FAITH in a RELIGION for those who REFUSE FACTS.

Me and my kind are not only exempt from being an ape we are clearly of the human kind in all forms and being. That is what separates me and you, I am proud to be a human.

Once again THEORY you can't distinguish theory from facts or humans from apes.

You claim you are from apes now you are saying you are not??? Come on be truthful are you or not from ape kind? I will definitely apologize if I find any lies in my statement.

See, you are confusing yourself again how can all apes not humans if you claim humans evolved from apes??? If humans are apes then apes are humans it is as simple as that and that is why I don't agree with your position or claim because humans are humans and apes are apes two separate species or creatures with their own distinct features and characteristics.

I understand and accept that there is a THEORY of GRAVITY BUT DO YOU UNDERSTAND THAT IS ONLY A THEORY and the only facts is presently limited to what is already known what is not known or theory is gravity and human ability to defy that.

 

Dogs have been train a lot better than apes dogs can snife out drugs and contraband, parrots can train to talk does that make them humans or maybe apes???
Have you ever heard of Lassy?

Hey, men's best friend is the dog. How come not the ape or monkey??

 

God or the God-particle is that one single ancestors of all living things and none living things.

 

Why are you so afraid of the reality here?

I mean it has been proven to without there even being a shadow of a doubt that Humans and Great Apes are related and this is proven in the fossil records and CONCLUSIVELY proven in the Genetics.

What are you afraid of?

AboveAlpha

 

Just a correction: Technically we ARE Great Apes. So, yes, obviously we are closely related to the other Great Ape species because we are ALSO a species under the Hominidae family.

 

AM I afraid? If I am I wouldn't be here and the reason I am here is because the truth needs to be shared at the same time I have learn some truth here that there are actually two sets of humans the 1st sets are those who evolved from humans the second sets are those who believe and accept theories as facts that they evolved from apes.

Proven or theorised? just because some fossils remains were found that look like both apes and humans does not mean humans evolved from apes why not the other way around apes evolved from humans or from a Great Human? There is no written records what so ever from ancient all known civilization in Africa, Asia, Europe, Mediterranean, Pacific, Alaska anywhere around the world that would indicate humans evolved from apes all was found are fossils and DNA test that show these fossils to consist both apes and human DNA that being the case it can easily be claim that fossil was a super human that started the evolution of apes and humans.

Present day science and facts have proof beyond reasonable doubt take away all the theories that humans are humans and apes are apes both species of their own kind and evolved separately from one another.

Ancient scientist picked up the ape theories from local tales and fables that are present in many regions such as in India and China the most famous legend is the story of the Monkey King. That story even involve Buddha according to the story the Monkey King was a very mischievous, naughty and untrustworthy King he possess great kung fu skills his skill was unmatched by both humans and other creatures it was Buddha who successfully discipline and humbled the Monkey King that in the end the Monkey King became a very loyal servant and body guard of Buddha in his travel to the west.


As I said, if you strongly believe that all humans evolved from apes and that apes and humans are somehow related because of that then proof me which ape species did the many human race evolved from or which DNA, or why apes have stop evolving could it be that it was actually a Great Human not Great Ape that was the ancestors of both modern humans and modern apes?

 

I have already done this I believe in this thread.

I have posted a complete and comprehensive timeline and fossil record...but I will list a bit of this again for you with a link....http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chimpanzee–human_last_common_ancestor

The chimpanzee–human last common ancestor (CHLCA, CLCA, or C/H LCA) is the last species that humans, bonobos and chimpanzees share as a common ancestor.
In human genetic studies, the CHLCA is useful as an anchor point for calculating single-nucleotide polymorphism (SNP) rates in human populations where chimpanzees are used as an outgroup.[citation needed] The CHLCA is frequently cited as an anchor for molecular time to most recent common ancestor (TMRCA) determination because the two species of the genus Pan, the bonobos and the chimpanzee, are the species most genetically similar to Homo sapiens.

Now this is proof in the form of GENETICS....as this proof is MOLECULAR in it's nature.

AboveAlpha

 

You are allowing your PERSONAL feelings and beliefs interfere with our conversation that was specific to how by allowing all religions the right to place Religious Statues or Monuments on Public Property....it would be basically opening Pandora's Box.

You stated you didn't see a problem allowing this.

I stated I DID see a problem allowing this and I posted that since SATANISM IS IN FACT considered a RELIGION in the United States...if the U.S. allowed all religions to place statues or monuments on public property...we would have to allow Satanic Monuments and Statues right along those that are Christian, Hindu, Islamic, Jewish...etc...thus my argument holds water.

YOUR ARGUMENT DOES NOT!

Instead of simply taking what I have posted as a valid point....you have instead started talking about WHAT YOU BELIEVE SPECIFIC TO WHETHER SATANISM SHOULD BE CONSIDERED A RELIGION....which you believe it should not be.

THAT....is why I posted I didn't care what you or anyone else believes....and YOU quoted me and took my post's statement OUT OF CONTEXT!!!

Now....whether you or I like it or not....SATANISM IS CONSIDERED A RELIGION by the U.S. Government and all States in the Union.

