Escalation? U.S. Navy Fires Warning Shots At Iranian Ship .....

Your post makes me want to link and quote the following, which I admit is merely a personal observation from someone who happened to have seen Iran and not anything more, but which (even if somewhat exaggerated) frankly is closer to the truth than the opposite picture some like to paint:

http://jimstonefreelance.com/iran.html

 

Thank you. I will check out the link.

I know there is a lot of data to suggest those countries are not bad off. Nowhere near the narrative were fed. Libya had a great infrastructure before we "liberated" them and that country became a cesspool. Syria the same thing.

I'm always wary of data found on the web. It may very well be that Iran is that well off. I myself am not a staunch supporter of Iran. I just support their rights toward autonomy. I see no evidence to suggest otherwise. People say "zomg they're aggressive." that's based on no evidence.

 

Iran is a very complex, and in many ways, contradictory society. No one picture or set of pictures, and no generalization about Iran, will give you a good sense of the complexities and contradictory nature of this country. But there are certain things that are absolutely and completely true when it comes to the image of Iran compared to the reality and this is the almost universal reaction and refrain from all those who have visited the country: Iran is nothing like it is portrayed in the West." It really isn't.

 

Incidentally, the bizarre stereotypes about Iran even lead people in high offices from countries who have been somewhat involved in creating these stereotypes to be surprised by what they actually see when they visit Iran. Take for instance, as one example, the observations of Hammond, the British foreign secretary, after he visited Iran:
http://www.theguardian.com/world/201...war-discussion

 

Can I drink in Iran? I mean, any good beers and bars to go to there?

 

Yeah....and her is the information.

Iran developed a Nuke.....the United States invades Iran.

Period.

AA

 

Hammond is a lot smarter than I thought - I formed precisely that same opinion about a decade ago after watching a documentary on Iran and its people. Actually I recollect concluding the vox pop was so intelligent and thoughtful that I felt quite ashamed to be British: that same feeling was resurrected only this morning, when I read that the loss by the BBC to Channel 4 of The Great British Bake-off franchise is headline news! I despair what has happened to a once-great country.

 

As I said, Iran is a complex and contradictory society! Sale and consumption of alcohol is prohibited, which doesn't mean people don't drink! Millions of Iranians drink regularly and there are many alcohol treatment centers and the like to handle the problems of Iranians who have drinking problems. And there are thousands of motorists in Iran who are caught drinking and driving, with the penalties for doing so ironically weaker in Iran than they are in the US.

As for bars, since sale of alcohol is prohibited, there are no 'bars' as such. Rather "private places" (in their homes and villas, but also in places that are "private" but have a cover charge) to take their place. Basically, alcohol consumption in Iran is like marijuana consumption in the US. If you want to drink, you call a dealer or middleman and will have the drinks you like delivered to you. It is very common place. What's more, since the function of the police in Iran when it comes to these types of crimes is not so much "law enforcement", but collecting bribes and pay offs, the statistics that you will see in reports such as the one below actually hugely and grossly understate the true state of affairs. If a police stops you and suspects you of drinking and driving, the typical end to the incident is a (small, typically around $25) payoff to the police. Not a good thing, given that Iran has one of the worst traffic accident rates in the world and some of it is certainly the result of drinking and driving, but it just shows the contradictory and confusing state of affairs in Iran!

http://www.middleeasteye.net/news/iran-drink-driving-figures-alarming-say-officials-1606673692
Iran drink driving figures 'alarming', say officials

 

WOW I certainly didn't get that impression in the documentary - how things can change in a decade? It sounds more corrupt, and has more of a booze problem than here in the UK. Mankind is definitely going mad.

Obviously Hammond isn't a lot smarter than I thought!!

 

I thought The Obama gave Iran everything for some reason, and now they still chant "death to America"... it's like liberals suck at foreign policy or are deliberately arming America's enemies with America's money.

 

Even a decade ago, when I first came to Iran, alcohol consumption was quite common. But it has become even more so in the interim. So much so that the most popular comedy show in Iran, which is officially aired, involves a famed Iranian satirist whose most famous line is about the weekend approaching and everyone heading off to have "joojeh [chicken wings] and drinks". (Drinks meaning alcoholic drinks, but since it is not spelled out, the line can be used without it being censured). The line is funny and makes people laugh because it alludes to the very contradictory nature of Iran: speaking to something very common, but yet officially prohibited! It is kind of like satellite television: here, without a doubt, a significantly greater percentage of Iranians have satellite dishes than in the US or elsewhere. Because it is "illegal", they are actually cheap since there aren't any protections for those who would want to charge for the programs and shows. A satellite dish and receiver that allows you to watch anything you want from all over the world (from news, entertainment to even porn) costs around $50-$75 and no monthly fees or anything thereafter and no restrictions on what you watch since the sum also includes breaking the codes for the "pay for view" channels and programs!

 

Sounds like the stupidity and the decadence of the West is spreading further afield. Oh well - que sera sera!

