MOD ANNOUNCEMENT: Member Debates (Input needed)

Well, you'd be welcome to ignore those thread entirely and instead carry on as usual in the regular forums. So I don't see the problem, unless you object to being excluded from something that apparently doesn't interest you anyway.

 

Doesn't interest me. I play in the street.

 

Not to mention 5 days of cutting & pasting to gather those 'original thoughts'.

I've seen this done on other forums. As long as it doesn't further slow down the site, no prob with it here. Just try to pick two opposites to debate each other... otherwise it can be about as exciting as watching paint dry.

 

I'm predicting the same people who howl and whine about "bigots and racists" not being moderated out of their way will still do so in the other forum, when the moderation is not sufficiently rigged make them look good.

 

It's a circle jerk.

Pardon my French.

 

Then why are you here, in this thread, exactly?

 

Oh, I see. You're here to whine about people who you think are whining about the moderation of the forum. In other words, you have no interest in the actual topic.

Glad we got that sorted.

 

Jaysus, it's like being 12 again.

Anyone have a cure for the toothache?

 

The idea is to raise the debate to a higher level. Most of what goes on in the forums day-to-day barely qualifies as debate. A lot of it devolves into such mindless repetition of the same left vs. right, conservative vs. liberal schtick that it could easily be written by robots (or chimps, if you prefer).

The point that this mindless drivel can continue uninterrupted in the regular forums is no small point. If that's what interests you, then by all means spend your time there.

What is your specific objection to the existence of an occasional, specialized debate? The question of why some people would like to see this has already been sufficiently answered earlier in the thread.

So far, the objections seem to be that some people will find it boring. There's also apparently some anger at the thought of a debate taking place that can't be trolled, derailed, etc. in the usual ways.

I don't find those to be good reasons for killing the idea.

 

The Mod put forward a suggestion, didn't he? It's a good one. I don't have time to debate with evidence much, but it would be good to read some decent, thought out debate from time to time.

Oh, are you saying there are no racist/bigots on the board? (try to tell the truth now)

Get off it. If we didn't need that, there would be no Mods (and no members)

The truth is the truth. If people keep doing what they always did, they get what they always got.

(Who is David Brooks)

 

Strangely enough, you are the first person that came to mind when I was trying to think of who would make a good judge.

I think this could be interesting. We'd just have to try it to find out.

 

I see, so when the Religious folk were getting trolled like hell for as long as they have been here ,,,that's fine. When they asked for a thread that would not be trolled they were told ''NO!!, you cant do that, this is a open public debate site!!!'' [before you were here I believe.], so that's alright huh? So when did it stop being an open debate site,,,NOW? and by WHO?
Does that mindless debate include the word chimp you just muttered? Careful you are messing up the thread already..

Again with the wise ass remark, are you sure they want you here?, I do not think you qualify

I did not realize the left settled this already, excuse me.

You see, this is the thing. If I am asked if this is something I care to participate in, and what I think about it,,then that is what I will do. I will tell them what I feel about it. Is that what you did?

I dont see the others as good reasons for having it. I'll tell you why. We have here groups you can make or join. These are for the specific reasons you claim you want this for. So,,,open a debate group, and you can make it by invite only, problem solved. This is what the Mods told us,,good enough for us, good enough for you...right?

 

I might not have been here when it was first debated, but I have seen the topic arise again from time to time. In my view, that situation bears no relation to what is being discussed here.

My use of the word chimp here isn't in reference to a particular person or viewpoint, but to a situation. Context matters.

Nothing wise ass about it - just stated a simple and pertinent fact.

The fact that I support the sort of specialized debate being discussed doesn't mean I have a desire to actively participate. For one, I can't make the required time commitment, and for another I don't harbor any delusion that I'm the kind of poster they're looking for.

Not a question of right or left, so not taking your bait.

I think my position on the matter is pretty clear.

Wasn't aware those groups existed. It's evident from the early posts that they mean this to be high profile.

If your reason for not wanting these debates to take place is because religious people didn't get their own restricted membership forum, or because groups exist that are invite-only, then I'm still not hearing a good reason for the site not to host them.

