Warren Holds the 'Center'

Discussion in 'Elections & Campaigns' started by Horhey, Jun 13, 2019.

  1. Chuck711

    Chuck711 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2017
    Messages:
    3,761
    Likes Received:
    2,371
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Trump is so much a braggart IF he was worth anything .............. he would take out a NYT ad showing his Tax Returns.

    Obviously Trump is worth a Fraction of what he claims and is embarrassed to be caught in such a Lie !!
     
    AZ. and Derideo_Te like this.
  2. Pollycy

    Pollycy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2008
    Messages:
    29,922
    Likes Received:
    14,183
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    OK, Chuck... you know better than Forbes what Trump is worth...? Forbes puts Trump's worth at $3.1 billion... but you know better than Forbes... right? You must be a brainiac genius who's quite rich in your own right! Good for you -- open another tin of Royal Ossetra caviar, pop the cork on a bottle of 2009 Dom Perignon champagne, and congratulate yourself on how f*cking smart you are.... 8) Yeah... Trump's just a loud-mouthed pauper.... Got it! :nana:
     
  3. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2015
    Messages:
    50,653
    Likes Received:
    41,718
    Trophy Points:
    113
    While you might not realize it the Boomer generation did get a few things right. Where we went wrong was to sell out our souls to corporate America instead of maintaining our principles.

    So yes, the Millennials and Gen Z can rightly point to our failures with justification but they would have it much worse today if we hadn't pushed for the EPA.

    The looming disaster that they face is the national debt burden that was incurred because of GREED and Republican/Libertarian fiscal malfeasance. That GREED is why those generations are struggling to find decent jobs so that they can pay off their massive college loans on top of picking up the tab for the national debt.

    Who would not be disillusioned to graduate only to discover that everything you had been told about working hard to get ahead was nothing but a SCAM perpetuated by the Wall Street Casino Bosses?

    We Boomers allowed ourselves to be DUPED!

    Now we need to help the generations AVOID the MISTAKES that we made.

    That we do by telling them honestly and truthfully about what we did that got us to this point.

    They are still going to have to sort it out and it is better for us to be part of the solution than to use divisive demeaning terminology that will only exacerbate their situation and just make ourselves an ongoing part of the problem.
     
    Mr_Truth and AZ. like this.
  4. Pollycy

    Pollycy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2008
    Messages:
    29,922
    Likes Received:
    14,183
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Each generation has to play the "hand" it was dealt by the generations before, unless they decide to overturn the whole 'apple cart' and start over -- often with terrible results.

    After WWI, the 'new' generation of Russians rejected completely the old imperial, czarist government and launched Communism -- a horrible mistake that devastated or outright murdered millions of its own citizens.

    After WWI, the 'new' generation of Germans rejected completely the attempt at 'democracy' and its inept, corrupt Weimar Republik and launched the Third Reich -- a horrible mistake that devastated or outright murdered millions throughout Europe and beyond.

    After WWI, the 'new' generation of Japanese rejected completely the attempt at Western-style 'democracy' and leveraged Emperor-worship and totalitarian rule by the Samurai militarists to create a new empire in East Asia. It, too, was a horrible mistake that devasted or outright murdered millions throughout that entire region of the world, and left Japan a pile of bombed-out rubble.

    Does that 'excuse' us Boomers (I'm guessing from your comments that you're a Boomer, too) from simply jumping into the post-World War II prosperity with both feet and making the most of our lives? It would be stupid and hypocritical in the extreme to feel 'apologetic' about having risen from personal poverty to retired prosperity and comfort, Te. But it would also be a "cop-out" (remembr that old phrase?) to say that I didn't have the ability to do anything about horrible, stupid blunders like those committed by LBJ, Nixon, Carter, et al.... Were we 'greedy', or did we simply use our intelligence, our energy, and our ambition to get ahead?

    Fast-forward to 2019 (and belately return to the thread topic)... now we have a bunch of liberal Democrat politicians who want to castigate everyone who worked toward their own good fortune and prosperity 'back in the day', and instead, promise loads of "free stuff" to two newer generations of people who -- for whatever reason -- just can't seem to make it on their own. So, a radical shift to some kind of shape-shifted, 'morphed' Socialism, with "Universal Basic Income", White 'guilt', 'reparations' for the CIVIL WAR, and obvious intent to mangle the Constitution of the United States, along with other horrible ideas, rears its dangerous, irresponsible head.

