North Korea says can test-launch ICBM at any time:

So, we're just going to sit here, watch them develop their nuclear capacity and when crazy Jong decides the time is right he'll launch an unilateral attack against either the U.S or Japan and then bam. I think playing defense here is a terrible option.

 

I will wait and see until they make the test,
I think they will have the means because they milked that cow China,
who stole and hack required technologies, but we'll see.

 

I don't pretend to have an answer; it's a tricky one to be sure, but erring on the side of caution seems the best option right now. I wonder if there's any government, anywhere, which has a viable plan to neutralize North Korea's nuclear capability.
I, like some others, believe that NK will respond to any perceived aggression as an act of war and invade the South. After that all bets are off, but escalation is almost a given.

 

On the diplomatic front, I've come to believe that any success comes through with China. And lately, if reports are true about Trump-Russian influence to the extent of borderline subversion of the US, there can be no peace with Russia but I still want to make overtures to the East. That means a US-Chinese connection. And there are plenty of things to negotiate there, such as our debt situation, trade and how can we better balance it. I'm not as gungho and I'm not coming in with a "hey, listen" attitude, but more of a "let's see what we can do" attitude.

If we do make inroads with China(which I wanted to stretch into possibly resolving the Chinese-Japanese dispute). I could then conceive the notion of strengthening NATO and joining Europeans against Putin's Russia. And I'd love somehow to still have the support of a Marine France, should that happen to be the case. I'd even make it so that it's okay if France merely is neutral with Russia.

 

We can only hope

 

Why would North Korea launch a unilateral attack against us or Japan when we possess nearly a 500 to 1 superiority in deployed warheads?

At best they'd destroy and couple cities and then we would annihilate North Korea entirely.

 

Here's the thing with nuclear warheads: Radiation. Nukes are such a weapon that the supply thereof, doesn't matter. If you're a psychopathic dictator hell bent on killing other people, one nuke is all you need to put our planet in a bad position. Hell, I'll gladly get rid of OUR nukes that's how dangerous they are. We are a malfunction in either ours, or some other government away from being in a total waste dump.

Nukes, not global warming, are the highest present danger to the US and the rest of the world. We can deal with global warming, good luck dealing with isotapes, radiation and plutonium.(See: Fukushima disaster).

 

One nuke will not "put the planet in a bad place". Literally thousands of nukes have been detonated since 1945 and they haven't.

What exactly makes Un "psychopathic"?

 

"Beijing expressed their displeasure of Kim through the publication of a detailed account of Jang’s brutal execution in Wen Wei Po, the Chinese government’s official mouthpiece in Hong Kong, on Dec 12.

According to the report, unlike previous executions of political prisoners which were carried out by firing squads with machine guns, Jang was stripped naked and thrown into a cage, along with his five closest aides. There, the six men were eaten by 120 ravenous hounds who had been starved for three days. The Chinese call it quan jue (犬 决 ): execution by dogs.

Kim Jong Un, along with 300 senior officials, “supervised” the “execution by dogs” which lasted for an hour"

https://cofda.wordpress.com/2014/01...ng-un-had-his-uncle-fed-to-120-ravenous-dogs/


Any more questions?

 

Again, how does that make him psychopathic?

 

Gee I don't know. I do however know my attempt at a rational discussion with you is over.

 

Psychopathic implies his actions are irrational or that he is disconnected from reality. How does that description fit Un?

 

Most normal people don't execute people, much less throwing them to literally be devoured by hounds. That shows his mindset which is not only deprived from reality, but aggressive. Whether the US likes it or not, sooner or later we will have to confront North Korea. I just hope it's not from a NK preemptive strike that we could've long prevented.

 

At worst, its just sadistic or sociopathic. There is no evidence that North Korea would launch a pre-emptive strike.

 

There's also no evidence that they won't. I just find it funny(and incredibly sad) that the U.S went all in on stopping Iran's so-called "program" but when an actual program exists of an antagonizing State, we don't want to do anything.

