Opinion: What to do with Dreamers?

OK .. here is my response to that (it is posted somewhere earlier in this tread as well).

Aside from the moral issues. I also have a problem with using the term "illegal" as this implies that these kids have done something illegal which is false. They havn't. To say someone has done something illegal suggests that they have committed a crime.

The rules of our justice system state that in order for someone to be guilt of a criminal act the prosecution has to prove 2 things .. Actus Rea and Mens Rea.

1) Actus Rea means the person has to have done the act (committed the crime). While the parent of the baby committed a crime ... the baby did not
2) Mens Rea means that the person has to have "intended it" This is why criminal insanity is used as a defense - how can you prove that an insane person intended something. Obviously the baby did not intend.

So on this basis ... Not Guilty, you can not even prove one never mind both.

The second area is the Rule of Law (one person is not to be punished for the actions of another). Punishing a baby for the crimes of their parents is then a violation of the Rule of Law.

Sure one can say (but they are not here legally) This does not mean that they have done something illegal such that they can be termed "illegal". These kids are in a bit of a legal grey area.

On the one side is rational thought (the two areas of argument above), morality, human decency and so on. On the other side you have "but they are not here legally" and that's it.

All the "choose which laws to enforce" and other such nonsense is based on the idea that some baby has done something illegal which is a false premise.

Law - by definition, means punishing someone for committing a crime. As per above the kid has committed no crime as per the rules of our Justice system. If no crime is committed one can not use "LAW" as justification for punishment. This is not my opinion... it is how our system works.

We are legal limbo land. As such the Gov't then has to turn to "we the people/consent of the Governed" in order for their actions to be legitimate.

Show me that a majority believes in deportation and then you can claim that kicking these kids out of the country is a legitimate act.

 

Doxing is being done by an underground army of computer hackers and geeks who scour the internet for uploaded pictures, videos, and social media posts. From the evidence they gather, they can expose the true identity and proclivities of an individual. Example, the college professor who became an antifa bike lock attacker was identified by doxing - and convicted. Sometimes normal people act abnormally when they think no one is looking. The marchers waving Mexican flags and throwing bottles of urine should be doxed and denied citizenship - ever.

As for feeling "sorry" for them: they are in an awkward place. America did not put them there. Their criminal parents put them there. Legally, they should get to the end of the immigration line. If Chucky keeps it up, that is all they'll get.

 

Are you suggesting that the government should employ the services of this underground army of computer hackers and geeks to help to vet dreamers?

So do you know if child arrivals who are now 36-100 years of age will be subject to deportation?

 

Liberals act like the idiots - not conservatives. California is the living example of Idiocracy come true. Junk heads and taped together infrastructure.

As for DACA. No one knows how many there will really be. Since you can't adhere to the existing law, how can you adhere to limiting it to the registrants. Those who didn't register will be crying it is unfair to them. Then we'll have to consider all the kids who were trafficked over the border without parents and are now supported in the foster system by tax money. The line of people with excuses is never-ending. We are in this place because we did not enforce the laws to begin with.

 

I don't care about your opinion.

What to do about "dreamers? Kick them back to mexico where they belong, just like any other illegal.

 

E-Verify has to be a strictly enforced law. I think we all know why it isn't being enforced.

 

Yes, I would like the feds to dox the potential dreamers. If anyone gets special privileges, they should at least prove they LOVE this country. Immigrants do it by respecting our laws and standing in line. How are Dreamers showing it? Is seems they are here by mistake.

I don't really care who gets deported.
They made their own beds.

 

Why amnesty? Green card instead. Plenty of Canadians here forever on them.

It is a slap in the face of the green card holders that have been here longer and still can’t get citizenship and I am talking about Canadians of all people.

 

Just a note - studies show second generation illegals (Dreamers) tend to produce a net positive to the country's economy (they usually have the advantage of an education and are English speaking). A fact which helps counteract the costs of the first generation.
Not saying it solves a problem - just pointing out a fact that should be considered when making a decision.

 

Actually - that's the whole point when considering the Dreamers - they didn't make their own bed.

 

Don't they belong to Mexico?

 

You were advertising yourself to be a christian, right?

 

Many El Salvadoran dreamers belong to MS-13

Many Mexican dreamers belong to 18th Street Gang.

 

What does Christianity have to do with what country someone belongs to?

 

To be fair, they're not citizens's and don't have any unpaid taxes. What I'd like to address, is the fines which the piece of sh*t business owners have not paid, for hiring essentially slave labour.

 

I don't. Why is it?

 

I wasn't asking who you care about getting deported, I was asking if you know whether people who arrived in the US as kids but are now older than 36 are included in DACA.

 

Come back and argue after our legal system starts charging children with what their parents did.

 

His child was a citizen. He wasn't. I'm glad it worked out for him.

That isn't the issue. Anyone who breaks the law - citizen or otherwise - should face the legal system if they commit a crime.

 

What does being literate in English prove? We have a president who isn't literate in English. Can we ship him off too?

 

Their stay here is, at best, stolen property. No, they didn't steal it, but it is the fruit of a crime. When you receive stole property, you lose that property when it is discovered, even if you paid for it.

Let me write here that I would do exactly what they are doing. If I was born there, I would bring my children here even if it was illegal, but then again, I pick and choose which laws I obey.

 

They aren't children, it's just another reconquista lie.

Only .05% of the illegal alien dreamers are children.

The other 99.5% are basically adults as old as 36 years of age.

 

We have something in common.

 

Hear here. Moral impunity is not legal immunity. On the other hand, we each have a moral responsibility to pick and choose which laws we obey balanced by a practical responsibility to get away with it.