    I agree that we Boomers should have done 'more' to assuage both the global and domestic situations -- including sacking the whole 'central bank' concept and completely re-writing the U. S. Tax Code to make it FAIR for the first time! But here we are....

    And as I said, THIS time, in the 21st-century, we don't enjoy a power vacuum any more. No! The Russians and the Chinese are rapidly working together to create what amounts to a 'Sino-Russian' sphere of commanding influence that will take over the entire Eastern Hemisphere... and then, from that position of dominance, project power into South America, too.

    It's all over for us, Te -- you and me. We Boomers are "over-with", and besides, neither the Millennials nor the Gen Z'ers want to listen to anything we have to say anyway! But if they throw out "the baby with the bath water" in 2020 and rush like lemmings toward the lure of socialistic "free stuff", they'll only hasten the time when they'll have NOTHING, and the Sino-Russian alliance will essentially dictate the conditions of what's left of their lives to them! You and I will be gone, and they'll be the ones who suffer... and, no, there won't be piles of "free stuff" to 'make them feel better about themselves'....

    [​IMG]."Krushchev was wrong... the Americans are burying THEMSELVES!"
     
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2019
  5. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2015
    Messages:
    50,653
    Likes Received:
    41,718
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Believe it or not, Cy, but we Boomers had "free stuff" too. Probably way more than we deserved when it comes down to hard numbers.

    We have been living on $TRILLIONS of "free money" that we have "borrowed" from our kids and grandkids and we have NO INTENTION of ever repaying that DEBT that we OWE to them.

    We have been POLLUTING the environment and NOT paying for cleaning it up which is even MORE "free stuff" that we have abused for our own benefit and the detriment of those who will inherit our DEBTS.

    Those two items alone are worth way more than any paltry amounts of "free stuff" that you are complaining about the Millennials and Gen Z NEEDING in order to get on with their lives.
     
    Mr_Truth and AZ. like this.
  6. Pollycy

    Pollycy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2008
    Messages:
    29,922
    Likes Received:
    14,183
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Starting in the 70's, we Americans started cleaning up our rivers, lakes, and shorelines, and we made huge progress in eliminating air pollution from our skies. Did the rest of the world? Still, I would advocate paying even higher taxes to clean up the square miles of toxic crap that pollutes the oceans of the world. THAT is the kind of "difference" that we Boomers inaugurated, Te, and there's nothing to be ashamed of in doing THAT.

    But, I disagree flatly about our generation getting "free stuff", and considering that you are a Boomer, too, how could you even think that?! Yes, obviously, some of us came from dirt-poor families (I raise my hand), and some of us came from wealthy ones. Mostly, we emerged from the American middle-class to make our way as young adults -- and NOBODY was proposing to give us FREE COLLEGE, Te. Some of us had families that could pay for our college tuition and expenses, many of us had to work our way through (I raise my hand), and a lot of us simply bypassed college altogether and made good careers out of doing practical things like welding, construction, and thousands of different jobs in the 'trades'. But who among us "borrowed" money from "our kids"...?

    It is true that our debt-to-GDP ratio has grown to monstrous proportions, and that is one gnawing disadvantage that neither Russia nor China has! The 'tipping-point' has been identified as roughly 77% as a recipe for eventual economic disaster....

    Current Dept-to-GDP ratios:
    United States -- 109.5%
    Russian Federation -- 19.5%
    China -- 54.5%

    What's the answer to our American problem? You know some of my suggestions, which include a top-to-bottom re-writing of the U. S. Tax Code to eliminate all the provisions that enable some to pay little or NOTHING in taxes to our government. But a large part of what we need to do is the exact OPPOSITE of what so many Democrats advocate (including Andrew Yang) -- we need to cut out nearly ALL the "free stuff" that's been used to corrupt two generations of younger Americans, and above all -- DON'T ADD ANY MORE "FREE STUFF" to that which is already being pissed-away in tidal waves of welfare, 'subsidies', and other government give-aways.

