Russia Angrily Demands U.S. Stop Sending Weapons to Ukraine

It was your hypothetical scenario where a rogue military element from a NATO country attacks Russia. I just agreed with you that is real possibility considering how jumpy everyone is getting and communication is not always perfect.

 

No sane government stocks nuclear weapons. I have no doubt the US government will use nuclear weapons if they thought America was going to lose a war. So why wouldn't other government do the same? Putin will never accept defeat. People who know him well know this to be true, he never backs down.

 

I don't get the impression he plans to back down. I'm not a military strategist but it looks like he is willfully poking the bear trying to pop something off. He probably never anticipated on making it out alive and, if that end lets him go out in some misguided "blaze of glory" that get got 10,000s of his citizens' loved ones killed for no damn reason and radioactive poison to do many more in, I guess it's a big "win" in his book.

 

Russia lost millions during WW2 while fighting back against the Nazis, so what's a couple 100,000 losses to fight back against US moving NATO closer to Russia's border? Putin feels threatened and has voiced his concerns since taking office in 1999. No one took his concerns seriously so here we are. Australia is now threatening war with China over the Solomon Islands. Would Australia be wrong if they followed through with their promise to retaliate if China does build military bases on those islands?

 

Uh... no.... it was your post in #229 that brought up that extremely remote possibility

SNIP
Let's hope NATO countries are well disciplined and don't start a war with Russia because they misread Russia's intentions.
ENDSNIP

 

I don't recall saying that Putin doesn't have legitimate concerns. Australia probably does as well. It boggles my mind the same minds that can advance technology and medicine and basically eradicate countless diseases can't figure out a way to not kill hundreds of thousands of people because they won't look for less destructive intersections for compromise.

 

Putin likes when people get poisoned - Spitting Image

 

After the collapse of the Soviet Union the new Russian Federation compromised with the US by allowing Germany to reunite and letting all of Germany join NATO with the promise NATO would not move one inch further east. The US broke that agreement and has continued to do so.

 

And on post 267 you gave this example of how it could happen.

 

Again, I'm not a military strategist or historian but I place some of that blame on the people involved that trusted the US. We don't have a strong history to keeping promises and I could see how outsiders might consider us bullies.

I'd like to see us pull back from policing the entire world and tending to our problems here, at home, a bit more. If we can afford to lose several billion dollars in military equipment, weaponry and ammunition and cash, we can afford that nobody here is living on the streets and no child goes to bed hungry. We can work on true prison reform and clean up our foster care and group home issues that just are holding places to funnel kids into the prison system. It's a vicious cycle and it makes no sense to prop up other societies while neglecting our own people.

Any country/culture that wants to advance, model some of our policies and build their societies can be welcome to assistance but they have to take the initiative and there has to be an end date. I don't intend any of that to sound heartless. I just believe that love should start at home.

 

We did. We pulled out of Afghanistan. We are out of Iraq. Biden has kept us largely in the background in Ukraines war.

This is where we are when America steps back. How’s the view?

 

And the US under Bill Clinton was all to eager to keep NATO in place and recruit new countries by continuing the Cold War and making Russia out to be the big bad evil empire even when they were barely holding on economically after the collapse while trying to establish a democracy. The US had a 10 year window of opportunity to help Russia get back on their feet and guide them on a path to democracy. It's what we did for Germany after WW2 and Japan.

 

The US led NATO is not stepping back. In fact the Biden Administration is escalating the war with Russia. This is exactly how it started in Vietnam. The buildup of US troops in Europe will continue along with more and more heavy weaponry to include missile "defense" systems capable of carrying nuclear warheads.

 

OK. There's a fair amount of truth in that. I was thinking more along the lines of not always doing the heavy lifting for future wars. I've talked to several soldiers that were in Afghanistan and it's been tough. We need to do something more than just throw warm bodies and weapons at people is all. That formula isn't working.

As far as Putin, I believe there is more at play than him popping off about NATO getting too cozy. I think it was orchestrated for other reasons and now he is just trying to save face (as best as possible).

 

Why do you think we didn't help Russia?

 

Because there would have been no need for the MIC without our Russian foe. I'm sure there were other underhanded reasons for not helping Russia rebuild. The Russian people were hungry for their freedom and elected candidates who were pro-democracy.

 

I think you can agree that since the Russian build up to the war and now past 2 months into it, the US could have done a lot more but didn’t. Many another President would have.

As the war crimes have mounted and Putins nuclear threats have mounted and Ukraine has been more than a match for Russia, it shouldn’t shock you that even retreat-at-any-cost-Biden is having to steadily increase support. Does that qualify as “policing the world?” Obviously. Not.

 

Yes, I can see that easily being the case. You seem sympathetic toward Russia. Does that mean you are in the camp that thinks Zelensky is a thug and they're all Nazis?

This was published 3 hours ago.

 

I completely agree that when America decides to be more engaged it needs to be smarter not just where but how. Our geopolitics, and even more specifically our war strategies seem mired in politics, and with that comes bad strategy creating bad outcomes that create, ironically, bad politics.

 

I was just sitting here thinking about my last post to you and trying to figure out something they are good at and I came up empty. ;-0

 

They didn't because the Biden Administration was just too slow to act even when they knew the invasion was inevitable. Escalating a war with Russia is not going to end well for anyone. He doesn't think like anyone the US has gone up against since the end of WW2 when Hitler was conquering Europe. Do you think Hitler would have used a nuclear bomb if he had them? I do.

 

The US has a proven record following WW2 of sucking at fighting wars and I agree US politics plays a huge role in the failures. Congress has refused to declare a war since WW2. That shows a clear record of half assed commitment to winning wars.

 

So? The U.S. is under no obligations to abide by any unofficial agreement made with the defeated Russians.

 

Hitler never used his massive chemical weapons arsenal.

 

Are you in the camp who thinks anyone who is sympathetic to the Russian people are also sympathetic to Putin and what he is doing to innocent lives not only in Ukraine but his country as well. Are you okay with causing severe hardships amongst the Russian people because you hate Putin?