Looks like the "dreamers" better be packing their bolsas.

Some are, some are not. Racism is a character flaw. Do you have any character flaws?

 

Well, sort of: Illegal presence in the country makes you deportable (an immigration law term), not jail-able (a criminal term). That said, it is violation of our criminal laws to enter illegally:

(a) Improper time or place; avoidance of examination or inspection; misrepresentation and concealment of facts
Any alien who (1) enters or attempts to enter the United States at any time or place other than as designated by immigration officers, or (2) eludes examination or inspection by immigration officers, or (3) attempts to enter or obtains entry to the United States by a willfully false or misleading representation or the willful concealment of a material fact, shall, for the first commission of any such offense, be fined under title 18 or imprisoned not more than 6 months, or both, and, for a subsequent commission of any such offense, be fined under title 18, or imprisoned not more than 2 years, or both.
8 USC 1325

 

that is like the maga wart of character flaws, when they start killing and harming people, it's more then just a character flaw

 

Please cite the post im which I claimed unlawful presence was “jailable.”

 

It was implied because you listed it together with fraud and forgery.

There are also thousands of visa overstays who aren't authorized to be here, and they are subject to deportation after notice of a hearing and appeals, but are they "breaking the law" by being here? I personally wouldn't use the term that way, because they aren't subject to any sanction for just being here; indeed, they are rewarded in the form of food and comfortable shelter, appeals with no court costs, often a free lawyer (by charitable organizations, not by law).plus a free ride home in a large jet airplane.

 

Of course. Illegal aliens - that is, people who are illegally present in the country - should be returned to their country of origin in compliance with the law. I don't see what is so difficult to understand about that.

You are fast and loose with that ad hominem - which is a violation of rules of this board I should remind you. Secondly it only exposes the absolute pathetic weakness of your facile argument. Once again, I challenge you to actually come up with one. Now, please cite even one racist or xenophobic post I have made.

I never said they committed a crime. But some have.

A short list of unlawful activities committed by illegal aliens to enter and remain in the country:

1. They are illegally present in the country - a civil infraction the remedy for which is deportation. They are breaking the law every time they take a breath. If they have been deported once already and return, then their law breaking moves into the criminal realm and they are eligible for a little prison time.
2. If they have a job, they are in violation of federal employment law. Both they and their employer are eligible for stiff fines and prison time.
3. If they used forged documents and/or SSN to obtain a job, they are in serious violation of federal laws - felonies. If they use the SSN if a real person, they are committing identity theft. I can get you a fake SSC and Green Card in about ten minutes in downtown LA.
4. If they drive a motor vehicle without a driver license, they are in violation of many state laws and are eligible for fines and jail time. Some states do issue driver licenses (you can guess which ones), but those licenses are not valid in other states, so if they drive in those states they are also breaking the law.
5. If they unlawfully obtain public benefits such as food stamps, general assistance, housing assistance, etc., they are in violation of federal and state laws and are eligible for fines and prison time.

Ad hominem. Again. Translation: "I have no argument so I'm going to attack your character in a pathetic attempt to weaken your factual, reasoned argument."

I didn't know the New York Times was a white supremacist webpage.

The logical fallacies of this statement are comical. I am actually laughing. There are between 12 - 15 million illegal aliens living and working in this country at any given time. Just their presence alone is a violation of our laws. And many of the things they need to do to live and work here range from state level misdemeanors to federal level felonies. To deny this is merely artless intellectual dishonesty if I'm being generous.

I don't care if you insult me - it is a violation of the rules of this forum and it betrays the abject vacuity and intellectual gibberish that you pretend is an argument. So keep it up.

 

Then you implied it, not me sir. I was quite clear and deliberate in the language I used.

 

Hi Doombug, why do you like kicking people out of the country they were born in because of their ethnic origin?

 

No, Trump will save them with his veto, remember?

Basically, the dems have shifted the dreamers as an issue from them to Trump. He talked about "loving" them so let him put his money where his loving mouth is...all over other women it would seem. But the actual point is the dems just wiggled their way out of a divisive issue. This is rare cunning move on their part.

 

Ethnic origin has nothing to do with it. Stop telling lies.

 

I can't imagine why else you would brand a person raised in America non American

 

DACA recipients were not born here. Please insure you are arguing with facts.

 

They're damn well close to it. Who cares?

 

Who cares? Well we have this thing called the law. So, yeah, we all care.

 

The law is not an ethical argument. The law is often wrong.

 

Well then you can chamge the law through your representatives. But I fail to see what is unethical about a border.

That said, words matter. You lied intentionally to try to bolster your “argument.”

 

The border isn't the subject of argumentation right now. We're talking about whether it's ethical to throw people out of the country they were raised in to a country that they have never lived in because of who their parents are. You say that it is. I say that it isn't.

 

Why did you have to lie to make your “point?” “Born here” is not the same as “damn well close to it.”

Of course this has to do with the border - specifically the laws regarding who may cross it and how.

And this has nothing to do with who their parents are. Rather what their parents did. But you knew that already and will continue to make these disingenuous “arguments” in bad faith to align with your political agenda.

 

I misspoke and it makes no ethical difference.

okay, it's now alright to punish people for the actions of other people. i'm sure that one of your ancestors somewhere down the line was a murderer and i hope you receive a just punishment for that.

i don't care what's legal. i don't care what's illegal. i care what's justifiable.

 

Of course it makes a difference. Born here means citizen. You suggested we’d be deporting citizens - a legal impossibility.

Deportation is not a punishment - it is a civil remedy, and the one our government has prescribed for individuals illegally present. There is no legal jeopardy, no criminal prosecution - just some fingerprints and a bus ticket.

Then you believe in anarchy. Some advice - careful what you wish for.

 

I don't care about citizenship. I care about ethics.

When you lock someone up and then force them somewhere they don't want to be, it sure as ****ing hell isn't a reward and it isn't neutral either.

If you cannot convincingly argue that this course of action is ethically right, then the law is wrong and should be ignored. I don't care about your appeals to legality.

Explain why what you advocate is ethically justified, with no appeals to law or authority. Appeal only to ethics. You will have nothing.

 

Every nation on Earth has a border. They are all unethical?

 

That’s because you generally lack the ability to account for context. You’d have us believe that the Founders believed in some SJW egalitarian society where all races were here, blending into a brown mass of humanity, when they considered blacks to be property at the time. You can take a look at the 1790 naturalization act where they specifically limited citizenship to white people of good character if you want an idea of what they wanted the country to look like. Also keep in mind almost everyone was a Protestant Christian at the time.

I like how you use the “melanin level” talking point straight out of the left’s playbook, as if that’s the only thing that separates races. And no, those “stereotypes” have not been debunked. Quite the opposite. We have real measured IQ and culture differences that can, in part, explain much of what you listed.

Yes, the unfortunate effects of demographic replacement. That doesn’t fit in with the framework of your ideology, though, so you’re not able to discuss it.

 

Yes. Every government is owned by scumsucking bloodthirsty bastards.

 

Ok, you be sure to call us when the shuttle lands.