Because of this if the U.S. allowed any and all religions to place Religious Monuments and Statues in or on public places....a Satanic Monument or Statue would have JUST AS MUCH RIGHT to be there as any other religions.

Now....I would REALLY like to know why you have forced me to waste so much time having to detail this out and separate all this issues just so members could understand exactly what was going on?

Why could you not simply just acknowledge the issue I brought up rather than ignoring it by bringing up YOUR BELIEFS which HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH THE ISSUE?

AboveAlpha

 

Nobody called you a gorilla or orang-utan.

Wow, what a train wreck of an argumentation.
"Apes" is an hypernym. It describes a number of related species with an highly evolved brain, opposable thumbs and no tail. Apes are not a species. Humans are a species. So are gorillas, bonobos, orang-utans and chimps. These species are biologically grouped under the term "great apes".
Would you say "I am not a mammal, I'm a human?" Because this follows the same logic.

Except for some extremely rare individuals, parrots don't talk. They repeat sounds. They don't understand what these sounds mean.
Dogs are men's best friend because they accept us as leaders of the pack. Try discussing that with an ape. If he disagreees, he might rip your arm out of the joint. Dogs don't do that.

And I really hate to be the one to tell you, but Lassie was a fictional dog.

 

All Dogs were originally WOLVES and through selective breeding Human's were able to bring about a FORCED EVOLUTIONARY PROCESS that gave use all the various breeds of dogs.

Now this process of obtaining hundreds of different species of Dogs from Wolves happened in a relatively shot period of time....about 50,000 years.

Homo sapiens having a common ancestor with Great Apes and ALL PRIMATES....Great Apes, Humans, Lemurs...etc....all had a single common ancestor as ALL ARE PRIMATES....took Millions of Years of Evolution.

AboveAlpha

 

That's unimportant for me because in case I would had been born in a little octopus-body on Eridani IV I had learned to move my eight tentacles and would be today a human being playing the sitar with eight tentacles. The concrete biology of a human being or wether a human being has blue or green blood instead of red blood makes for me personally absolutely no difference.

no comment

no comment

We are human beings with human rights.

Do you really ask what gives me the right to say "I am not an ape!"? That's a joke, isn't it?

I'm not a biologist. I don't have to know anything about biological taxonomies. Why should this be necessary in the daily life? If a young man falls in love then maybe he will say to the girl he loves: "Your are a godess!" - but for sure he will not say to her: "You are an ape!" - except he's one of the worst idiots the world ever had seen. By the way: Do you know what's the difference between Noah's Ark and the Titanic? The Titanic was constructed from professionals.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VL2mlQwUVb8

 

no comment

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xUkL5YQJfEo

 

No - not really, The taxonomy is in Latin. The hominidae are called "Echte Menschen" (true human beings) in German and are part of the Hominoidiae "Menschenartige" (=similiar to human beings). The expression "Affen" = "apes" come from "anthropoidae".

animalia
metazoa
eumetazoa
bilateria
chordata
vertebrata
mamalia
eutheria
primata
anthropoidae (Affen = apes)
catarrhini
hominoideae
hominideae
homo
homo sapiens

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hFNqEKNv_ZQ

 

"God particle" is a short form of "this *******ned particle". The name is normally "the Higgs boson". The scientists Peter Higgs, François Englert, Robert Brout, Gerald Guralnik, Carl R. Hagen and Tom Kibble postulated independent from each other in 1964 the theory of this boson. Now - 7*7 years later - it looks like they were right. Everything looks like as if the phycisists in Cern will say soon: "Yes - this boson exists". They all made a damned good Job since a very long time now. But everybody is still speaking about the creation of god in this context and not about an attribute of god if he's speaking about this particle.

The "common ancestor" reality in biology is very interestting for all life on planet earth. It shows for example that we are a part of this world here. But you are also not wrong. We are also part of the [still] not living nature. Dust we are and dust we will be. But now - today - we are in a special form here existing - and we need the whole gigantic universe and also lots of little nearly unvisible and unthinkable things - for our existance.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ouszUDY4aYQ

 

Why is that unimportant to you, you wish to remain ignorant?

Then you concede from the debate.

I asked what gave you the right to claim "Everyone knows that he is not an ape." when you aren't everyone, you're you.

Well, it's necessary when you're making absurd statements like humans aren't apes.

Moreso that one was a fictional tale about a 600 year old man building a boat with his family and the other was a true account of something that happened.

 

Apparently for a native German, you don't know much German. Hominidae are called Menschenaffen in German.

 

From your own link http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chimpanzee–human_last_common_ancestor

that prove two things:
1. Humans did not evolved from apes
2. The one common ancestor of humans and apes is unknown scientist are not sure if that common ancestor is an ape or human. That common ancestor could be a great human or great ape or maybe just human and just an ape both evolved separately on their own as scientist have not yet discover enough fossils they are still searching.

however, protein studies in the 1970s suggested the CHLCA was less than 8 million years in age. Genetic methods based on Orangutan/Human and Gibbon/Human LCA times were then used to estimate a Chimpanzee/Human LCA of 6 million years, and LCA times between 5 and 7 million years ago are currently used in the literature.