    When American WAS 'great', Te, each of us got what we worked for, and what we EARNED. If we returned to that simple, durable principle of FAIRNESS, it would be the single greatest step we could take today. But instead, we've got liberal Democrats running around in circles, trying to out-do each other in pandering to two listless American generations of younger people with litanies of "free stuff". This WILL end badly, Te, and our opponents throughout the world can't wait for us to finish falling on our faces as a direct result of our own ongoing, political 'civil war'!
     
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2019
  7. XploreR

    XploreR Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2014
    Messages:
    7,785
    Likes Received:
    2,704
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Listen to the two upcoming debates on June 26 & 27. :)
     
    Derideo_Te likes this.
  8. XploreR

    XploreR Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2014
    Messages:
    7,785
    Likes Received:
    2,704
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I have never found a political candidate for any office I could say I agreed with EVERYTHING they proposed. It's true this election year too. My concerns about Trump are too numerous to detail here, but revolve around what I perceive as his ineptitude & inability to separate his super sensitive ego from his job. Every decision he makes he makes on the basis of how it impacts him personally, rather than whether it's good for the nation. I'm convinced Trump has serious mental issues, that could endanger this nation. There are Democratic candidates I feel less comfortable than others, but I'm convinced any of them would be a huge improvement over Trump.
     
    Derideo_Te likes this.
  9. Hoosier8

    Hoosier8 Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2012
    Messages:
    107,541
    Likes Received:
    34,489
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Free stuff is always popular.
     
    Pollycy likes this.
  10. XploreR

    XploreR Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2014
    Messages:
    7,785
    Likes Received:
    2,704
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I actually DO think she'll try her best to follow thru on many of the plans she's presenting to the American voters. Of course, she'll have to deal with a Congress, whose composition is currently unknown, & that could make or break her plans.
     
    Derideo_Te likes this.
  11. XploreR

    XploreR Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2014
    Messages:
    7,785
    Likes Received:
    2,704
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Typical conservative ill-informed response. The average American worker has worked hard for at least three decades with no real increase in pay. We're not talking about getting something free. These people worked for it, but were refused their portion of the benefits of their own labor. Instead, the wealthy owners & CEOs took all the profits & left the workers out. There's abuse present here in this story, but it isn't the workers doing the abuse. This needs fixing. I'll support any politicians promising to fix this problem now. It's time for the workers to benefit for a change.
     
    AZ. and Derideo_Te like this.
  12. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2015
    Messages:
    50,653
    Likes Received:
    41,718
    Trophy Points:
    113
    :applause:
     
    Mr_Truth likes this.
  13. Hoosier8

    Hoosier8 Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2012
    Messages:
    107,541
    Likes Received:
    34,489
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Warren is promising free stuff. Free stuff is popular even if it comes off the backs of those workers, which it will.
     
  14. Pollycy

    Pollycy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2008
    Messages:
    29,922
    Likes Received:
    14,183
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Yes, and that's why Democrats put "FREE STUFF" and the heart of everything they promise voters -- because they learned way back in the 1930's that even the worthless, useless dregs of this country still have the right to cast votes, even if they're taking handout welfare and 'subsidies' of every kind imaginable....

    [​IMG] . FDR -- the great hyperliberal demigod mastermind of "free stuff"....
     
  15. Andrew Jackson

    Andrew Jackson Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2016
    Messages:
    48,864
    Likes Received:
    32,588
    Trophy Points:
    113
    So? Let me get this straight:

    Your essential point is that Democratic Voters are "worthless, useless dregs"?:smh:

    That appears to be rather insulting to Democratic Voters (in general) and to your fellow PF Members (who happen to vote Democratic) in particular.

    Is it even possible for you to express an opinion without such a blatant Group Insult?

    if you could actually express yourself without resorting to Group Insults, people might actually be able to take your attempts at "content" seriously.

    Nothing personal, of course. Just some friendly advice.

    Carry on.:salute:
     
    XploreR likes this.
  16. Pollycy

    Pollycy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2008
    Messages:
    29,922
    Likes Received:
    14,183
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    If you go back and read what I ACTUALLY WROTE, you'll understand that I referred only to "worthless, useless dregs" as WORTHLESS, USELESS DREGS! No more, and no less. They know who they are, and so do the rest of us. And they don't care, as long as the unearned handouts continue!

    The ploy that sickens me is that the Democrat Party has leveraged handout welfare and other 'free stuff' and used it to pander the "dreg" segment of American society for their VOTES ever since the time of Frankie Roosevelt, way back in the 1930's! That, and only that, was the segment I described, but you wouldn't realize that unless you read what I actually WROTE.

