Gwen neither side of government want to make the inevitable decision, and that is the forced removal of children. History is against them. Nobody wants to make that call, it is political suicide in this current environment. So the kids just have to endure it seems and the cycle remains unbroken. I was in this community implementing an unrelated programme and was approached for my assistance. This is how it came about. I would like to think that the reason this issue is not discussed in homes all across Australia is as you say the lack of information, however this has been a major issue for two decades, so four corners have had plenty of time to cover it. No excuses for the media. The only place it is currently being discussed in the media is on Sky and I think that is purely to suit another agenda. The problem has been the NT governments and post Howard governments either watering down the intervention orders, changing them, or completely disregarding them. Unless you were born around the turn of the century, been overseas for twenty years, or are deaf and blind, you would be aware of the situation. Perspective is everything Gwen. Change the date or stop some child being abused? I think I will protest to change the date! It’s easier and there is good mobile coverage so I can send a selfie. I know that is cynical but gee, it doesn’t look so good does it when it is put in perspective. No hackles here Gwen, I appreciate everyones differences in thought and opinion. I especially appreciate the fact we live in a society that allows us to freely voice them. Well for the most part
Some really touching and highly honest opinions, and even more importantly, personal experience. I am happy and proud that these people (YOU) still exist in my country, numbers are dwindling... Cats
Cats there are still plenty, and thankyou for your kind comment. Truth is, as I said, I was included by circumstance. It has had a real impact on me. I have been incredibly fortunate in my life. Yes I have worked hard and sacrificed much to be in the position I am now. I have always donated my time where I have been able to, but life has thrown a dose of perspective my way. Violence against those who cannot defend themselves is nothing new, as Gwen has pointed out, but I think these days we seem to think in fads and if it’s not in front of us we don’t tend to see consistent pursuit. News used to be on a 24 hour cycle, now it moves in minutes. So issues get glossed over in the pandamonium of this newsfeed we are fed. This issue is not a political issue, nor is it a black issue. It is a national issue that is the responsibility of every Australian. It is the most important issue in our nation today, and it is urgent.
I have to wonder the irony in this comment. BUT anyway. Just as indigenous people think more about their empty fridges, their mortgages their repayments their car and what their neighbours are doing than what day Australia day is on… Unlike those who want to demonise celebration of being Australian, who want to pretend they have indigenous identity interest at heart. These pretenders complain about policy introduced to help address indigenous issues. Policy and issue Indigenous people are not just asking for but demanding themselves. Complaints of equal rights seem to fall short when people don’t agree with the requests of the people themselves. NO, what do we want to pretend, the date of Australia day is causing all these problems… What crap…
If I had to name my biggest concern overall, it would be about how society is losing its humanity/concern for humans at such a fast rate. The disgusting treatment of the elderly in nursing homes, 120,000 homeless, the working poor... The Margaret River murders where a man killed his wife, daughter and her four children. He murdered 6 people from his family. The government doesn't bat an eyelid. But all these things and the plight of Aboriginal women and children should be front and centre. At the same time. What I'm trying to say is that in a decent and aware and compassionate-to-people country - all these things - and more, would be addressed and actioned to ease all this unnecessary tragedy and duress and the shocking lack of dignity that these situations create for victims/human beings. The fact that the government doesn't address even one issue - is evidence that they won't address any/all of the (other) issues. The government doesn't want to spend money on these tragic issues - but by not addressing and spending money on these issues - the tragedies widen and become more fraught - and the fabric of society tears more and more and tragedy abounds. The government kicks and screams NOT to help people. The ABC forced them to address the crisis in nursing homes with their two part Four Corners report. And then the banks, they were forced into the Royal Commission. And too late, after so many people lost their livelihoods, their homes, their businesses because of the banks. I think the lack of help and resources directed at Aboriginal women and children reflects the governments attitude to helping ANYONE. Four Corners has a website where you can propose a subject for them to pursue. Can be done anonymously, too. I've done so a couple of times. And I recommend it. There are people who are raising the issue who seem to have a deeper agenda to want to tear down Aboriginal culture overall. The reason I haven't heard much on the issue is that when I hear it from those I think have questionable reputations, I turn off. That is my perspective. It just is. But if more genuine people such as yourself broadcasted this issue who don't denigrate Aboriginal culture while advocating for the women and children, more people would listen. Back to that word 'perspective'. We all have one. I don't think it's ingrained having the perspective we have. It can change. But we have (our own) perspective all the same.
