France : knife attack in an elementary school, man shouted "Allahu ackbar"

Discussion in 'Western Europe' started by VotreAltesse, Sep 7, 2019.

  1. VotreAltesse

    VotreAltesse Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Hello,

    the last week, one 19 YO boy was slaughtered by an Afghan "asylum seeker".
    https://www.latimes.com/world-nation/story/2019-08-31/knife-attack-france
    Now it's an elementary school that is targeted. It's not the first time islamic terrorists aim schools, that's what Mohammed Merah did and there were a failed attack in another school in Paris region.
    A Tunisian refugee slaughtered two very young women two year ago aswell in that same city.
    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-41461107

    There is no conventionnal newspaper source for now :
    http://freewestmedia.com/2019/09/07...ured-after-knife-attack-at-elementary-school/

    I'm pretty sure there will be some liberals to explain that it's white people fault. We will notice that almost always the victims are ethnic french. It's especially strange in a city like Marseilles where they're just another ethnic group among many.

    It's quite clear that they're trying to start a civil war. On the other side, I don't see how native french can bear this situation for a long time if their children is a target for the most extremist muslims.
     
  2. The Scotsman

    The Scotsman Well-Known Member

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    Wow.....crime...... what a startling revelation
     
  3. ThirdTerm

    ThirdTerm Well-Known Member

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    "We do not know if it is a knife or a pair of scissors," the prosecutor Xavier Tarabeux said on the spot specifying that two blades of scissors were found in a location nearby. The attacker, aged 17, was arrested around 8am near the city of Pauline, the spokesman of the Departmental Directorate of Public Security said. He was shirtless and described as "excited," according to the same police source. "It says that the person allegedly uttered "Allah Akbar", which remains to be confirmed in the context of what remains confused," the prosecutor said.

    https://france3-regions.francetvinf...devant-ecole-elementaire-pauline-1718647.html
     
    Last edited: Sep 8, 2019
  4. Paul7

    Paul7 Well-Known Member

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    He must have been reading the Koran.

    These inbred savages add nothing to any civilized nation.
     
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  5. VotreAltesse

    VotreAltesse Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Not anymore the last terrorist attack, a guy murdered 4 cops in Paris not so long ago. I don't open a thread for every terrorist attack in France as I would be banned for spamming.
     
  6. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Best to cull them then?
     
  7. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The police do not see this as a terrorist attack. They are seeing it as a criminal one. He was hearing voices after having smoked a large amount of cannabis. I guess they will need to get Psychiatric reports as well.


    https://www.scmp.com/news/world/eur...k-afghan-asylum-seeker-kills-one-wounds-eight
     
  8. VotreAltesse

    VotreAltesse Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I'm speaking of the one in Paris, in the police prefecture, carried by a man who converted to islam.
    You're speaking in the one in Villeurbanne, there is a lot of terrorist attacks in France, so it become harder and harder to tell of which one we are speaking.

    In that article, they says, that yes he was psychotic and paranoid, but that is paranoia and psychotic state was linked with "religious delirium", so yes, it's linked to an islamic attack, even if it wasn't qualified as "terrorist".
     
  9. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    So it is! I must have still been asleep.The mistake one was not considered a terrorist attack. I have checked out and sure enough terrorism seems to be an on going thing in France since the 18th C at least so I am thinking France must be used to terrorism like the UK is with a background of N Ireland. If there is copy catting going on by all the nutters in France it probably would be a good thing not to give them too much publicity. All countries have nutters but at the current time 'terrorism' seems to be the mode of conduct. A neo nazi tried to attack a Synagogue in Germany and killed two people outside when his home made weapons did not work as he had hoped. A man in Manchester terrified everyone the other day running around with knifes injuring people, thankfully none seriously. At one point they were thinking of calling him a terrorist but eventually they sectioned him clearly thinking he had serious mental health problems.

    The far right are now the fastest growing group of potential terrorists in the UK. Confidence in our democracies is getting near an all time low as the UK is run by crazies.
     
  10. VotreAltesse

    VotreAltesse Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    They're giving us the same song in France for more than a decade now, and there is no "far right" terrorism yet (in France).
    Mass migration is an extremly violent process for people, both the people who arrive or the one that are already here.
     
  11. The Rhetoric of Life

    The Rhetoric of Life Banned

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    If France protected its minorities, right?
    France has majority rights; may as well just forego judicial practices and allow the towns people to come with their pitchforks and torches - France is a terrible country!

    [​IMG]
    Just look at Charlie Hebdo's attack on immigrants and Muslims; terrible country.
     
