Mueller-Dämmerung

Discussion in 'United States' started by Striped Horse, Mar 22, 2019.

  1. Injeun

    Injeun Well-Known Member

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    So, the Players of Gotcha, got got.
     
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  2. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I realize that you are in denial and incapable of credible substantiation of your beliefs... which is why you continue to make up falsehoods and not respond to my questions.
     
  3. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    Since I don't indulge in hatred you are going to have to elsewhere for advice on where to invest your own hatred.
     
  4. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    Still can't refrain from projecting your own shortcomings onto others? :eek:

    But that remains your problem, not mine!
     
  5. JakeStarkey

    JakeStarkey Well-Known Member

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    don't matter, injun

    we will see
     
  6. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I keep asking to to state what you are talking about such as

    " How is believing that the Special Prosecutor has "special powers" including the legal ability to violate civil liberties - powers not normally granted - "bovine excrement".

    This the special prosecutor is given these powers is a fact- a fact that is reflected in some of the quotes you gave "


    All you manage to respond with is name calling and other fallacious gibberish.
     
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  7. Plus Ultra

    Plus Ultra Well-Known Member

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    I know lots of Democrats (few Republicans where I live) and all of them believe Hillary lost because Trump made some secret deal with the Russians. There is evidence of Russian meddling (those 13 trolls at that chef's outfit in St. Petersburg) but if Barr is accurately summarizing Mueller's report, there's nothing on Trump and his team arranging for this. Mueller issued 2,800 subpoenas, had 500 hours of interviews with suspects, 19 attorneys (apparently all Democrats) and 40 high-ranking agents (some quite biased like Strzok and his mistress), but they couldn't find that smoking gun.
    Apparently Mueller's report is thurough and comprehensive, it recounts the facts and evidence in support of and against every charge against each person investigated. One of the issues covered is the claim of Trump's obstruction, on which Mueller inexplicably did not offer a conclusion, though it has been highlighted he specifically said his investigation does not exonerate Trump on this charge.
    That "corrupt intent" element is going to be the problem, but Congress doesn't need to establish such an intent in an impeachment proceeding, so I'd expect this is where their investigation will focus. They'll be looking at not just Comey's firing (which has a variety of explanations and not all of them indicating obstruction), but also at countless declarations, statements and tweets from Trump at different junctures of this lengthy ordeal. I'd expect they'll skip the "no collusion" tweets, since evidently this was true, but the lack of any evidence to show collusion will have a significant effect on the claim of obstruction (as noted above). Obstruction of justice is impeding, interfering or influencing (with a corrupt intent), whether this was the case depends on circumstances and context, it works better if one can credibly maintain a suggested wrongful intent in the perpetrator. I think it will be difficult for Congress to credibly maintain Trump's wrongful intent in perceived efforts to impede, interfere and influence an investigation into something that never happened.
     
  8. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    You have NEVER substantiated that bovine excrement allegation of yours because apparently you are incapable of doing so since you appear to be the only one who holds such an absurdly vapid belief!

    But it is not my problem that you are incapable of substantiating something that asinine.

    That you persist with fatuous PROJECTIONS is only downgrading what tattered shreds of your credibility remain.
     
  9. Injeun

    Injeun Well-Known Member

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    I think that rather than seeking ways to bring down the President, leftists should instead seek to understand their unnatural desire to do so. There is more to life than getting Trump. What's important is that our government, our election process, our Constitution and way of life are more or less intact. We remain free and still have our lives, our loved ones, our work, our hobbies, our hopes and dreams, and a horizon as endless with possibilities as it ever was. All is not lost.
     
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  10. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    You are the one that lacks credibility if you think that the special prosecutor is not given special powers - including the power to conduct searches and do wire taps which violates the right to privacy.


    https://www.aclu.org/blog/national-...wiretapping-accusations-heres-what-government

    The claim that Mueller was restrained by the normal rules applied for protection of privacy is simply false.

    One can debate whether or not those powers were justified and legitimate. What is absurd is your claim that Mueller was not given those powers.
     
  11. Hoosier8

    Hoosier8 Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Hard to obstruct an investigation into a crime you did not commit.
     
