This makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. One cannot "be" and "not be." Birth is simply an event in the life process--it does not change the substance or essence of the thing that is born. It's a human being. Your term "race" is actually the imprecise and inaccurate use of a term. On the other hand, conception DOES change both substance and essence of the matter that combines and becomes a new biological organism--a human biological organism. THAT is the science fact of it.
Logical fallacy - Germany didn't take over the world so there is no evidence to support a "what if" You are talking about crimes committed against independent sentient people, which a zygote isn't .. very different circumstances. - - - Updated - - - Well thats your opinion, it makes perfect sense to large numbers of other people
Fugazi you said, "Logical fallacy - Germany didn't take over the world so there is no evidence to support a "what if"" But YOU AND ILK do it all the time to champion abortion. You want abortion legal for the "what if's"......WHAT IF THE CHILD IS BORN INTO A ABUSIVE HOME, A LESS THAN PERFECT HOME? Its better to kill it. That is your mentality.
I wouldn't misrepresent others'' mentality when everyone can judge through that person's comments and your own which mentality is most out of touch and extreme, one trying to advocate for FREE choice, and the other trying to IMPOSE restriction on free choice! And, it seems pretty obvious that the hypocrisy in "pro-life" crowd, including the Catholic Church is overwhelming! Dd you hear that, when money is concerned, the Catholic Church doesn't hesitate to turn away from "a fetus is a person" to state, in a court of law, that "fetus are not persons,until they are born!
Yet again CM your are shown to be a liar ... quote me where I have ever said I want abortion legal for a child born into an abusive home, never have, never will. This is why you will never be taken seriously, time after time you display your hypocrisy and lies. Even the pro-lifers must cringe when they see your name on a comment.
First of all, I wasn't even discussing zygotes, dude. You said that the Holocaust was done against independent, sentinent people, and that a zygote isn't sentinent, it's just a bunch of cells. I told you that, for the sake for the sake of this arguement, I won't bring up the Bible or the life begins at conception belief. I will discuss this issue from a strictly medical, scientific, and legal point of view, or something along those lines. I will bring myself to your belief system and to your level of understanding. And, for the sake of this arguement, I can agree with you on zygotes not being independent sentinent people, and I can understand why you would feel that women have the right to choose their own bodies over a few week old piles of zygotes cells. I disagree with you even on the issue of zygote super early term abortions, but let's not debate that right now. Because, from a strictly scientific and a medical POV, the earliest terms of abortions are not like the Holocaust at all. We can agree on that, for the sake of this arguement. OK? What about partial birth abortions, where a full term baby is being brutally tortured while having their brains sucked out, while they are being practically almost born already? And other late term abortions? And don't give me that "it's only done in the life of the mother" excuse, please. That's only just partially true. Prove to me that elective late term abortions are all illegal nationwide. And what about even second trimester abortions? 20 week old babies/fetuses can and they do feel pain and other sensations, they are sentinent and concious and aware. And, yet, they can even be killed from 20-24 months of gestiation pregnancy, and that's just going by your logic. No offense, dude, but you're just in denial. http://www.lifesitenews.com/blog/th...-testimony-youll-ever-hear-from-a-former-abor
Well lets be honest you think a pregnancy as the result of rape should go to term, same as with incest pregnancy .. in fact any pregnancy even ones that would kill both. After all in your fantasy all fetuses are innocent.
What about a late-term abortion in the situation of rape or incest, in your opinion? And in your fantasy you don't care if fetuses are feeling pain. I got too give you the benefit of the doubt that you are just ignorant, if not that, you are probably either just callous or just plain malevolent. Also, what about a double instances. What about in the situation of a pregnancy that had happened from rape, and then, the life of the mother is in danger? Why should she be forced to die for a baby that was forced into her against her will?
You seem very confused! You seem to criticize Fugazi's stand on late term abortion to save a woman's life and then you seem to advocate for late term abortion in case of incest and rape! You are all over the place! Try to stop typing until you put your thought pattern in order! Ritnow yourcomments do not makesense!
20 weeks fetuses do not have the capacity to feel pain, I've already posted the scientific data to show this, they are not sentient, again I have posted the scientific evidence for this, they are not conscience or aware either as I have shown with scientific evidence for this as well. This is why it becomes tiresome to just go over the same ground time after time after time .. but just for you here is the data again. Does a 20 week old fetus feel pain - The biological system necessary to feel pain is present after 26 weeks of pregnancy. Researchers from the University of California, San Francisco in the Journal of the American Medical Association concluded in a meta-analysis of data from dozens of medical reports and studies that fetuses are unlikely to feel pain until the third trimester of pregnancy. There is an emerging consensus among developmental neurobiologists that the establishment of thalamocortical connections (at about 26 weeks) is a critical event with regard to fetal perception of pain, because pain can involve sensory, emotional and cognitive factors. Is a 20 week fetus sentient - For the fetus to be described as sentient, the somatosensory pathways from the periphery to the primary somatosensory region of the cerebral cortex must be established and functional. Fetal behaviour is described and the development of the underlying anatomical substrate and the chemical and electrical pathways involved in the detection, transmission, and perception of somatosensory stimuli are reviewed. It is concluded that the basic neuronal substrate required to transmit somatosensory information develops by mid-gestation (18 to 25 weeks), however, the functional capacity of the neural circuitry is limited by the immaturity of the system. Thus, 18 to 25 weeks is considered the earliest stage at which the lower boundary of sentience could be placed. At this stage of development, however, there is little evidence for the central processing of somatosensory information. Before 30 weeks gestational age, EEG activity is extremely limited and somatosensory evoked potentials are immature, lacking components which correlate with information processing within the cerebral cortex. Thus, 30 weeks is considered a more plausible stage of fetal development at which the lower boundary for sentience could be placed. Is a 20 week fetus conscience & aware - detected in the fetus is the presence of such chemicals as adenosine, pregnanolone, and prostaglandin-D2 in both human and animal fetuses, indicating that the fetus is both sedated and anesthetized in the womb. These chemicals are oxidized with the newborn's first few breaths and washed out of the tissues, allowing consciousness to occur.
