Alex Jones ordered to pay $45.2M to parents of Sandy Hook victim

You should do a little research before posting about this. I can't post links from my phone, but Jones's lies led to to these families being harassed until they had to move multiple times, having their houses and cars shot at, threats, etc.
Unfortunately there were some idiots who bought the lies hook, line and sinker.
And Jones profited from it financially.
He deserves worse.

 

Facts don't matter to them. We're talking about a subset of society that thinks millions of people voted illegally with fake ballots because of rampant abuse of mail-in voting because their pos, traitorous, lying, criminal Orange Lord told them the virus was a Democrat hoax.

And, as we are coming to learn, he is the one that not only committed election fraud, he is STILL breaking laws in having various governmental agencies "lose" evidence and they don't have a damn thing to say about that.

Just saying, it's a little less painful if we manage our expectations.

 

you seem to not understand the obvious. I have no i issue with him losing the case. I have an issue with an illegal punitive damages award that is disproportionate to other cases

 

your post sums up the position of the left perfectly. It's all about Trump living rent free in some many heads and this Jones twit is seen as a surrogate for Trump

 

fat shaming now? I don't think that is something your side supports. I was a trial attorney for several decades. The proportionality of this award is out of balance

 

Clearly. It should have been well over $100,000,000.00. Lying in a publicly aired forum to make money despite the resulting terror to innocents should leave you bankrupt. Not just bankrupt but permanently in deep debt.

 

No I don't. You reap what you sow in this life sometimes, especially in the legal areas. Alex Jones knew what he was doing and knew how his listeners will respond to his statements, and he did it very well. So well, that now he is reaping what he has sown.

The Supreme Court has ruled on a number of occasions on what is and what is not cruel and unusual punishment. The 8th amendment has been used to cite lack of chocolate jello pudding as a cruel and unusual punishment and was rejected by the Supreme Court. An example of cruel and unusual punishment would be death by garrotte, for instance.

https://constitutioncenter.org/inte...h Amendment to the,as the price for obtaining

 

The Weaver incident was unfortunate, but then again, there is that immunity defense for law enforcement. And the FBI is law enforcement.

Furthermore, the reason why it happened was that the United States Marshall Service was attempting to arrest Randy Weaver on illegal firearm charges, two sawed-off shotguns, to an informant within the Aryan Brotherhood. Aryan Brotherhood makes the MS 13 look at wannabe gangsters back in the 1990s. Randy resisted and shot at them, a shootout ensued in which a deputy US Marshal was shot and killed, and Randy's son was shot and killed along with the dog, who was probably attempting to attack the marshals. Then the siege began after the shootout. During that time, the FBI negotiating team and the FBI "SWAT" team arrived with no coordination between the two. One of the FBI snipers thought he saw Randy and it was his wife, which is how and why she did.

Of course, none of this would have happened if Randy would have given himself up peacefully. Randy Weaver lost everything because of his actions and no one else. And he paid for it with jail time.

In the meantime, his three surviving daughters were awarded $1 million each in a lawsuit settlement, after Reaver was convicted of two of the 10 counts, served time in jail, and fined. He later testified in the US Senate Judiciary Committee in 1995, GOP majority, in detail of his racial beliefs stating "I am not a hateful racist" whatever that means.

The point is, you are comparing apples and oranges here.

 

That is not what MJ is arguing. What MJ argued is that whatever is right or wrong morality speaking is dependent on the person evaluating or analyzing what is right or wrong.

For instance, is homicide right or wrong? Depends on the facts, doesn't it? Justifiable Homicide is allowed while 1st-degree homicide is not. Right? But if you are just arguing that all homicide is wrong, then you are also arguing that justifiable homicide is wrong too. So, you need to add context to what you are describing, which is what MJ was arguing about.

 

Actually, there is under Texas civil statutes. Jones is simply the latest, not the first. If a business lied about another business causing them harm, aka lost profits, then that business would be sued by the other business and would have gotten awarded in a similar fashion.

 

It is up to the jury to decide in a civil trial what is and what is not punitive. Texas does have some statutory limits, but that is not what the Jury uses when determining such an award.

My personal opinion, if the jury knew that was a statutory limit on punitive damages, then the jury should have awarded each family $45 million each and the statutory limit on punitive damages. Is that better for you?

