Old topic- There is no basis for declaring the Biblical God to be "pro-life".

Have you read the Bible?

In Genesis 7:21-23, God drowns the entire population of the earth: men, women, children, fetuses, and animals.

In Exodus 12:29, God slaughters all Egyptian firstborn children and cattle because their king was stubborn.

In Numbers 16:41-49, the Israelites complain that God is killing too many of them. So, God sends a plague that kills 14,000 more of them.

In 1 Samuel 6:19, God kills 50,000 men for peeking into the ark of the covenant.

In Numbers 31:7-18, the Israelites kill all the Midianites except for the virgins, whom they are allowed to rape as spoils of war.

In 2 Kings 2:23-24, some kids tease the prophet Elisha, and God sends bears to dismember them.

 

Why would I try to do that?.....I am not going to assist you in denying your God ordered the killings or did so himself with one "Miracle" or another, it would not change the fact he did so according to the Bible(s) you folks say he wrote.

Simply admit this God thingy apparently kills the creatures it created and loves....and we can get on with this.

 

Wow, the Amalekites. That's a real bunch of winners. Aren't those the guys that used to butcher / dismember those who they defeated and captured? Additionally, they were spared by King Saul of the Israelites. In return, they started a war to try to exterminate the Israelites. How many chances are they supposed to get? I guess that treat others as you would have them treat you thing has some real world practical applications after all.

 

All of those examples are God personally taking away life-not human violence. Two totally seperate things.

 

So He's pro-life, then?

 

Sounds like your god has no respect for life.

 

Bible=God taking human life.
Abortion=human taking human life.

Dont see the similarities.

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God is the creator of life and can take it.

 

That doesn't mean he has any respect for it....which he obviously doesn't..... so why should anyone else?


Besides, your "god" is only real in some people's minds.......not everyone's.

 

Yes, we get that, but how can He be pro-life when He does?

 

Are you seriously comparing God's actions in the bible to a woman aborting an innocent baby because the baby is inconvient?

 

I wouldn't. In real life women have abortions which you know doesn't involve a "baby" innocent or otherwise.............god isn't real life......

 

Absolutely not. I'm comparing His actions to what you say He is (pro-life).

 

God ordered BABIES killed.....not "spared and adopted by the Israelites"...but put to the sword.

Obviously you have no problem with infanticide....not even abortion....if "it's a just war" or "God said it was okay"

 

Boiled down, Sam's simplistic argument is

"It's a evil, evil thing if a woman has an abortion at 3 weeks gestation.....but it's righteous and holy if God orders a 2 year old toddler to be stabbed through the heart. Obviously!"

Again, it's a young man trying to resolve his religious views....with his opposition to abortion (obviously based on his religious views).....when they are CONTRADICTORY.

"God hates abortion"? "But if He orders babies killed it's moral and just."?

Again, we're back to that psychological term......cognitive dissonance.

 

Just because the Israelites did something, it doesnt mean God approved of it. The Bible says King David fought wars for territory and even killed women in war (1st Samuel 27 9), but in the book of Chronicles, God forbids David from building a temple because of all the bloodshed he was involved in.

 

Sam.....GOD ORDERED THE ISRAELITES TO DO IT.....or do you think the Bible was just an excuse the Israelites made up to blame their infanticide on God?

Either way you're in for a nasty choice-

1. The Old Testament is just "made up" stuff from the Hebrews/Israelites, with the writers saying "God said this" to cover their own actions and choices? Which means the Bible is false.

2. You are making a false statement about "God not approving it"

"Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.'---1 Samuel 15:3


Can you think of a 3rd option?

 

You asked for 3 examples of killing that was not in the case of Israelites at war and you were given more than three.

Here are three more:

 

The last three are just prophecies. None of the OT prophets actually did those things.

 

Oh, so if it's "just a prophecy" and "they didn't actually do it"....it's "okay" for God to order genocide?

 

The first quote is a law in Deuteronomy. This is the Command of God to his people given directly by God.

Your desperation to avoid the reality of the Bible is showing.

 

Again, it's cognitive dissonance.....we're presenting Sam with a reality he simply cannot handle...that God, in the Bible, was violent and homicidal and genocidal and even infanticidal.

And NO, it was not all "rules of warfare" or "humans doing things God didn't support" (because clearly we've offered examples where it had nothing to do with war and examples where it was God ORDERING the mass slaughter of people by (typically) the Israelites.

yet Sam has been taught not only is God ALWAYS about "peace and love and mercy"...but that "God hates abortion"....

the same God who ordered the slaughter of EVERY child and baby among the Amalekites, who slaughtered by His own hand the first-born of Egypt, and drowned every child or baby not onboard Noah's Ark.

 

The first quote I gave him is not prophecy,

This is the Law that God gives to the Israelites. It is a command from God directing his people to kill children, babies, and even fetuses as pregnant women are not exempted from this Genocide which God demands.

 

It gets frustrating...the lack of intellectual honesty or even critical thinking....because it always comes around to this form of "apologia" from the "pro-lifers" who are also "Bible-believers"....that being-

"It's morally okay if the Biblical God killed or God ordered to be killed actual born children even babies.....but it's immoral for a woman to choose to terminate a pregnancy at the zygote stage. Because God is good...and those women are evil!"

Simplistic...child-like....utterly asinine and contradictory....but that's what it always comes back to.

 

God didnt order genocide in those propechies. He used different nations to expel Israel from the land-thats not genocide.

 

Youre taking that Bible verse too literally. Theres nothing that directly indicates King Saul actually had his army kill the amalekite babies.