Hi Gwendo, wise words.... At this point in time, humanism is certainly not striving, but you are right, we need to voice more of our concern..... Cheers Cats
What about the forced removal of the men abusing the women and children? Keeping the mothers with their children would be paramount, surely. Also, putting a lot of resources into the issue. Things like rehabilitation, intensive counselling, education programs for those who can possibly be redeemed. I don't think the Howard government cared either way. Otherwise it would have done something constructive. The sad thing is that all the dispossession, all the past stolen kids... all the sad history, has likely culminated - in part - to the tragedies occurring there now. This idea of "get over it" is ludicrous. From my perspective. Especially from a psychological perspective. History most surely has a hand - in part - with the tragedies occurring there now. In which case, following up with taking more kids away... on the back of having taking so many kids away before... doesn't sound good. Bad history clumped on more bad history. Instead of taking the children away, take away the men abusing them. Why should the mothers be punished on top of being abused by their partners? It seems like a big injustice to me. Again, from my perspective.
Great post Gwen. If a people can survive for 70k years with culture in tact and social structures that solidified their existence, you could only point to one major event that brought this culture to its knees! The 26th of January represents the beginning of the demise! As for the children I am with you, the perpetrators of said crimes should be removed before removing children if anything. Breaking the cycle is the key is my thinking, which means pumping most financial resources into education especially early development stuff. You ain’t going to change the older generation but you can certainly provide a great foundation for the impressionable. What apparently set back many aboriginal communities was the dismantling of the work for the dole program. It was a community focussed program that required refining not dismantling. All of a sudden these men and women who were at least doing things that improved their communities were once again left with little confidence, motivation, aspiration and hope. Pretty sure this all happened under the Howard government.
Sorry for the lack of interaction, it has been a bit hectic up my way. Look I don’t really care which government did what or didn’t do what. This isn’t a partisan issue, every Australian owns this issue, and every government has had their opportunity to address it. There are many issues which exascerbate this catastrophy. Culture plays a part, drugs and alcohol are primary causes towards escalations, education yes of course, and also mainstream interaction. Easy to hide a secret when you are out of view. Women won’t leave and testify and men won’t stop. It is frustrating. Government throw money to disguise the deep rooted culture that has festered in our remote Aboriginal communities. The cycle can only be broken by breaking the generational cycle. Lets face it, you would need to have a large scale security force to inhabit each community and enforce draconian segregation laws in order to have half a chance. This would last decades. What would this teach the young? That is not the answer, but the actual answer may be just as unpalatable. This is why government is conspicuously silent on this issue. Neither side want to make a call that caused so much turmoil decades after the first time it was made. Howling white people down as racists for the mere mention of it is only aiding in the continuance of it.
Seems so often about money. The not wanting to spend it to better people's lives. But they seem fine to spend it to do something they think will win them an election - aka Howard, NT Intervention. Perhaps we're a punitive society, I don't know. But it's common sense and common decency to put major money into genuine programs to help these communities. It can be done. But we seriously are a useless country with this crop of dullard politicians. That's really sad about the work for the dole program helping the communities. People need to feed useful and connected. Truly, the government is a useless dope. Breaking the cycle as you say. So very true, TV.
I kinda mangled a post I was writing so thought I'd fill this empty space post with something... I will never forget a story I read in Time Magazine some time ago about Archie Roach. He was removed from a loving family around age 3. He was sent to a mission home and the mission home heinously lied to him, telling him his parents had died in a house fire. About 10 years passed for him in this mission home… and then a sister he didn’t know he had tracked him down to this mission home. She told Archie that his mother had died the previous week. This after believing both his parents were dead from the time he was an infant. His anger and rage through the roof. He drank and found himself homeless on the streets of Kings Cross. Redemption came when he met Ruby Hunter on the streets of Kings Cross and they fell in love. I am utterly against the forced removal of children. This is utterly about a lack of imagination to look to do good instead of looking to do 'punitive.' When I came back to this forum I felt bombarded by a bit of aggression. I thought, "Oh, ****, maybe tone it down, Gwendoline." But on reflection, I wasn't aggressive/out of bounds. I was just stating things as I saw them. What we all must do. The reference to me being racist and the bit about the KKK was pretty ludicrous. But anyway, be yourselves, good people. Utter and speak from your minds and hearts.