Yup, some PEOPLE can't think. They have no idea that abortion has been around since about the time of the first unwanted pregnancy, it's been around whether it was legal or not...Some people can't think so they don't know it will always be around. SOME people can't think so they blabber about murder which abortion isn't and even if it was that won't make any difference, women WILL get abortions. SOME people can't think so they think making abortions illegal will end abortions......that's not just not thinking , that's just plain STUPID.
What don't you mor....'s get? I AM NOT A CATHOLIC. I AM NOT A CATHOLIC. But I admire their work in the pro-life field. It certainly pissed you off. LOL I have no idea what it's like to be Catholic...I am not one. But why are you bringing again religion into this debate? THIS IS HYPOCRISY. I AM PRO-CHOICE. I BELIEVE A WOMAN HAS THE RIGHT TO MAKE DECISIONS ABOUT HER OWN BODY. NO ONE SHOULD TELL HER WHAT SHE CAN AND CAN'T DO LIKE THE PRO-LIFE CROWS. BUT SHE SHOULD NOT BE ALLOWED TO ABORT PAST VIABILITY. This is hypocritical in every way. It is doing to the woman what they say pro-lifers have no right to do. They want abortion legal...but they don't want it legal. She has rights to her body...no she doesn't. Its a human...no its not a human. Viability shouldn't matter....yes it should matter.
Ok I will.... "They have no idea that abortion (rape) has been around since about the time, it's been around whether it was legal or not...so lets decriminalize it, cause it will never stop." Maybe if its made legal...we will have less rape. Maybe if its made legal...we will have less drug usage. Put drugs, child porn in place of abortion....
YOU are PRO-CHOICE!!!!???? Well, ya were once but reading all your anti-Choice posts would lead me to believe you aren't pro-choice now...
Sorry, your morals are screwed if you think abortion compares to rape, child porn or other BAD things.... I never said that if abortion is legal there will be less abortions....are you hallucinating AGAIN!!!
Lies....The jury has not come in on the pain issue. But the thing is you pro-aborts don't care, your willing to do it anyway whether they can feel or not...that is sad. YOU SIMPLY DON'T CARE. Abortion should be legal whether they can feel pain or not...why? Because its the womans body...no one elses business. TO YOU AND YOUR ILK, PAIN IS NOT AN ISSUE...THE CHILD ENDS UP DEAD ANYWAY. You could care less. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ume1mBaqj7E Many states have fetal pain laws...that prevent abortion after 20 weeks because of the pain issue. The laws were passed based on SCIENTIFIC INFORMATION....PRESENTED TO THE COURTS. So don't tell me you have the only scientific information one earth about this. I would post the info I have but it would do not good, you would dismiss it.
Wait! Doesn't that just totally go against the sentience = person BS criteria? LOL--you guys are so dumb. You can't even maintain a simple line of argument without contradicting yourselves. And yet.....you're allowed to live even though you've proved you can't think. Oh the injustice of it all.
"you guys'? I am only one poster...can't you count? And, how cowardly to leave out the entire quote. Here it is again although I really don't expect YOU to understand..: Yup, some PEOPLE can't think. They have no idea that abortion has been around since about the time of the first unwanted pregnancy, it's been around whether it was legal or not...Some people can't think so they don't know it will always be around. SOME people can't think so they blabber about murder which abortion isn't and even if it was that won't make any difference, women WILL get abortions. SOME people can't think so they think making abortions illegal will end abortions......that's not just not thinking , that's just plain STUPID. Do YOU think making abortion illegal will end abortions?
OH HELL NO!!! The criminalization of abortions will not end all abortions. Just because something is illegal, that doesn't mean that people will stop doing it forever.
you do know what a lie is don't you .. it is a deliberate telling of a non truth, you say I lie and then add that there is no actually evidence to say that what I have posted is incorrect, that the jury is still out.. that is not a lie. you should know what a lie is you tell enough of them, like quoting me where there is no quote .. no states of the US prevent abortion, they place restrictions on late term abortions, but they do not prevent them .. another lie by you. Oh please go and take another chill pill will you, your hysterical outbursts are becoming boring .. did you bother to think about the "suspected " pain of your own fetus while you laid down and had it ripped piece by piece from your womb .. nah, because it suited you at the time .. hypocrite.