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2019
  12. modernpaladin

    modernpaladin Well-Known Member

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    Allahu Akbar means 'Im crazy, not Islamic.' You must not have got the memo. ;)
     
  13. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The world has been moving from a period of relative enlightenment back onto the wheel of Samsara seemingly opening to a period of vast hells and hungry ghosts! ;)
     
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  14. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Now to something more mundane. You say
    France is arguably the birthplace of the modern far right with Generation Identity, the Identitarian Movement who have had links with the Front National for some time now.

    Here is the first of a series I watched a year or so ago. All are worth a watch.

     
  15. VotreAltesse

    VotreAltesse Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Enlightment is relative, every civilization on the verge of collaspe saw themselve as the pinnacle of civilization.
     
  16. VotreAltesse

    VotreAltesse Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Simply because there were a huge rise of criminality between the 50's and the 80's, it was multiplied by 3. It happened in the same time than France became "diverse". It's not a big secret that all ethnic groupe aren't represented the same in that.
    The process of immigration was extremly violet both for immigrants and native french. By the way, a lot of native french people were concerned by that rise of unsecurity and criminality, the answer of the left was "shut up, you're a fascist and a racist". In the same time, life became harder for the poorest of the white, as a lot of industries where removed to Poland and China. So by the way, when a party said "to hell immigration and EU", they answered to the concern people. Meanwhile, the left started to deny that white people could be targeted by racist assault, when many (poor) white people are assaulted in a weekly or daily way by some arabs and black people.

    Rarely the poor native inhabitant of a country were as ill treated and scorned as in France for the last decades. So yes, when you mistreat people, they rebel. Maybe not in the most appropriate way.

    I don't like the Front National, but for me, their remain the most sincere advocate of poor white people, even if they're corrupted to the core. The left became bourgeois, has only scorn for poor white people (when they have a few melanin, that's better), the traditionnal right is even more bourgeois. I would stick that for poor white people, the FN is the "least worst", and they're garbage.

    I won't watch a serie by a channel which is the great defenser of LGBT+ in the west, while the qatari government that fund them punish by death homosexuality. And to say what ? Mean racist native french, arabs and black people nice ?
     
  17. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I was of course referring to this as seen through buddhism. We went through a time when we were becoming more aware and more compassionate. We are without question back on the wheel and not only that but on a descent into the realm of Hells and the Hungary Ghosts. Remember we create our own world and equally destroy it ;)
     
  18. VotreAltesse

    VotreAltesse Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I don't know if we were that much aware and compassionate. I took some distance with buddhism, but from the buddhic point of view, I understand that we were in the kalpa of avidity, and it's the end. The hungry ghosts are the inhabitant of the state of avidity.
     
  19. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I have no idea what you are talking about.

    Oh, possibly you are talking about what happened in the recession in the 80's. Certainly here we had the National Front but the Tories as always homed in and managed to get the argument for themselves.

    In time soberness resumed and living still in a time when we valued intellectual research we discovered that the issues were being fired by racism including institutional racism. Strong action went in to heal that which was to a certain extent successful but those of that mentality still held on to their racism particularly in this country of people from Pakistan and Bengal. (I could tell you an interesting story about that when my daughter started school)

    Thatcherism of course removed the possibility of all to find a decent life and then parts of our cities descended into gangs, using mainly those most poor and vulnerable as has always been the case....but even here people had become much more aware of prejudice and how it affected people and made it impossible for them to integrate, instead forcing them to form an 'alternative society. Eventually the National Front died down.

    Then came 9/11 and the 'Pakis' became 'Muslims' and our short descent into unawakened, uninformed hatred of the other began. Don't get me wrong. New Labour had a big hand in that - letting go of its base who were first picked up by the British National Party. When I first came here they were here all the time trying to sow their views. Thing is they were too old fashioned. British people in the main felt proud that they did not get involved in fascism.

    Then we started getting polls suggesting the English people would accept authoritarianism as long as they believed it would not be violent.

    That's when the UKIP and Farage got going and the BNP and UKIP also spawned many other side groups like for instance Britain First. They appear to have been very successful in dividing the working class. I hear that in some places half the town has working people with the values of working together and half the town in raging against 'the other' and they do not like each other at all.

    I think now Britain is a broken country and I do not think resolving Brexit one way or the other will resolve it. We will I would think either come back together through Social Democracy led at first by Corbyn or we will descend into fascism and every thing that entails. Those who do promote violence do not even feel the need to hide it any more. If we go this way, I would think we will see human extinction long before 2100 - so it is in reality a death wish but those following it have thrown intellect, experts and facts out the window so do not care.