Oh I don’t know, The NT intervention you rallied against as being wrong and ineffectual until shown the reality would be a start to trying address the plight of indigenous women and children. Don’t you??? Perhaps the introduction of cashless welfare card as trials to curb the alcoholism and gambling to help both domestic violence and neglect in the household being another. Perhaps listening to the people of their region and addressing the issues they require not our ideal of what should happen is another. We talk of partisan politics as being the cause of such issues being prolonged and politicised rather than being addressed yet it is those very ideals that blinds people to the reality of what is happening, what is working and how to proceed for the better. You talk about loss of humanity, or should we really say civilisation??? In this post you point out the very issue you say is your greatest concern. “The reason I haven't heard much on the issue is that when I hear it from those I think have questionable reputations, I turn off” In other words you lose your humanity (concern for others) when YOU decide they have questionable reputations. The fact is that others do the same to you, so when you post your support for a clearly racist comment then your credibility is lost. Others turn off for the same purpose. Ergo, just as you dehumanise others because you don’t agree with them, you are dehumanised in the same manner. I often hear people talk about racist issues and how they stand up against racism, Nothing dehumanises anybody as finding, creating and labelling everybody’s differences. Pretending that people have disadvantage over contrived issues does nothing at all for the inclusion, to address racism or simply to fix a problem. Domestic violence, child abuse, alcoholism, gambling, health and education are not just indigenous issues. And yet they are continued to be broadcast as different issue to the rest of the nation. Different approaches, different ideals and yet they continue to be contentious. I rally against Shorten, not because he is ALP, not because he opposes my politics but because he clearly holds the issues of political expediency over the decency of the nation. I note the actions of the NRL to expel new player for domestic violence. Suddenly has it become apparent that people are just sick of this wishy washy way mentors of the nation are treated so they can go on to show how if you have something others want… Welcome Shorten, might get the message??? No, I don’t think so, he already announce he would cancel a program the people of their communities didn’t just ask for but lobbied for, because he can do something better, Guess we can expect more inaction from ALP government in this area while they can get political mileage. Different perspective is correct. We do, but our perspectives are made up of the facts we have been given. We create an opinion with the facts we have and we change it we get MORE facts. BUT when those attempt to subvert or change the fact to support their own idea of what shows their opinion, they create a incredulous acceptance of comment. NOT just You don’t agree. Perhaps one day, people will start to listen and not demand. Perhaps one day people will stop demanding their opinions are facts. BUT at the least people should do, is listen to others, whether you agree or not, because they may be right as well… It is one thing to talk about humanity, it seems another to live it.
The trouble with the ego when it’s not working properly is that people hold up their opinions as facts. The stuff of self-inflation. It’s boring. Anyone that doesn’t agree with you for Australia Day to stay as it is inciting racism and divisiveness/is racist and divisive. Because you say so. The cashless welfare card is unfair if administered indiscriminately as it has been. In a Sydney street, there’s no way that even if there were 10 domestic abusers on my street, that the whole street – the whole suburb - would be put on a cashless card. And for families doing the right thing, it’s not fair to put them on a cashless card. I already said the abusers should be removed from the home. These people need extraordinary support services/resources. No, we should not really say ‘civilisation’, but you can say it, whatever. I said ‘humanity’. And sure, people like Andrew Bolt have been racist to Aboriginal people, so there’s no way I’d bother with him. He’s an ********. A clearly racist comment?! That I think people like Andrew bolt has a questionable reputation because he says derogatory things about Aboriginals? Ok, lol. I’m not so keen on those who dehumanise others so I don’t give them the time of day. The Andrew Bolts of the world. And possibly people like you cos you’re arrogant and up yourself. O, gee, look, I can call you names too (!) You don't have a monopoly on name-calling (!)
ScoMo is a pathetic Trump wannabe. And how pathetic is anyone who wants to emulate Trumpelthinskin? If it means more Anthony Callea extravaganzas or really bad covers of INXS songs at Circular Quay, I'm all for doing away with Australia Day. I'll even happily give up the day off work! But to anyone who hasn't got the basic knowledge of history to comprehend why the date is the anniversary of their land being invaded, and get all bent out of shape about them daring to remind us, I say to you Happy Invasion Day. Here's some bad 80's hairstyles and some lyrics that would upset the Pauline Hansons amongst us
Some one tell me this... If the date was changed....what would "they" whinge about next..... This is probably the very reason people dont want the date changed.... Because people might, just might be getting a bit sick of "them" and their whinging...
"They" would go back to whining about Muslims and Asians and how Labors going to 'steal' their franking credits so they can no longer get a tax refund on something they never paid for. Oh. Wait. Did you mean "they" to be Indigenous Australians? I read it as stupid and racist people because as we all know they're the biggest whingers I know of
I dont talk about Asians, nor do I talk about Labor policies. I group all politicians in the one basket...useless...As far as muslims are concerned, I suggest you do some islamic reading before you become a muslim apologist...
...says someone who doesn't know any himself...... ??????????????????????????????????????? Billy Billy Billy, still a kid, reg.
I understand totally how you felt, there are some here who find it easier to attack the person then the message. You should however rejoice the fact that they have their feathers ruffled, it means your words meant something but they have no comeback. They then use innuendo and refer to things like KKK or call you racist for calling out racism. One of my favorites is being called a "party hack". I can see all the people who know me laughing their tits of over that. I am moving atm and have just gone through all the clippings from the two federal elections I contested and it's obviously clear that I am not a hack to any party, I actually oppose the party system itself. I just don't talk the talk, I have walked the walk. I am often called racist for my views on Australian history and that I am playing some ideological drum. I remember when I came home from kindergarten after singing "God save the Queen", I asked my father why our Queen lived in England and why she wasn't a black lady since they were here first. My views are my moral and logical conclusions, unlike those that attack me.
