FAA In The Hot Seat Over Boeing 737 Max Certification

(CNN)Federal regulators head to Capitol Hill Wednesday following weeks of revelations about problems with the fatally flawed Boeing 737 Max, and as the world awaits a software fix and revised training program from the aircraft's manufacturer.

The Federal Aviation Administration's current acting administrator, Daniel Elwell, is expected to face questions from lawmakers about how the Max was certified, and what steps will be taken to assure a skittish flying public that the aircraft can safely return to the skies.


https://edition.cnn.com/2019/05/15/politics/faa-boeing-737/index.html?

 

Still waiting for a fix eliminates the claim the shutdown had an effect. Not testing a new system for possible failure, if not fake news CNN, silly stupid, especially if they offered an optional indicator to say there was a discrepancy.

 

This thread is about the FAA relinquishing it's responsibility to Boeing. Any system will fail given enough time. The question is how many times should the new system have been tested before Boeing's FAA designates certified the aircraft airworthy?

 

Six ways from Sunday. And not wanting to kill a rookie test crew, simulated if at all possible with random pilots who know nothing about the system. Thing is, if you know what you are testing you know more about how to react. Like you say, things fail, so every possible failure has to be tested.

As for regulations, this is perfect case for why we need them. Need them to work that is.

 

I think the problem is much worse. Sure systems fail but the reason for the system in the first place was the stalling tendencies due to the larger engines on the MAX. Who wants to fly on a jet that is so much more likely to stall that the mfr had to install an automated system?

 

Who wants to ride in an automated car or be in traffic with one, or be riding a bike...? All kinds of automation is coming, the point is to test and regulate properly.

 

The point was the unstable design not the automation. Hell, pilots make use of all kinds of automation during a normal flight. Sorry if that wasn't clear.

 

dup

 

We covered all that in the other topic by the same topic starter, in the forum above this one latest us & world news.

 

I didn't see it. Anyway, it IS the salient point so not sure what you are going on about.

 

As fuel is burned the Center of Gravity changes on all aircraft. Elevator trimming is used to keep the aircraft flying level. As a C130 loadmaster I can tell you a fully loaded C130 to include fuel starts off with a CG aft of the wings. You can visually see this by looking at the nose gear. More wheel is visible at takeoff which means the aircraft is tail heavy. So pilots compensate for this tail heavy condition by manually trimming the aircraft. Having a system that does this automatically allows pilots to focus on other things. The bug will be fixed and the Boeing 737 Max will become a safe workhorse for the airlines. The 737 Max is not the first aircraft with a new system that needed the bugs worked out of it.

 

So you really can't say how many times the aircraft should have been tested. And at this point we really don't know how many times the system was tested. The unfortunate reality is that the only real way to test an aircraft is to fly it.

 

The space shuttle was an unstable design and without computers it could never fly manually. The B2 flying wing is unstable as well and without computers it could not fly. Todays jets are inherently unstable at high speeds which is why the horizontal tail wing was redesigned. Chuck Yeager learned this the hard way.

 

I wouldn't go from LA to New York in a space shuttle either.

 

Okay

 

WASHINGTON (AP) — The nation’s top aviation regulator assured Congress on Wednesday that the Boeing 737 Max, grounded after two deadly accidents, will only return to flying when a government analysis shows that it is safe.

The Federal Aviation Administration is under scrutiny for how it relied on Boeing to certify the Max and then didn’t ground the plane until after the second crash, in March.


https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/lawmakers-grill-faa-chief-about-boeing-737-max-safety-concerns

 

The problem is a "robot" cannot make decisions as a normal person would. A robot looks for predictability where life isn't. This is why an automated car ain't so great.

 

You do raise a good and valid point, but the larger and more compelling question is why Boeing cheated the system on this MCAS issue.

Yes, one could argue that the FAA missed its proper oversight, but if there is any guilt involved, and there is, it begins with the corporate leadership at Boeing.

THEY cheated, and people died.

I caught just a bit of the hearing on the TV news, and it appears Congress will bless the FAA and let things go with no corporate heads being charged for anything at all.

 

With no paperwork, including diagrams...,which your latest link from PBS says Boeing has provided none, it is impossible to say precisely. At least one test for each part that could fail, and tests for failures of two things at once, and not all tests done by their best (a Chuck Yeager).

 

(CNN)Boeing says it has finished the development of a software fix to its troubled 737 Max, in a statement released Thursday. The plane maker says it has flown the aircraft with the updated software on 207 flights for more than 360 hours.

https://edition.cnn.com/2019/05/16/politics/737-max-boeing-software-fix/index.html?

is this enough flights and hours to verify the new software fixed the problem?

 

If it can't be proven Boeing knew the MCAS was flawed when they delivered the 737 Max to the airlines there is no guilt involved. As for the FAA their is no justification for why they passed off their responsibilities. Certifiying aircraft is one of their main duties.

 

"An FAA spokesman said Thursday afternoon the Boeing materials, including the software, have not yet been submitted." So they (FAA) don't know anymore than we do. Flying the plane and deliberately breaking it are two different things, we would assume they flew it with a bad sensor..., but at this point I would assume nothing.

 

Self certification?

 

Why not? What could go wrong?

 

The next step is for the FAA to verify the MCAS issue is resolved. There are many 737 Max aircraft that were put into service so which one had the bad sensor?