    I don't know enough about French History but it looks to me that you are bringing up modern day propaganda and trying to put it in the 50's. Most people did not even know in any real sense what racism was there. I am sure the French were involved in the things which were going on in the 60's including 68 and were not just hateful war mongers as you seem to be suggesting.

    You are not talking about the 50's to 80's you are talking about from the 80's concerning the extent to which you became involved in Globalisation and neo liberalism.

    Absolutely. People do react when you kill millions of them, destroy states and make several millions refugees. Most still though respond to how they are treated. Do you not think that the elite have found a humdinger of a way to stop the poor acting to change the source of their problems by getting them to instead blame an other - one in even more desperate need than themselves.

    For the first time in this reply you mention something which I was speaking about. I am sure you have told me before you like Marie Le Penn.

    they are using them.

    Votre Altesse, you are speaking in a racist way.

    What I said was that France with its creation of the Indentitarian Movement, which I understand T Robinson is involved now, was arguable the place where the modern Western Far Right began. I am not sure what you have been doing here. Giving me the reasons for it. I don't believe them. I believe they are the propaganda people have been given to drink so that the working class becomes divided with one part of it giving up its humanity instead of dealing with the real issue which is that Neo Liberalism is dead and can no longer provide for the people. It is neo liberalism not the colour of someone's skin which has cause the massive Western Inequality and that is the base of the problem.
     
  20. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I have never heard of that and of course there are different forms of Buddhsim. I never knew of it as a predictive religion. Indeed what I liked about it was its focus on experimentation and lack of dogma. All the realms on the wheel of life are false even those of the Gods. Whether this is the end is still the choice of the people of the world to make.

    Here is where I see the choice. We become more conscious and aware or we become unconscious and brutal and at this time due to climate destruction become extinct. Becoming more conscious and aware was very much the focus or orientation in the UK right up to 9/11. Living here we would look for the reasons for difficulties and try to resolve them justly. Now I would say that in the UK whether it was actually done or not, that was the psychology used by our Government. Almost the moment of 9/11 I heard Blair echoing Bush speaking of evil people. We had moved back to a mentality we had not had for a very long time. One which both psychology and spiritual experience had told us were false.
     
  21. VotreAltesse

    VotreAltesse Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Criminality rate in France was multiplied by 3 between 1950 and 1980.
    [​IMG]



    [quoI don't know enough about French History but it looks to me that you are bringing up modern day propaganda and trying to put it in the 50's. Most people did not even know in any real sense what racism was there. I am sure the French were involved in the things which were going on in the 60's including 68 and were not just hateful war mongers as you seem to be suggesting.

    I'm an isolationnist, I'm against "world cop" policy of western countries, and against things as Franc CFA. The least we act in other countries internal affair, the better it is.
    I don't like the way you consider arabs and black people, you see themselve as only "reactive", if there is any problem with them, it's because you treated them poorly. You don't seem to see them as responsible as white people.

    I'm pretty sure you're wrong, I would be really surprized I would have ever appreciated this crook.

    Yes, BTW. That's what politician do, they use hope and despair of people for their own interest, whatever is their political side.

    Calling the left bourgeois and saying that they scorn poor white people isn't racist.

    By the way it's not their colour of skin that play a role. By the way neo liberalism caused disasters in the west.
    I'm not blaming people for their colour of skin, or considering them as lower.
    However, the coexistence of different ethnico-cultural-religious group isn't something successfull. Northern african, subsaharian african, they have different cultural-religious values, and almost all of them don't feel they belong to the same ethnic group. Should we blame them for that ? By the way, we shouldn't. It's great to be muslim and algerian. I don't think that they're their place in France. Do I blame them for coming ? No. They come from extremly poor countries, that's natural for them to seek better in our more developped countries.

    Both of them are war criminals and deserve to end in an international tribunal.
     
  22. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    You would need to look into that because it looks very strange. You would need to look at whether more crimes were created, were reported and what they fell into. It looks like it has to be something to do with either more crimes being reported or more things being made criminal.

    what do you mean by that?
    Guessing at what you are meaning I probably agree with you there.
    I never even mentioned arabs and black people and I certainly do not see them as only 'reactive'. Please don't make things up.

    I have done nothing to them. I never suggested such a thing. Please don't make things up. What I did do was put your argument about 'whites' on the people you oppose. It fits at least as well.

    Now you are making things up again. You are the person who sees people depending on the colour of their skin and has to keep going on about it.

    I was alive and grown up then!




