Why should people be forced to get the vaccine in order to protect others who choose not to get it?

The CDC gets a lot of oversight. They can't pull off anything of any magnitude at all, nor do they have ANY reason to do so.

However, YOU want me to believe YOU!! LOL!

 

Yea, but the problem is that main stream media repeats and auguments their nonsense.
Also the government imposes totalitarian regime based on CDC claims.

 

There is nothing "totalitarian" about requiring people to behave such that they don't cause serious impact on others around them.

As for your broad based claims of "nonsense" in reporting, I'd tend to agree. It doesn't take much looking to find people making false claims about COVID. For instance, there is a whole anti-vax army out there propagating absolute nonsense that is damaging our population - and not just on COVID. They're causing measles outbreaks and other direct harm, including on children.

 

I see why you didn’t want to post a link. The CDC quote you provided is a little behind the times. Here it is if anyone wants to read the whole thing.

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/science/science-briefs/fully-vaccinated-people.html

You left out some pertinent quotes from the CDC opinion piece. Here’s one.

Also, in the nuts and bolts section that presents some of the evidence they base their opinion on, they quote a study from Qatar as I have done. You know, the one you don’t like because it’s current. Their study was published in May of 2021. Here it is.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8117967/

Here is the data from this study the CDC used to form their opinion as quoted by the CDC.

But, the CDC doesn’t tell you this was data gathered before May 2021–before efficacy began to wane. The reality today is different! In Qatar today:

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2114114

So essentially the CDC is presenting evidence from Qatar right after vaccination. Actually it’s been 5 months or more since that data was relevant. Currently the actual efficacy against infection is only about 20% as my link (from current data) shows.

This is why the CDC is a very poor source of information. They use 6 month old data to make the gullible believe the efficacy of their vaccine they received 6 or more months ago is still preventing them from infecting others when it really isn’t. As I always say, appealing to the authority of those who don’t base their advice on actual evidence can kill you—or someone you care about. Because after 5 months the vaccinated are spreading Covid at about the same rates as the unvaccinated.

Has vaccination prevented serious illness? Yep. Is it preventing transmission? Not much.

 

Neither I nor the CDC has claimed that the vaccines we have are perfect in ANY WAY.

So, I really don't get your point here.

Everybody knows that immunity, natural or artificially created, decreases over time.

The reason for time delays in responses to studies is that, unlike you, actual scientists have to have time to evaluate studies such as this. And, there are many such studies.

Remember that it took 9 months to run the three phases of vaccine testing that were required to be complete before Pfizer got its EUA.

That does NOT make CDC a "poor source of information". It makes CDC a poor choice of breaking news that has not yet received serious review.

Beyond that, your post and ALL your posts do NOT comport with the finding you cite, which states:

And, that DOES comport with the move in the US to give another round of vaccines on or about the 6th month point.

Finally, I don't see any evaluation of the methodology of the Qatar study. So, I guess for now we just assume their methodology was good enough. And, given that the results match what the CDC has found, I'd guess that is probably true.

 

Nobody is claiming the CDC is claiming the vaccines are perfect in any way. The point is they are supposed to base their recommendations on pertinent evidence. Not evidence we KNOW is outdated. You believe transmission is being reduced by vaccination when it isn’t. That’s the point.

But most people still believe vaccine induced immunity lasts longer than natural immunity when in fact it lasts a shorter period of time. And people are completely unaware transmission rates are virtually identical in populations who were vaccinated 5 or more months ago.

LOL. Who is doing the studies? Who is publishing them? Who is peer reviewing them? The studies I link to are almost always reviewed—so have THE EXACT SAME “EVALUATION” as the 6 month old ones the CDC uses here. They have all had the same scrutiny. Yes, I agree. There are many studies that conflict with what the CDC is reporting.

How is that relevant?

Show me the serious review the study from May has received that the one I posted from September hasn’t. Go ahead.

LOL. In the last post I said this.

You crack me up.

Someday before you get too excited about a Covid shot every 6 months do some research on what annual influenza shots do to your immune system. Every influenza shot you get decreases the efficacy of your next one. While we can’t say this will happen with Covid there is no evidence it won’t either.

LOL. Which Qatar study? The peer reviewed one from May that showed a 75-90 efficacy right after vaccination or the peer reviewed one from September that shows 20% efficacy after 5 months? Both studies methodologies have been evaluated.

