We keep going around and around here. We sometimes get to a point where it seems that everything has been discussed, and is finally understood, and then someone comes along and asks a whole new set of rephrased questions. I hope this thread can be the place where John the New Guy asks why we oppose new laws. Those of us who know this stuff can come back and honestly say: "Because this law already addresses that", and cite that law. Let John the New Guy ask any question he likes, and hope that we who participate in this thread can come to a little better understanding of where things stand right now.
A tip to John the New Guy, acting like you are an expert when it is clear you are not is a terrible idea.
To pose as an expert and really all you have done is watch the media and read about the subject is a huge mistake. There is so much to know on the subject of firearms, that anyone who poses as an expert but isn't, gets quickly exposed. There are too many knowledgeable people on here that can't be fooled.
Most of the time spent in gun threads is explaining to the gun control advocates are factually wrong, yet they still like to pretend they are an expert. They can just (*)(*)(*)(*) off imo.
It seems that for many of "them", it matters more that the talking points are established, rather than whether or not they're true. I can't help but agree with your summary here, and yet we keep engaging in this little process of chasing the same stinking tails around the same tiny bushes. Let's look at some of those stinking tails, and try to stop the process. One of the ******* lies I've most recently been deeply offended by is the claim that we don't want any control at all. They ignore the fact that we proponents of the 2A are vested in this debate, and we hold that some of their "talking points" are not open to debate. We will not register. You will not infringe. Now, what about reforming the entire "justice" system, and going about this little business of running our society based on what we know for certain, rather than what we are told to believe?
I really could careless what they think. The only way this country will be gun free is after a massive bloodbath and guns just magically disappear. There will be no disarming of Americans peacefully.
Why is it that for every 1% increase in gun ownership rates there is a 1% increase in murder rates if gun owners are so responsible?
From what dark and smelly place did you pull that little gem? The CDC and FBI disagree with you. You could have learned that without even leaving this forum, because all of those statistics have been referred to and linked to ad infinitum. Next?
If you do not know where the information comes from then how can you dispute it? Any other "experts" want to take a try because the current one is dismissed....
How about a little taste of your expert proof. I got a fair idea it's been refuted already but hey...make me a believer
why are you fibbing given there are far more guns now than there were 20 years ago and yet gun crime rate is decreasing why do gun banners tell so many falsehoods - - - Updated - - - its a lie: we all know it
We know where your information came from, your imagination. Hard to dispute that if you know the facts.
we know that gun control can make life harder for criminals. we know this, because the vast majority of guns used in crimes in NYC and NYS, are from other states. 90% of the guns used in NYC crimes.
we know that for ever criminal slightly inconvenienced, hundreds of good people are disarmed after a while we have to assume that is your real goal tell us Ronstar-why are you wanting to disarm potential victims and make the working environments of criminals so much safer? why don't those NYC Laws keep guns out of NYC?
You got a mouse in your pocket? All you prove is that you think only a ban will work, if not all this proves is that the black market will work. BTW, why do all those gun owners go to NYC to shoot their guns?
Folks, it's lies like this that undermine any credibility that anti gun folks have. Any thing you post from now on will be suspect. Murder rate falling since 1991, 9.8 per 100,000 people in 91' to 4.7 in 2011 http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/murder-rates-nationally-and-state#MRord Background checks steadily up since 1998, this reflects gun sales. 800,000 in 98' to 20,000,000 in 2014 https://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/nics/reports/nics_firearm_checks_-_month_year.pdf
well the entire gun ban movement is based on a lie. they claim its about public safety when in reality its about punishing people they see as being hostile to their political agenda which is invariably more government more socialism, etc. ever notice that EVERY SINGLE group that sees white conservative Christian Males as their enemy supports gun bans?
you can read the minds of millions of people? I think you WANT your philosophical opponents to be the devil, so that you can call them "the devil". but these ad hom attacks are incorrect, and only hurt your agenda. I know lots of folks who own guns, who want more gun laws. - - - Updated - - - cause these areas aren't full of poverty and inequality.
you won't get an answer. The Graboids used to complain about Va supplying DC with all the guns. Yet Va with all those gunshops had about 1/10th the crime as DC. same with the areas outside of the collectivist Cook County in the windy city why are those areas generally low crime? could it be that gun bans create CRIME - - - Updated - - - I am talking about the gun ban leaders-the ones in office, the ones spending hours whining about gun rights fact is you all want to harass law abiding gun owners. its either that or you are stupid. I don't think think you are stupid so your schemes which are failures as gun control have to be motivated by something other than crime control.
It's funny to me that the uninformed keep telling me that I am not an "expert". They don't even know what an "expert" in the gun culture might be. I determined to become an expert when I was 12 years old, and assigned myself to read and understand the entire Hornady reloading manual of 1971. I did that, and started casting bullets and reloading ammunition for my Ruger .357 Magnum Blackhawk and my Ruger .44 Mag. Deerstalker carbine. Since then, it's become shameful to me that a lifelong member of the American Gun Culture has had to become versed in politics. To me, my interest in guns and ballistics is much like other guys who mess about with radio controlled airplanes, or other things where we dabble in applied physics. This is not a thread derail. I'm clarifying why the American Gun Culture is NOT the problem. Most recently, I was out last week in 104 degree heat with my pair of AR-15's, trying to determine accuracy with a new load, and also trying to determine if the 20" barrel was driving bullets to the point of disintegration in flight. With a muzzle velocity of 3,400 feet per second and a twist rate of 1 turn in 7", those bullets are spinning at over 582,000 rpm! Fascinating. This week, I lowered the operating temp. of the rifles and ammo by about 4 degrees, and didn't notice the phenomena. I didn't even shoot my scary carbine, because that's all worked out. One form or another of goofing off in this manner is how I've burned off the last 7,000 rounds of 5.56 ammo, 12,000 rounds of 9mm, and well over 20,000 rounds of .22LR. When you fool around with hand loaded ammunition at this level, and painstakingly build your rimfire rifles, it does indeed make an expert of you. At the same time, it removes you by many magnitudes from being any kind of "problem". Other members of this board like Turtle Dude, Orlando Chuck, Wolverine, and a good many others are genuine experts as well, with similar tales to tell. We don't cause any problems at all for mainstream society. We have a very good idea of how we would expect to fare in a conflict. We have no desire for conflict, and we are not the problem.
Another expert who does not know what facts are. Strike Two for the brain trust. Maybe the next expert will google before they speak.
LOL-I forget more about guns daily than you will ever know http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/201...-past-20-years-justice-dept-report-finds?lite after you read that you can apologize or slink away. matters not to me but you are wrong and there are millions and millions of more guns now than there were 20 years ago
In trying to clarify the TRUTH, are we casting pearls before swine? You're right that it doesn't matter. It's like the guy who has to do whatever he does to "prove" that he's a really macho guy. I know what I've done, and I know how. I know what it's made of me, and it can't be "unmade" or even challenged by one who isn't aware of what it took to get there. What makes it all anticlimactic to me is that it isn't all that big of a deal, after all. It's just the world. You come to master this and that aspect of "the world", and a part of you keeps asking "Is that all there is?" That's where the real journey is. Why do we have to traverse the battlefield before we can transcend it?