- - - Updated - - -

That post is very thought-provoking.

 

Sounds like a fun place to be. The government must really be broadminded to allow Iranians these freedoms. Where are the good Jewish bars?

 

Actually, the good thing about Iran is that you can live a decadent, western style, life if you wish. But if you wish, there are many places and regions in Iran were the life-style is not as decadent. But there is a hardly a major urban center in Iran, not even religious cities like Mashhad which attract millions of pilgrims from Shia countries around the world, where you can't find both the greater "liberties" associated with "Western decadence" and some of its negative consequences. But in the more religious cities, as opposed to Tehran, Kish, the Caspian coastal resorts etc, the decadence has a different flavor. In the former, life in Iran is pretty much like life in say Los Angeles, where I used to live. In other places, life is different in some ways, but the 'fundamental things (fortunately and unfortunately) still apply'!

Here is a report about tourism and tourists who go to Mashhad, a religious city in Iran which superficially is different than places like Tehran and which attracts a different type of crowd. But, as a big city, it is actually not all that different ultimately.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/i...and-water-parks-in-irans-holy-city-of-mashhad
Prayer, food, sex and water parks in Iran's holy city of Mashhad

 

What is a "Jewish bar"?

As I said, there are no "bars" as such in Iran. People drink in their homes, in private parties, and some in "private parties" that aren't so private and charge for their services, functioning as underground bars. The latter, these underground bars and discos, are sometimes raided by the police and are less tolerated than whatever is done in genuinely private parties and gatherings.

 

I obviously don't know how old you are but if you want/need 'fun' you could do worse than come to live here - intellectually and entertainment-wise the UK is like one giant children's play park. They're even discussing Bake-off on the flagship current affairs Today program right now. The questions has just been asked 'But can it (The Great British Bake-off) survive without the main two?' - 'the main two' is some bloke who can bake different kinds of bread, and the other is some wrinkly old dear (who's a hundred and fifteen years old if she's a day! ) who used to be a tv cook.'

 

Yep....they still chant death to America. Maybe its time they hear Americans chanting Death to Iran, and wiping them off the face of the earth.
They definitely need to see what happens when they try to play chicken with one of our navy vessels again.

Then they should get the message Right afterwards. Lets see if they want to jump off and go hard. I don't think they will tho.....which will then show their nothing more than cowards.

 

You seem incredibly interested in seeing people killed, just because you don't like their chants! I think you have a problem and the cure for your ailment is not getting people killed, but something else.

Those folks who operate Iran's speedboats, and dare to play "chicken" with vessels much bigger than their's, may be a lot of things. Being cowards is not one of them. Just playing what you refer to as a game of "chicken" with someone much bigger and stronger requires courage.

They say discretion is the better part of valor. Which is something I wouldn't mind being kept in mind by Iran's sailors. But the one thing that strikes above all else when one reads the account of the battles that took place in 1988 during Operation Praying Mantis is the courage of those Iranian sailors and officers who were sent to confront the US navy after the Americans blew up an Iranian oil rig and caused other damage to Iranian assets in retaliation for the damage done to the USS Samuel B. Roberts. The Iranian vessels that challenged the US naval forces were in each instance totally outnumbered, outgunned. Yet, they obeyed their orders, sailed towards the US surface action groups, challenged the US naval forces, stood their ground, didn't surrender when warned they were about to be fired on, even though they knew they had no chance to win. Their courage is an inspiration for the sailors who are guarding Iran's waters, even if this time around, they know that unlike in 1988, Iran does have something to hit back at the US if any shots are indeed fired.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Praying_Mantis

 

And it is said.....Freedom is not entrusted to the Weak and Timid.

 

Some of the officers of the Joshan who were killed during Operation Praying Mathis:

Captain Nemati, commanding officer of the Joshan. He was 28 years old.

Officer Harabadi, communications officer of the Joshan, also 28 years old at the time.

As the "oldest officer" of the Joshan (36), officer Secoundi was the chief mechnics officer of the Joshan




While the original Sahand and Joshan were sunk during Operation Praying Mathis, Iran gave two of the ships it built since pictured above the same name in their memory.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iranian_missile_boat_Joshan_(2006)
Iranian missile boat Joshan (2006)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iranian_frigate_Sahand_(2012)

 

So what happens if we sink an Iranian ship or two? Are they going to file a formal protest with the U.N.?

 

You have successfully confused human rights within a country, and that country's foreign policy.

 

Quite likely, Iran would sink an American ship or two in return.

 

Incidentally, there are reports of another so-called "incident" -- this time, Iran warning off US aircraft which had flown close to its border. I put "incident" in quotes because frankly I don't see why it is considered an incident at all?

https://www.rt.com/news/359132-iran-us-spy-planes-warning/
US ‘tests’ Iran’s reaction to spy plane flyby, complains about ‘unprofessional’ shootdown warning

 

With what, a rowboat? I think we should just preemptively sink the entire Iranian navy.