 

I don't see where the second Qatar test compares natural immunity to vaccine induced immunity. Yet, you keep making claims on that topic. Why?

And, the Qatar data does not claim that the vaccines we have are ineffective. It claims (as does the CDC, FDA, NAIAD, WHO and everyone else) that the effectiveness of immunization decreases over time at the same rate that these other organizations have stated.

That's why the FDA is recommending a booster.

It's also why the FDA is not rescinding recommendations on masks and social distancing.

I have not had COVID. I was initially vaccinated at about March. I got a booster in September.

Are you suggesting I or anyone around me would have been better off if I had NOT been vaccinated?

 

That is exactly what totalitarian state is.
Government invents new rules every day without even looking whether those rules and laws really help to prevent anything.
The system of checks and balances is not working, so the US become a totalitarian society.
Government create laws for their convenience to manage their people (slaves).

Do you understand that those laws and rules are going to be permanent, regardless of any viruses.

 

I make that claim because we have a lot of evidence to support that claim. It isn’t in the Qatar study because that wasn’t the what the Qatar study was designed to explore.

Studies designed to explore the differences between natural and vaccine induced immunity are like this one.
https://www.rockefeller.edu/news/30...fferences-in-covid-antibody-responses-emerge/

Also antibody levels decrease more slowly after natural infection than vaccination.
https://journals.asm.org/doi/10.1128/Spectrum.00087-21

Contrast with this study of vaccine induced immunity.
https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2114583

And

Not exactly what you are hearing from the CDC, is it?

The CDC is still reporting data on efficacy from May. It is now almost November and we have piles of evidence just like I’ve presented showing these vaccines are incapable of having a substantial negative effect on transmission—because they aren’t preventing infections nearly to the level claimed by US bureaucracies. YOU just provided a CDC quote from a source you wouldn’t link to claiming transmission is being slowed substantially by vaccination. That simply isn’t true because the data they use to form that opinion is either 6 months old or incomplete because it doesn’t account for asymptomatic infections in vaccinated individuals.

Of course. What option is there? It would be better in the long run for vaccinated people to acquire hybrid immunity (and that’s what will happen eventually no matter how many boosters you get) but just like influenza vaccination it’s always a Ponzi scheme. We have to administer more total vaccinations as time progresses to keep the reported efficacy high enough to justify more vaccination.

Too bad they won’t recommend masks that actually work well. I have been consistently telling people if they don’t want Covid not to rely on the vaccine to prevent it. The vaccines can’t. If you want to avoid Covid you have to take other actions as well.

How do you know you haven’t had Covid? Are you doing specific antibody tests to find out or just assuming?

Did I ever say anything remotely like that? No. I’m simply pointing out what you get from the CDC is not accurate or up to date. And believing vaccines are still 80-90% effective at preventing infection as they claimed in YOUR source is liable to get more people killed. Honesty saves lives. The garbage advice not based on evidence from places like the CDC has killed enough. I want people to have BETTER information and advice than you get from the CDC etc. That’s why I’m here.

 

.

 

Was it 10,000 deaths in August / September or 100,000?

 

It was about 100,000 which was similar number to the previous COVID spikes.

 

So you are just blindly accepting what the CDC says. How sensible!

 

My "side?"

 

Are you suggesting that everyone in the country has been infected?

 

How do we know that the US doesn't do that?

 

Exposed. Those of us with natural immunity can take point blank coughs from the Covid positives and never even get a fever....

 

Natural immunity meaning prior infection?

 

Define "infection."

If I took 50+ point blank coughs from someone who tested positive the next day, and I never developed symptoms, did I have an "infection" or was I NATURALLY IMMUNE and hence just exposed but not infected?

 

How could someone be naturally immune to a virus without a prior symptomatic/asymptomatic infection?

 

Lmfao

Covid 19 was not the first corona virus..... Not close....

 

Sure, but what evidence is there that infection from other corona-viruses provides immunity to SARS-COV-2?

 

As EMH notes, humans have been living with corona virus and thousands of other virus for as long as we've been on this planet.

Those with strong immune systems are often able to defeat the virus on their own.

No, A. Fauci would never admit that fact on TV. Neither would Lester Holt or David Muir, 2 guardians of the official narrative.

 

Me and millions of others exposed but never infected...

 

Symptomatically infected?