The rest of the world laughs at poor US leadership, R or D.

 

What exactly do you propose? They have enough artillery pointed at Seoul to kill most of its population. The only recourse you have is an invasion which will demonstrably kill millions.

 

I've no doubt they do. I also have no doubt that it's possible they could very well fire that artillery anyway. I'm convinced that the US could completely cave to NK demands, and a nuke would still be pointing at our island states and the Asian allies. If NK is going to be the aggressor in any case, why not take the initiative and maybe save more lives, then responding from being attacked.

 

NK has for the most part kept to its borders in recent times. Far more so than the United States or China for instance.

Its leaders are keen to preserve their power. They do so by propagandizing into existence a paranoid foreign threat, which to be honest isn't all that paranoid. The only thing holding back the West from an invasion is the mutually assured destruction of South Korea.

Do they want to unite "True Korea"? Sure. But they love Korea, they don't want it turned into a nuclear wasteland. They want to take over the South, not destroy it. Besides, any military acts against the US or those in its sphere of influence (pretty much everywhere on the planet these days) would definitely result in the destruction of the North Korean government. They know this.

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As a nationalist North Korea should give you hope. The global community is not yet violently invading disagreeable yet mostly passive nations which refuse to merge into the global order. Hegemony is not yet complete. One day it will be, and rogue states like North Korea are like little nationalist canaries in the mine that is the planet.

 

Obama just shrugged his shoulders as NK perfected nukes and developed ICBM technology. He was to busy playing golf and bad mouthing cops I guess. China is the key to controlling NK and if Obama had put as much effort into twisting their arm with every resource available to an American president from economic to geopolitical cajoling NK would not be where they are. Obama had other priorities though like global warming and public restrooms.

 

Twist their arm how? Invade?

Most other nations you can pass sanctions against. Sanctions against Russia are trivial because we aren't trading with them much anyway. Sanctions against China would cripple both economies.

Why interfere anyway? Plenty of aggressive nations have nukes. Israel, India, Pakistan (who fight each other btw, kinda dangerous don't you think?).

Nations have a natural right to own nuclear weapons. To suggest that they don't is to bring them under the sovereignty of a larger, hegemonic nation.

North Korea has withdrawn from the NPT, the West has no legal right to harass them over things we do.

Do you want to invade without any reasonable pretext? Fine. But don't pollute that with nonsensical claims to the moral high ground.

 

There's also no evidence North Korea hasn't implanted invisible mind control bugs in the brains of everybody American. Therefore should we spend billions of dollars and cut open every American's head just in case?

We should base our policies on things we actually have evidence for.

 

right, NK already a trouble for us, now you want make a bigger trouble by twisting china arms lol . if china twisting US arms, do you think we cave in. and what your purpose to do, stop import of iphones made in china?

 

We DO have evidence of North Korean aggression, what do you think their propaganda is for? Do you think they're threatening us with nukes as a way to build a friendship? Do you think they're posturing them towards our Japanese allies, for the luls? We had far LESS evidence on Iran, then we do of the North Korean problem. With China supporting NK as a proxy state, if we continue on this path I'll make a prediction:

As Chinese military advances continue and as we continue to hold a "neutral" stance, eventually the anti-US Eastern Axis will gain the confidence in its military arsenal. The US, bogged down by its domestic problems and lack of foresight on geopolitics will be vulnerable to the new AXIS. If the attempt to align with Russia isn't successful the Russian-NK-Chinese front will attempt to overtake the now weakened US.

That would actually be a good thing for me, it'd force Americans to think. We're oblivious to the world, and how the world is moving. Thus why the world order collapsed, and thus why US prestige will collapse next.

 

In related news, the US Navy announced that the payload of one Ohio-class SSBN could sterilize the entire country of North Korea...

 

If you don't think we have the morale high ground over a guy that throws his enemies into dog pits to be eaten alive and if you think someone like that has the right to nukes, this conversation is over. Have a nice day, a nice Trump is president today day.