 

Juries have great discretion. They're not limited to what you personally believe is fair. Moreover, they heard the facts. In contrast, you sat at home apologizing for Alex "Cowardly Lion" Jones, and still are.

The judge has the discretion to reduce the verdict, but it does not look like there is a cap on "pain and suffering" damages in Texas.

 

There is a cap on punitive damages in Texas, 750k per plaintiff.

 

That is absolutely correct. It's our "frame of reference" and internal biases that assign those labels.

An example I usually give is that I helped to develop a program for men completing their prison sentences to get readjusted to rebuilding their lives post-incarceration. The only men I refused to work with were rapists and pedophiles.

So, here I am just having regular conversations with drug addicts, drug dealers, murderers (not if it happened during the commission of either of my two non-negotiables mentioned), etc.. They had pictures of their families on their cell walls. They like hugs, they cry, they are human beings that made mistakes.

However, our society isn't very forgiving of criminals even once they've paid their debt to society. The recidivism rate is high because without some type of structured support in the community there simply is no way for them to get a job, housing, or even appropriate interview clothing.

Thus, if we ask someone that was robbed at gunpoint so a guy could get his drugs if he that ex-con is "bad" or "good" or "right" or "wrong" it is clear the answer will be different than if we ask his parents or friends.

They know the person.

His victim only knows a "snapshot" of who he is.

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There was a case in which a man was arrested for shoplifting toys. The police were already at the location so he was apprehended quickly. He dropped the toys and put his hands up but the cops hit him with the front of the car to knock him down and attacked him when he was still down. He lost consciousness on the way to the station so they had to take him to an ER. He had a broken cheekbone, eye socket and ribs. The officers covered for one another and said that he fell trying to get away. He died about a week or so later.

To those cops, he was just another worthless "n" that needed to know "his place".
To his family, he was a good husband, father, son and brother and he was just trying "to give his kids a little Christmas after losing his job."

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Comparatively, in 2019, a man moved into our building. He was kind of bizarre but seemed harmless. One weekend he became angry at his mother about something and decided to throw away all the furniture she bought him. He stuffed all the couch cushions and pillows and bed pillows and everything he could into the trash chute which meant that everyone that threw out trash and garbage above him ended up with backflow. It was a mess. Management talked to him (maybe early 40s) and his mother and he apologized.

But, the following weekend (when the property manager isn't here) he grew angry about the talk and decided to punish the property manager. He took down every single painting, floral arrangements, brochures, maintenance forms, decor, bulletin boards, literally everything that wasn't nailed down. He took it all outside and destroyed them so they couldn't be retrieved. That Monday, they looked at the security footage and saw what happened and called the police. When the first cop realized it was not going to be easy....all said and done, there were about 7 cops literally chasing this man through the building for close to half an hour. He was combative, threw his soda at the first one, threatening, spitting (biohazard) until they could get him still enough to cuff him and carry him out. But, here's the thing. The following day, his mom had posted bail and he was told that he was evicted. His mother threatened to sue but it was just hot air because they had hours of him destroying company property. His mother obviously thinks he is just a bit quirky. Those of us that had to live around him thought he was a nutjob. Right or wrong? Depends on who we're asking.

One guy gets beaten to death literally over a toy truck and a doll valued at maybe $30.

One guy gets bail and no conviction and he destroyed at least $8,000 worth of property.

This is the primary reason that I will no longer speak to racists. They simply don't care that they are hurting other people and they lie to themselves that they aren't because that's easier than looking at who they really are. It's much easier to rationalize that if they can just pretend it's all fabricated.

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They use whataboutisms to compare the Capitol riots to the BLM riots. There is no comparison because...

1. The BLM rioters are protesting a truth and their culture does not have the power to change that truth.

2. The Capitol rioters were protesting because of a lie and their culture does have the power, collectively, to change that into a truth (which is why Trump continues to lie and gaslight. It's working). Right now, Trump apologists and loyalists are infiltrating every level of elections in an attempt to not only marginalize non-R voters but try to steal another presidential election.

It's preposterous to think those two are anywhere close to one another relative to the short-term and long-term damages the power (or lack thereof) structure provides one group over the other.