 

Viv, let me explain this to you,,first off that's why we have the Mods to keep things civil. Now you and I have debated a hundred times do we have any problems?
So,,,you are saying some here would like to have a one on one debate without the FEAR [Oh my God] , of somebody else saying something to disturb that, am I correct?
Fine, then those people can open their own little group, we have groups here, you are aware of that correct? That's what those groups are here for.

PROBLEM SOLVED....

 

Hey Flounder, let's debate the competence of Barack Obama. You defend him and I'll attack. Hahaha.

 

But but...I dont want to defend....

 

I disagree with the concept.

Often people are not prepared to spend the time necessary for a full debate but still have valid comments to make. What you are, in effect saying, is, if you are not willing to take the time necessary to participate in a full debate you have no right to post a comment.

Since when is Political Forum a place where only those with either the time or the inclination to participate in a full debate have a right to comment on what is being posted?

This has historically been a site where people have been free to post comments on any topic being discussed so long as they did not directly attack another poster. That policy has made this one of the premier sites on the internet and I would not like to see it changed.

 

No one wants to defend the indefensible.

 

You don't troll (unless the FL's dress is mentioned).

LMAO...what's up Flounder? Afraid of a little fair one to one competition or inability to use weight of numbers? Or afraid quality of debate improves and people come under pressure to up the game? (worries me too...)

Fear Factor doesn't come into it, enjoying reading a decent debate does. There is already a formal debate type forum here anyway. Sometimes I even post in it.

I've seen the OP idea work before, it can help boost quality of debate and attract decent posters in. Now I personally don't have a lot of time to engage in quality debate but it is something people often throw, that the quality of debate could improve here.

A lot of other people like the idea also. There are a number of volunteers for the judging role. If you don't want to participate, don't. I didn't think many of the Cons would, they seem to enjoy working more as a lobby group.

 

They're still free to do that in every other forum.

 

Flounder has already offered a solution. Form a group or join one of he existing groups. This has historically been an open forum. I am 100% against anything that lessens that openess.

I am so opposed to an idea I consider elitist that I will use the words of William Tecumseh Sherman, regarding the debates, "If nominated I will not run; if elected I will not serve."

 

I will not serve either, probably. It's still a great idea.

And what you are doing is limiting the freedoms of others who want to take it forward.

I'm shocked and appalled.

 

Ahhh, might it not be the same because it is something you approve of ? It is the same,, serious debate interrupted,,trolling. The subject matters not.

Yes and you were insinuating I would like that,,you were insulting me and other conservatives, a clear bias and insult. It's right there, sorry...

HARDLY, AGAIN IT IS THERE FOR EVERYBODY TO SEE, that kind of attack is not civil discourse. No reason for that at all.

I think you are a fine poster,,,most times
Fair enough...I would not make use of it either, and this is what they are trying to find out, is it warranted.

None intended, go look for yourself...

Exactly, you gave your opinion on the matter, but for some reason you do not seem to want mine. I was asked just like you.

Yes they have always been here, and that's what they are for.

Hey they can do whatever they like, but I am being honest and telling them [just like you] I will not participate. So, if they wish one anyway they have the groups, they can start on and it will not take room out here as a thread. If however they want their own thread then I must request that be extended to the other group as well. You want them to be fair right?

Then do you know what will happen? Everybody in this open forum debate site would want their own. You would no longer have open discussion, the entire site would change.
So,,,This is what the groups are about,,,''SPECIALIZED'' debate.

Now I can agree with you, some of the people here are very rude..''both sides'' however I have almost never been in a serious debate, [Like we are now] and been interrupted. You and I have spoken before and never had a problem. I debate with Shiva, Goldwater, Zero, Pluribus, Sparks,TML, Catch,,and most of the conservatives. I stay away from the Morons, and have some debates one on one to great length. I am sorry but I just do not have a problem, generally you get what you give.

This does not mean he should not have something separate if he and others want to, however it should be done in the proper area, by being private he can keep out who he wants, you can even assign your own Mod, and have judges and all. It should not be in the area for public debate though, because it is not public debate.

 

Not likely. It will be more civil but not more substantive, because too many here value debate for its own sake rather than for its potential for exposing the truth.

 

It's a debate forum, isn't it? What is wrong in valuing debate?

There is room for both, a skilled debater will incorporate evidence to support his truth.