Islam v The United States: How To Diffuse a Political Time-Bomb

On second thought... you/I must accept that we are in disagreement. So be it.

Peace.

 

You should have said As-salamu alaykum. LOL

 

QED

...........................

 

the easiest way to defuse a bomb is to get it away from inncent people and blow it the hell up from a safe dstance away.

Remember, there were no 'enemies of America' in the middle east until Israel became your pimp
http://i456.photobucket.com/albums/q...ys/default.jpg

Another clown thinks history began in 1948. Israel is for all practical purposes a buffer state between Europe and the forces of Islam. Were it not there the problems Israel has would be occurring in sunny Spain, itself once an Islamic province. One should understand that 9/11 did ot change the world it merely revealed it for what it has pretty much always been. There are many who wuld like to go back to the Faux reality that existed in the minds of many Americans prior to 9/11 but that is foolishness.

 

Were you under the impression they were not Muslims? They said “it was written in the Koran, (not the pirate handbook) that all Nations who should not have acknowledged their authority were sinners, that it was their right and duty to make war upon whoever they could find and to make Slaves of all they could take as prisoners, and that every Mussulman who should be slain in battle was sure to go to Paradise.”,

 

"We reject all efforts to denigrate the religious beliefs of [those that do not believe in separation of church and state]." (Obama)


I await your diligent support for impeachment:

http://www.politicalforum.com/polit...07377-case-impeachment-obama-article-one.html

http://www.politicalforum.com/polit...3479-its-actually-closer-us-being-idiots.html

 

I can see a ruler in the ME a hundred or so years after Muhammed left the scene, who wanted to invade a neighbor for "x" reason [usually the equivalent of bananas and females], who nudged some key details around in the official Koran with his loyal Imam taking a bribe or two to "make it happen"...sure...that's how our system works here...our very Constitution's 4th Amendment was quietly finally and officially dissolved under Bush/Cheney. What was once the sacred mandate of our founding fathers is now completely changed and "the new religion". They're already showing clips of the faithful fervently promoting that "it's best for our safety"...forgetting that Dubya was good friends with the Bin Laden family and even started an oil business "Arbusto oil" ["Bush" oil en espanol]. Salem Bin Laden, his partner, was Osama's brother....the shady too close for comfort events that led up to the "reason we need to dissolve the 4th"... etc. etc. etc...

The world is far weirder and the villians more tightly connected and chummy beneath the surface than most prefer to think about. It really is like the illuminati. And like them, all rulers through time knew that knowledge is power. So few could read as the Koran, the Torah and the Bible evolved from fallible scribe to fallible scribe, that followers would do well to take a second look at what a quiet mind would discern were "recent additions"....

 

It didn't happen though. Islam started out militant and has only gtten more so with time. Islam never had a reformation. The closest they ever got was a dynastic dispute...

And your picture of how the bible and the torah came to be shows a complet lack of understanding of just how seriously flawed your understanding of how things were done. By the way a computer study of the pentateuch was done not long ago that anlyzed the style and many other key features of the writing in thoise five books the conclusion was that it was something like 95% likely that it was the work of the same man.

 

You have the first few copies of the Koran just after Muhammed died, do you? The time when after a new cult like leader came on the scene, his enemies would most likely be at the zenith of wanting to mess around with his philosophy...

And today's redaction the gays will accomplish soon? That the story of Sodom was not god's mandate to not lie with the same gender, but instead not to lie with just animals? That little twist?

It'll happen. There will be a new Bible drafted and then all it takes is a good PR campaign and maybe just one or two generations. You'd be surprised how quickly the flock will walk away from the old fences to find more enticing pastures... There's more of satan's hand in the bible than god's by now I'll wager.. CS Lewis wrote a book about the clever and subtle redacting of the essence of the faithful.

 

Unfortunately, the koran serves that purpose without nudging any details. Muhammad was a warrior.

 

You get focused upon that; I'll keep my eye on maintaining "Separation of Church and State"; we need that (I don't care who's President or what they say about it... as long as it's in place).

 

The fight was over religious freedom- Thomas Jefferson- and Madison- and myself believe in it.

You don't.

Luckily you didn't write the Constitution- they did- and all of us- including Muslims and Budhists and Baptists all have the freedom to worship as we would like.

