California movement to secede from US cleared to gather signatures

Can you cite the language in the constitution saying the states can just declare independence unilaterally?

 

So you agree with me that there is no language in the constitution that prohibits any of the sovereign countries that entered into it from abandoning it. Thanks.

 

cite the section of the Constitution that refers to the States as "countries".

 

A sovereign country can leave any treaty it chooses, unless it has agreed to a treaty with language in it that specifically prevents such abandonment.

 

You don't know what a state is?

 

The Constitution lists two seperate and unequal entities: nations and states.

 

And the Constitution lays out how a state goes about adjusting its borders.

 

A state in the union. Does not apply to Canada or France or any state that has left the union.

 

Given the realities of today, primarily our debt, dissolution of the union may be more likely than unilateral secession.

The USA dissolves, New smaller entities arise, the former USA's debt is renegotiated with each entity taking part, everybody takes a haircut on the debt they hold and security agreements are forged among the new entities (countries). Along with that, federal assets are split among the new countries.

Or, we could go on as we have until interest payments alone on our debt bring about our downfall.

 

States are not Nations. Two seperate entities.

 

10th amendment should cover that.

 

So you'd prefer I refer to the various countries in the union as states rather than countries. Okay. Same difference.

 

Are you unaware the France is a sovereign state just as Pennsylvania is?

 

it doesnt.

The Constitution says how territories may join the USA and how parts of States may become seperate states.

No mention of how States can secede.

SCOTUS determined that States can only secede by the same way states may break into seperate states, and that is by the consent of the other States and Congress.

 

The 10th says anything not explicitly placed ndr the Feds is handled by the states. It has nothing to do with joining or leaving the US.

 

There's nothing in the constitution that says states can't leave the union.

 

Pennsylvania is not a soverign state.

it has no supreme executive, it cannot coin money, regulate trade between itself and its neighbors, pass its own immigration laws, null & void the rights of other States, null & void the laws of the Federal govt.

 

As a successionlist I wish it was as simple as "I'm out!" That's just not how it works.

 

Nothing in the Constitution says they can leave, either.

 

???? How would that not include the power to end their association with the US? It clearly is not a power delegated to the federal government nor is is prohibited to the states.

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people.

 

No state could unilaterally join the Union, its fair to assume no State can unilaterally LEAVE the Union.

 

How does not being part of the federation = managing the federation?

Put another way, what does the UK's MP's responsibilities in the European Parliament have to do with Brexit? You're confusing managerial and organizational issues.

 

Constitution says the only way a territory can join the Union is if Congress says "ok".

 

Yeah, Pennsylvania IS a sovereign state, based on the Treaty of Paris:

"His Brittanic Majesty acknowledges the said United States, viz., New Hampshire, Massachusetts Bay, Rhode Island and Providence Plantations, Connecticut, New York, New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Maryland, Virginia, North Carolina, South Carolina and Georgia, to be free sovereign and independent states, that he treats with them as such, and for himself, his heirs, and successors, relinquishes all claims to the government, propriety, and territorial rights of the same and every part thereof."

 

That ended with the AoC.