Because chimps and humans share a matrilineal ancestor, establishing the geological age of that last ancestor allows the estimation of the mutation rate.

The CHLCA is frequently cited as an anchor for mt-TMRCA determination because chimpanzees are the species most genetically similar to humans. However, there are no known fossils that represent that CHLCA. It is believed that there are no proto-chimpanzee fossils or proto-gorilla fossils that have been clearly identified.

Different chromosomes appear to have split at different times, possibly over as much as a 4 million year period, indicating a long and drawn out speciation process with large scale hybridization events between the two emerging lineages.[4] Particularly the X chromosome shows very little difference between Humans and chimpanzees, though this effect may also partly be the result of rapid evolution of the X chromosome in the last common ancestors.[5] Complex speciation and incomplete lineage sorting of genetic sequences seem to also have happened in the split between our lineage and that of the gorilla, indicating "messy" speciation is the rule rather than exception in large-bodied primates.[6][7] Such a scenario would explain why divergence age between the Homo and Pan has varied with the chosen method and why a single point has been so far hard to track down.

However, fossils of the exact last common ancestor would be an extremely rare find.

Hopefully now you can understand that humans did not evolved from apes and that apes and humans have their own separate ancestors base on known truth not base on theories. theories that scientist can not determine who or if there was this common ancestor they are not even sure how far back or how old this common ancestor goes back.

They use a common line if human and apes evolved from one common ancestor than how did the different human races and different ape species split, evolved, morphed or mutated into so many human races and ape species???

 

Yes I made a mistake. I meant hominoidea, which sounds very similar.
But you made one, too: hominidae are Menschenaffen, which means: Great Apes. (EDIT:GraspingforPeace was quicker, thanks man)
If you read the German wikipedia page, you will see that humans are one of the species that belong to hominidae.

Again, I don't see what the fuzz is about. The names used for biological classification are purely arbitrary. No one questions your humanity.

It is not necessarily in daily life. There is a scientific use of the word ape, which includes humans, and there is an everyday use, which doesn't. Simple as that.

 

Nope because I am human or the human kind. I have seen how others called or refer others as a gorilla or orang-utan or themselves.

Not as confusing as yours.

You mean youe human kind, me and my ancestors are from the "great human" not great ape"

You maybe a mammal that evolved or mutated into a human. Me I am a mammal too that evolved from human kind that is the difference between you and me we maybe both mammal both we have different evolutionary ancestors. Remember, the great ape is just a theory and if it is a theory I would prefer to accept the theory of the great human.

Have you try discussing this with an ape? I have not because they will always spit in your face and just like parrots and dogs apes does the same thing they will repeat what they are train to do. Ape spit and will rip you apart, dogs will chew you up how many people have been torn to pieces or seriously injured by dogs many and the reason they do not allow apes to roam freely is because...... you tell me......

So now you deny the TV show or a dog name Lassie ever existed if you can deny that than for sure your claim about the ape and human are all fiction and it never exited too, thank you.

 

I am proud to be a human, as well. But, basically what you're saying is that you're offended that human beings are also apes. Are you just as offended when I say that humans are animals? What about me saying that humans are tetrapods? Does that offend you as well?

Humans being apes isn't based on theory, it's based on taxonomic classification which is FACT.

You know what, you're right, we did evolve from apes.

Because there are other species of apes!

No, it isn't that simple. Do you seriously not understand classifications? All Chihuahuas are dogs, but that doesn't make all dogs Chihuahuas. Same thing.

What the (*)(*)(*)(*) did you just say? Brush up on your English.

 

There is no such "theory" as the "Great Human", you're just making (*)(*)(*)(*) up. Please, define what a "kind" is and define what a "Great Human" is. Why are you so offended that human beings have not always existed on this planet, but have evolved from lower organisms?

 

No matter how illogical I might find that, you're free to accept whichever theory you want.
I respect your belief, but don't pull up that kind of cardboard arguments.

I never said dogs can't be dangerous. But they're loyal to their owner and don't hurt anyone except if they're getting abused or trained to hurt people.
Apes that disagree with you will challenge your authority with a fight, and they will win. I only brought this up because of your "men's best friend" argument, but I think it's off-topic, so let's leave it at that.

Umm.. no I don't. The key words here are "TV show", "script" and "animal trainer".

 

I used a category of someone from Switzerland - but you are right. Another word for hominidae is Menschenaffe. On the other side: How do you know what a Menschenaffe is and what's the difference between a Mensch an Affe and a Menschenaffe if you are not a German?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jgRjdxbMtNE

 

No comment.

 

I made a mistake too. Hominidae are "Menschenaffen" . The former name for "Menschenaffen" was "Pongidae". In this new category "hominidae" are meanwhile not only shimpanzes, gorillas and oran utan - but also the Australopithecus and the homo erectus. I don't know why someone changed the categories and produced this confusion. .

I have some difficulties to see in the homo erectus a "Menschenaffe" - a "great ape" - how the english language simplifying says.

Madre mia.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=COSPhLyM5-Q