel Maddow!

 

You literally posted a study that debunked your own argument...

 

Where are the links to studies that show people who have recovered from covid have gotten it again? Are there ANY confirmed cases?

 

With all the vaccinations and the scream at Trump to solve this pandemic, why are all those liberals so quiet these days? More people have died from Covid this year than last year. That is under sleepy Joe. That is on the 81 million people who elected the empty suit. And that is with so many being vaccinated as that was certainly going to be the solution with herd immunity. Herd immunity? Who has heard that on the news in the past 6-months? Liberals lie and lie and then lie some more. So now someone has a problem with natural immunity? Is that because the vaccines have worked so well?