They aren't interested in understanding how system bigotry punishes black and brown people more severely or how many crimes by white people are just overlooked. Of course the statistics are going to paint that picture. That's exactly what they are designed to do - instill fear and hatred simply because the society they live in wants to retain the privilege that comes with marginalizing those they deem to be inferior.

And, at the end of the day, if a person needs a law or a religious book to tell them that's outrageously wrong, they have much bigger hurdles to jump than anything in a few messages on a forum can provide.

 

Why are people defending the criminals again? Didn't we have enough of that dysfunction when they ignored all those people attacking all those Capitol police officers?

I don't give a damn if Jones has pain and suffering. Did he care about the pain and suffering he caused those families? Not only do they have to race to their child's school upon learning a man with a gun was inside, they had to go to a cold, dark morgue to identify their little bodies and make funeral arrangements with little coffins. They had to bury their babies whose lives were cut short for no reason other than the corruption and apathy of the NRA and a sorely lacking and dysfunctional mental health system in this country. They had to go back home to silence. No little feet running to show what they made in class. No silly little pranks. No precious little smiles. No more unbridled joy at just being a little kid.

Did he give one moment of pause in NOT adding to their pain and suffering?

I don't care what happens to him and he's damn lucky he didn't hurt one of mine.

Everything else I'm thinking right now is bannable.

 

Not exactly. What I found is no cap on pain and suffering damages (depending on the kind of Defendant), but there are caps on just about everything else.

 

Because Jones fits their political viewpoints to a "T" and anyone who has the same political viewpoints cannot be arrested, charged, sued, or even made liable. That's why.

 

Yes. the 750K limit was intended for class-action suits with many victims suing a corporation.

 

No, that can't be it. I haven't followed this case but I'm going to going to rely on my math background and assume all the parents and extended family and friends of those murdered children can't be Democrats or Independents.


In the exact same logic...

All the Capitol police officers that were mob attacked and beaten weren't Democrats or Independents. Trump supporters work for police departments too.

All the terrified lawmakers that were trapped and pleading with him and Meadows, Ivana and Don. Jr were a mix of parties. He ignored them all.

All the people that have resigned or been fired for not kissing his backside were aligned with him politically and supported him enough to work for him.

As @Pants posted the other day, Cheney has voted *with* the Orange Stain close to 100% of the time and she stood up for us and our country and her own oath of office. So did Pence.

I would even hazard a guess that there are some conspiracy theorists among each of these subsets.​

So, it can't just be the right letter behind his name. There has to be something else that makes them refuse to calibrate this correctly.

 

Yes. Way to focus on the important details from my post.

 

His value is very negative.

 

I think he will get off in the end on the Tucker Carlson defense. He'll argue that his attacks were so crazy that nobody could have taken them seriously. He's already successfully argued that basic premise in relation to his whole schtick in a dispute over custody of his children.

Or has he done that already?

Did you know that Colbert was doing a parody of him but his legal people canceled it? Not because they thought Jones had any case against it but because they thought conservatives would take it seriously. Many did take the Colbert Report as serious reportage and it was even noted with some favor by some real conservative shows and orgs. (I THINK CPAC was one but I am not sure of that)

 

Can you help me understand that better? I have been desperately trying to figure out why but they won't talk about it. They just abandon the thread whenever I ask them.




Personally, if I believed something that a liar said and then one of that liar's closest allies admitted they lied under threat of perjury, I would have to accept that the liar lied to me.

Personally, if I believed myself to be a reasonable person and that liar's closest allies admitted they lied and said "no reasonable person would believe my election lies.". I would have to accept the liar lied and/or I'm not a reasonable person.

Why is that not happening?

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How is it possible to believe that MILLIONS of people voted fraudulently without an ounce of evidence but ignore a person confessing that they lied about that very fact?

How is it possible that anyone would think that Trump would be loyal to them when he's banished countless people to the cornfield, some for no reason other than his rage-aholism?

How is it possible to completely ignore the mountains of hard evidence that he's a fraud, liar and criminal?

Do they wear special glasses or something? He has a trail of bodies in his wake everywhere!

 

Well, these posters are just regurgitating the same talking points as MTG and others from CPAC because they don't know any better. If MTG or Trump or anyone else said in the recent CPAC that the sun rose from the west and settled in the east, I can guaranteee you that some of the most conservative posters on here would be stating that is correct. They can't think for themselves on anything, which is why they are more likely monkeys than humans.