Donbass. Here it is what you do not know.

Discussion in 'Russia & Eastern Europe' started by RUS, Jul 19, 2016.

  1. RUS

    RUS Member

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    No.
    It must sounds much more great and interesting.

    President of independent Ukraine pays taxes to the budget of the aggressor country with which he fights.:icon_picknose:
     
  2. VSilver

    VSilver New Member

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    We are speaking about Russian invasion and occupation of Crimea with unnamed military (turned out to be regular Russian Army), followed-up with untrusted Referendum and illegal Annexation.

    Also we`re speaking about similar Russian invasion to the East of Ukraine, with similar unnamed military groups with tanks T-72B3, BM-21, Buk, SA-22 (turned out to be Russians), followed-up with another untrusted Referendum, but with failed Annexation.

    We can see similar pattern of Russian actions:

    1. Unnamed invasion which turns out to be Russian military groups
    2. Uncontrolled and untrusted Referendum
    3. Illegal Annexation.

    By that pattern Russia tried to occupy and annex the half of Ukraine - the East and the South of it. Russia had success in Crimea annexation, had some successful invasion to the East of Ukraine, but failed to advance to the South, so full annexation of Eastern-South is suspend.

    Russian tanks and personnel in the East of Ukraine don`t fight for "Ukrainian Federalization", they fight for the new Republics, as it was with another examples: Pridnestrovian Moldavian Republic, Abkhazia, South Ossetia - all of this decadent and unrecognised states are supported by Russian involvement. DPR and LPR will have such decadent and unrecognised future.

    Russia signed the Budapest Memorandum:

    1. Respect Ukrainian independence and sovereignty and the existing borders. Russia violated this with Crimea Annexation.
    2. Refrain from the threat or use of force against Ukraine. Russia violated this with military invasion to Crimea and to the East of Ukraine.

    Russia is the threat for European Security, Russia is shifty and precarious, as Nazi were in 1938. So Russia is faced with counter force. There is another Cold War. And you know, Russia lost previous Cold War because of economic weakness.

    And what we have today? Russian PM: "There is no money".

    [video=youtube;rzHmWker_4U]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rzHmWker_4U[/video]

    Does any Poroshenko trade with Russia and make money on Russia - is another question, financial. Russia trades with Poroshenko who claimes that Russia is the invader. And Russia still has been supplying Russian personnel, T-72B3 and SA-22 for the war against Ukraine.
     
  3. CommunistRebelStar

    CommunistRebelStar New Member

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    Interesting to note that the Ukrainian president allows Ukrainian business firms to operate in Russia. If at war with the Russian Federation, why contribute to the tax revenue income of the Russian Federation? I have to agree with this observation.

    One or two years ago, I suggested the idea that Crimea should be shared between the Ukraine and the Russia Federation. In fact. I also suggested that the Ukrainian and Russian forces cooperate their forces like a post-Warsaw pact entity. Here, it seems from a YouTube commentator, the suggestion that regional entities will replace NATO and the EU in the future.

    I also had the idea:
    Ukraine could charge a fee for the Russian Federation for using the military bases and ports along with close military cooperation. This way, Ukraine could keep Crimea and the Russian Federation will still have active bases within Crimea proper.

    Let add through this edit, because I have read through some posts, Russia imports could be reduced to pay off the pensions in Crimea.

    Source: http://www.worldsrichestcountries.com/top-russia-imports.html

    Based on the above information, if accurate, some imports could be reduced and even removed like "Beverages" and Oil. Russia has oil and it could reduce the alcohol consumption rate.
     
  4. CommunistRebelStar

    CommunistRebelStar New Member

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    What events led to point #1?
     
  5. VSilver

    VSilver New Member

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    Roshen Lipetsk factory put up for sale for $200 million, - corporation CEO

    The CEO added there was no buyer yet. "We've put it up for sale. But once we did it, all real buyers disappeared. We joke that after Yanukovych fled there, Russia saw the same things as we had while he ruled. It's hard to find a normal buyer, only cops and FSB officers are left. And they have a specific approach to buying. Once they come to see assets, be ready to meet someone from prosecutor's office the next day. That is, the assets have been assessed, and the coming day they start a seizure process"
    http://en.censor.net.ua/n369304
     
  6. VSilver

    VSilver New Member

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    Any Ukrainian internal issue doesn`t give Russia the Right to invade and occupy.

    Russia signed the Budapest Memorandum:

    1. Respect Ukrainian independence and sovereignty and the existing borders.
    2. Refrain from the threat or use of force against Ukraine.

    Of course, Russians are backing their crimes. Russian says Russia has the right to occupy and oppress Crimean minorities.
    Nazi did the same way

    Russian propaganda documentary “Crimea. The Way Home” shown in Russia on 15 March 2015 was inspired by the 1939 German Nazi documentary “German Sudetenland Returns Home”.

    Both videos portray German/Russian aggressors as saviors and liberators, and both try to convince their audience that invasion of neighboring countries and annexation of their territories is a legitimate right of the country-aggressor.

    The irony is that in both of these propaganda videos the invaded countries (Czechoslovakia and Ukraine) are shown as cruel monsters and fascists, while the fascist regimes that attacked these countries are shown as peaceful liberators. According to these videos, Russia has saved Crimean Russians from devilish Ukrainians, just as Germany saved Sudeten Germans from devilish Czechs.

    Very soon Russia will start "saving" the whole Eastern Europe, just as Nazi Germany did...


    Read more at http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=d9b_1...AFuKwQDchdF.99

    Russians in military uniform kidnaped Tatar in Crimes, he was found deadly tortured soon. It was not single incident.

    [video=youtube;11S2Vhkr-bc]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=11S2Vhkr-bc[/video]

    Russian in military unifirm did similar crimes on the East of Ukraine, kidnapped and deadly tortured people.
    [​IMG]
    http://www.kyivpost.com/article/con...rlivka-council-found-in-sloviansk-344640.html

    Every country would eliminate such Russian terrorists.
     
  7. RUS

    RUS Member

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    Coup in Kiev by force.
    Crimea residents refused to live under rebel authority.

    If the rebels "have the right" to overthrow the legitimate president, the Crimea Residents have the right to "overthrow" these rebels.(At least from their land Crimea)
    ./

    [video=youtube;ydGE8TN0MQA]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ydGE8TN0MQA[/video]
     
  8. RUS

    RUS Member

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    You are repeating. These are your theses, I denied.

    http://www.politicalforum.com/russia-eastern-europe/369240-sanctions-second-cold-war-3.html

    http://www.politicalforum.com/russia-eastern-europe/369240-sanctions-second-cold-war-2.html

    .
     
  9. AboveAlpha

    AboveAlpha Well-Known Member

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    You know.....it was plain as day to see Spetsnaz in the Ukraine and especially in the Crimea area.

    They stuck out like sore thumbs.

    AA
     

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