 

Or we could go with Obama's actual remarks

Since our founding, the United States has been a nation that respects all faiths. We reject all efforts to denigrate the religious beliefs of others. But there is absolutely no justification to this type of senseless violence. None. The world must stand together to unequivocally reject these brutal acts.

 

Neither does Islamic doctrine, it is antithetical to it.

 

Do you? You are the one claiming the current Koran has been somehow modified from it's original, more benevolent form. Where's your evidence?

 

They didn't have to mess with the Qur'an. That was why they created the Ahadith.

Or they could just widely publicize the opinion of Flavius Josephus that the Sodomites were more evil because they were greed and arrogant capitalist who had no real feeling for anyone else. Rape is even today used as a demonstration of dominance over another person. God did not off them for being queer, but for having the hubris to think they could get away with abusing and debasing His angels when they arrived as guests in the city.

 

Dude islam made it's first splash with a military campaign and the Military conquest Of Mecca and Medina. The next thing they did was a war against the Persians. Followed by a drive by on Jerusalem, and then North Africa. The forces of Islam were continually expanding west and Northwest until the Battle of Tours checked then in Southern France. And the Final Check to Islamic Expansion came in 1683 outside the Gates of Vienna. The first roll back came in Spain when the Spanish kicked out the Moors.

 

Yes, one example of a specific group of unbelievers who broke a treaty.

 

So everyone in Africa and sotheastern europe broke a treaty did they?

 

The Christians had been waging a crusade against Islam before the Muslims invaded North Africa. Most of the countries there were Christian at the time and thus obvious supporters of the Crusades.

South of the Sahara, Islam spread largely by peaceful conversion. Conquered peoples were not even required to adopt Islam in most places, such as Mali.

 

I recall mentioning, the only attacks on Americans before the 70s were the Barbury pirates and they were hardly religious or political in their motives.
You may also recall, I stated the only reason to bring these attacks up was desperation to prove a point because you don't have anything real to use.

Try this - Cite an attack against America between the Barbary pirates and the start of American support for Israel.
It has to be Muslims who did the attacking and not for reasons such as piracy, theft, ransom or other general criminal activity.

Try terrorism for political or religious reasons.

I await a reply but I think you'll either lie or use a criminal attack and claim it was political/religious.

Get your history right. America/Americans were NOT a target of any religious/political violence except where Americans attacked or interfered in local affairs first.

That's what gets me about the Beirut embassy bombing. You guys moan on about it but neglect to mention you entered the war by firing from a warship before it happened.
Your ship and people were not under threat until you entered the combat so it's sort of tough if you take casualties.
You made yourselves into targets because you made yourselves combatants.

 

Just as a nate - America has always attacked first in every conflict since WWII.
At no time has any Muslim attacked the United states, Americans or American property unless you entered either combat or supplied enemy nations.

If you don't believe me - post an example of one.

Don't bother with 9/11. Apart from it being in dispute, reasons of supporting Israel were given for the attack.

 

Balderdash the first crusade was in 1095 AD. And Persia at that time of the Muslim conquest was Largely pagan. The only real christian Empire in the Area Was the Byzantines and they'd been on the Defensive against the Persian for more than a Century. Most of North Africa was conquered before that. Hell the first Self identified Christian Army doesn't show up until the Crusades. Islam started out as an Army. Lefty you need to read a lot less Islamic propaganda and a lot more actual history.

Indo the Facts of 9/11 are in dispute only by people that believe that the impossible might have happened. And You should go back and read Osama full declaration there was a lot more than just Israel which cam so far down the least that it sounds like an oh yeah line.

 

Specific group within the much larger group of idolaters
"[9.5] So when the sacred months have passed away, then slay the idolaters wherever you find them....."

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But one cannot get around what Jefferson heard when he went with John Adams to wait upon Tripoli’s ambassador to London in March 1785. When they inquired by what right the Barbary states preyed upon American shipping, enslaving both crews and passengers, America’s two foremost envoys were informed that “it was written in the Koran, that all Nations who should not have acknowledged their authority were sinners, that it was their right and duty to make war upon whoever they could find and to make Slaves of all they could take as prisoners, and that every Mussulman who should be slain in battle was sure to go to Paradise.”

 

“it was written in the Koran, that all Nations who should not have acknowledged their authority were sinners, that it was their right and duty to make war upon whoever they could find and to make Slaves of all they could take as prisoners, and that every Mussulman who should be slain in battle was sure to go to Paradise.”

Both religious and political.