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  12. navigator2

    navigator2 Banned

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    Thanks for all the entertainment the left has provided about the matter. You've done more than your part! Leftist butthurt is the gift that never stops giving. :banana:
     
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  13. drluggit

    drluggit Well-Known Member

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    Golly... if only liberals would apply all of this effort to actually doing useful things... Dare to dream.... But, as I've always maintained, you can't buy this entertainment on HBO. This is light years ahead of what the entertainment world has decided to offer. I mean, who could possibly come up with crap like ms Streisand who suggested that Michael Jackson should be left alone, because he had his sexual needs...

    And isn't that what is really important to the liberal elite? Knowing that their desires get satisfied.. even at the expense of others or children?

    I recall ms Streisand recounting several threads of hate where Trump is concerned.... If only she cared about the children....
     
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  14. Thought Criminal

    Thought Criminal Well-Known Member Donor

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    LOL!

    You always bring the best absurdities.
     
  15. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    :roflol:

    The FBI does have the power to obtain FISA warrants but Mueller was working under 28 CFR 600.4 which makes no mention of any power to obtain a FISA warrant.

    So yet again you have abjectly FAILED TO PROVE that Mueller violated any civil liberties!

    In effect you are blaming Mueller for things that the FBI does which is disingenuous.
     
  16. Plus Ultra

    Plus Ultra Well-Known Member

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    Due process and the right to be safe from unreasonable search and seizure are civil liberties. Searches of one's dwelling require a warrant, and this must be supported by probable cause. The warrant request is ex parte so equity applies to raise the standard applicable to the request, if Mueller relied on an informant of questionable credibility, coerced any admission, or his investigation relied on work by people like Strzok, I expect there will be strong challenges to admissibility at trial. Violations of civil rights by FBI agents working for Mueller in his investigation are attributable to him. If Strzok swears out a fraudulent affidavit to obtain a warrant and Mueller relies on it knowing of Strzok's bias, Mueller has a problem.
     
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  17. Homer J Thompson

    Homer J Thompson Banned

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    People are losing all faith in the US gov and I am seeing a growing anger. People are so sick and tired of the lawless left that if they are left unchecked to continue this anti-American attack I feel something serious may be coming.
     
  18. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Of course the FBI has the power to obtain FISA warrants. This does not change the fact that Mueller had the power to violate civil liberties - such as the right to privacy .. nor did I blame Mueller for FBI violations.

    You were claiming that Mueller was not given power to violate civil liberty - just as the FBI is giving this power under FISA. This is false.
     
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  19. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    Hypothetical duly noted but no evidence exists to support that at present.
     
  20. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    Assbackwards strawman!

    You are still making an ALLEGATION about Mueller that you have consistently FAILED to substantiate.

    There is NOTHING in the authorization or the relevant SC law that supports your bogus allegation.

    Onus is entirely on YOU to PROVE your allegation with CREDIBLE NONPARTISAN sources that relate SPECIFICALLY to the SC investigation.

    Not my problem that you can't.
     
  21. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Look at you go - a whole lot of name calling - simply because you were wrong. I did prove my claim that Mueller is given special powers which allow him to violate civil liberties - your denial is akin to denying that water is wet.

    Just because you can't deal with this information is no reason to name call.
     
  22. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    :roflol:

    You have CONSISTENTLY FAILED to prove that Mueller was granted any of your imaginary "special powers" and disingenuously DEFLECTED to the powers of the FBI instead.

    Then you resort to wallowing in falsehoods that you can't substantiate either.

    Rinse and repeat!

    :roflol:
     
  23. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Your claim that Mueller was not given power to violate civil liberties - outside of that which is normally allowed - is false.

    You can cry and twirl around in circles and name call and spew falsehoods all you like. That however will not change reality.

    https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/der...-question-are-our-civil-liberties-now-at-risk
     
  24. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHA!

    The 5th Amendment is a PROTECTION of our civil liberties but hardly surprising that BLOTUS supporters have that completely ASSBACKWARDS!

    Furthermore ALL PROSECUTORS have access to a Grand Jury for serious crimes so once again YOU have FAILED miserably to prove your falsehood about Mueller's IMAGINARY "special powers"!
     
  25. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Nice Dodge - Dershowitz gives a list of special powers - things that Mueller can do that are not normally allowed.

    In normal court proceedings you can not round up everyone a person knows and try these people for crimes not related to the what the person on trial is charged with. Nor can the Prosecution ask questions of the witnesses called not relevant to the crime in question.

    https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/...vestigate-evil-is-a-danger-to-civil-liberties

    Your claim that every Prosecutor has the powers of Mueller is patent nonsense on steroids ..
     
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2019

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