    Think about it for a minute... who in his right mind would ever vote for a Democrat if it weren't for the background premise that Democrats are the font of all UNEARNED income, welfare, and 'free stuff'... and that pandering for votes with leveraged-welfare is part of the Democrat Party's own DNA, going back over 80 years!
     
    Last edited: Jun 18, 2019
  17. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2010
    Messages:
    154,925
    Likes Received:
    39,397
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    I'm middle and working class, what is she going to do for me, what have I been left out of? I did quite well in America's economic growth the past 4 decades in spite of what the Democrats did to it.
     
  18. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2010
    Messages:
    154,925
    Likes Received:
    39,397
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Yes they want them to feel like they cannot get anywhere on their own and must be wards of the government and think the Democrats will take care of them.
     
  19. Pollycy

    Pollycy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2008
    Messages:
    29,922
    Likes Received:
    14,183
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    You did well?
    You're White?
    You're male?
    You're middle-class?

    Then YOU are guilty of all the political crimes as determined by radical Democrats. YOU are supposed to simply keep your White mouth shut, pay taxes... pay fees, pay MORE taxes... and expect nothing from the government but unending condemnation!

    YOU must stand mute while the government shovels out welfare, subsidies, and, REPARATIONS to people you never did any wrong to. You're White, you're male, and you're middle-class. You're GUILTY! :frustrated:
     
  20. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2010
    Messages:
    154,925
    Likes Received:
    39,397
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    How he demonstrated yesterday how the segregationist found their home in the Democrat party.........................
     
  21. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2010
    Messages:
    154,925
    Likes Received:
    39,397
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Yea how unfair that I saved and invested all my life and have a nice nest egg to retire on when the guy across the street blew his money and never saved and his nothing so equalize wealth, tax my income and give it to him.
     
    Pollycy likes this.
  22. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2010
    Messages:
    154,925
    Likes Received:
    39,397
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Bill Clinton had been a governor and a keynote speaker at two conventions. He was being groomed for it.
     
  23. fmw

    fmw Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2009
    Messages:
    38,803
    Likes Received:
    14,921
    Trophy Points:
    113
    But what about all those people who disagree with you? Do you care about them as well?
     
  24. Spim

    Spim Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2016
    Messages:
    7,664
    Likes Received:
    6,184
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I honestly think that there is still some serious internal issues on the dem side between the progressives and the rest of the party. In the end I believe they will join forces with no matter who wins the nomination, most hardcore dem's that I know personally have admitted that. But then again I only know a few hardcore dem's personally and fewer that I can have an honest discussion with because they are so angry they become unreasonable. The vast majority that I know are independents even if they register one way or another (due to closed primaries)

    Way back when (Reagan) when I first registered I signed up as an independent and was shocked when they turned me away in the primaries (I seriously said WTF to the volunteer) so I re-registered for gop so I could at least participate in the future. I've voted for both sides because the candidate was more important than the letter after their name to me.

    This is a serious concern for me, there are multiple candidates who's vision is not what I'd consider sanity but maybe some of their idea's will be watered down once elected to get the support they need to pass legislation.
     
    XploreR likes this.
  25. Pollycy

    Pollycy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2008
    Messages:
    29,922
    Likes Received:
    14,183
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    If Andrew Yang would disvow and 'uncouple' himself from all this socialistic nonsense about "Universal Basic Income", he would a lot more interesting to those of us who understand basic economics.

    Hint: if the government dictated some kind of "universial basic income" it would cause inflation in this country to EXPLODE into the stratosphere, Te. You're an old guy like me... right? You remember the horror and financial misery of STAGFLATION in the 1970's... right? Now, imagine something even far worse than that! That is what the creation of some "universal basic income" would cause!

    But, if Yang drops this government-dictated income thing, how can he even hope to run for anything in a radical Democrat Party? The only thing they have is the ever-present promise of "free stuff" to offer voters -- and with the exception of a very brief time when President John F. Kennedy was with us, that's all that Democrats have ever really had to run on.

    What do you think President Kennedy would think about "free stuff", or, "universal basic income"...? Remember what his famous statement about this kind of thing was?

    [​IMG]
     

Share This Page