    I agree with that. However I was speaking about something deeper which had been going on and gradually changing the orientation of society. I just put proved wrong by psychology and spiritual experience but really this old way, this way as seeing yourself as right, the other as wrong has been shown to be simply another form of imperialism by history, psychology, political theory and sociology. What we are returning to is an uneducated form of banality. It is being used to stop change and to ferment hatred - and frankly at the time we can least afford it if anyone younger than 55 or so wants to see old age.


    no but separating people by the colour of their skin and creating a them and us, is.


    Its called white Supremacy. This is all old 30's stuff. People think it is new because we had moved so far away from that.

    You wanted them because you had jobs French people did not want to do so you asked people from your previous colonies to come and they did. More recently they have come because France has been helping to destroy their countries and make them refugees. You have invited people there. We know that how people settle in in new countries very much depends on how they are treated. You know I am very critical of how France has been with her immigrants. I haven't looked enough into how you have treated them since the 2015 attacks enough but the little I did, did not look good.

    You support Generation Identity?


    Is that Bush and Blair? Very true.
     
  23. Maquiscat

    Maquiscat Well-Known Member

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    It is quite obvious that France does not have sufficient knife control laws.
     
  24. VotreAltesse

    VotreAltesse Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Yes, or there was much more criminality. Strangely it happened moslty during Valery Giscard D'Estaing was president, and he made much more easy to immigrate to France.

    I'm against mass migration, I think that most things should be produced in thing and we should depend the less of other countries (and it should be true even for regions), that we sould limit our diplomacy to have good relationship with other countries, and don't intervene in the inner affair of other countries.

    Still, I never said that I liked her, and I have always seen as a corrupted woman

    No, saying there is different ethnic group isn't racism, saying that one is superior to another is racism, and I never pretended that.

    No, because I don't think that non white are inferior to white people, neither they are superior. White supremacist think they're inherently better than colored people, which isn't my point of view.

    No rich people wanted them because they wanted to starve poor white people, so they would accept any job for any wage.
    For "ill-treating" them, that's decades that most french people says they're tired of mass migration, that's decades that our rich people serving governments throw us more and more foreigners. That's decades that french people are tired of the high level of criminality and that's decades that the government do nothing.
    Basically, you're in the position "native people bad, immigrant nice".

    I don't know them very well, so I can't have an opinion. I know we have both hostility toward mass migration, but that's all.

    Yes.
     
    Last edited: Oct 15, 2019
  25. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I am sure there were other things going on. We need to be careful about putting links together like that. They usually aren't true. People at that time were coming to work.

    I believe that if we, as was done after WW2, invite people to our countries and give them citizenship then they have absolutely as much right to be there as anyone else - and that goes with their children.

    The problem with immigration is that the capitalist class like it when they want more workers and do not like it when they have less jobs. Now if someone looks like everyone else after they have been living in their new country for at most a generation, everyone just thinks they are a native being but if they do not look like everyone else then it is obvious that at some time they came from somewhere else either recently or have continued to mate with people who came from that area. Brexit was manufactured as a reaction to mass immigration. However that was massively mass immigration against European people, that is people who look like us. Not racist, people would think. However the weeks after them winning saw a massive increase in the number of people who looked less than white who were attacked or told to 'go home'. I am suggesting it is the way people look at a time when in this case the politicians are encouraging people to believe some 'other' is taking from them - taking their job, their house, their child's school place, their Dr and so on. Yes, people from Poland also suffered but the attacks and I am told the increasing attacks on people who are not white seems to be the biggest issue. Ever heard of a self fulfilling prophesy? If you go around telling people they are no good after a time they just may start acting as if.

    Japan has never gone for immigration because of their belief in the blood line. They believe in this so strongly that they do not want to even adopt children who do not have parents meaning they need to live in orphanages. Japan has different but at least as concerning issues as countries which have had a lot of immigration.

    Sudden mass immigration is of course bewildering to the people who invite them in and does not usually happen except when there is a specific need as in the Syrian Refugees. This can be dealt with and dealt with well but with no planning it became a red blanket to the bull of 'the other'.

    So I don't think it is about liking mass immigration on not. We rarely have sudden mass immigration and when we do we need to put up with it as best we can. Where we have given people citizenship they absolutely have the same right as us to call our home theirs whatever their colour. A Lebanese friends of mine put it this way - 'people are not cattle. You cannot call them when you need them and then just tell them to go back when you do not two generations later' so to some extent I find the 'mass immigration' thing a bit of a created problem. People have the right to talk about it, to discover how to make people feel comfortable so that they will integrate - and all those things were done during that more enlightened time I spoke of but people do not have the right to say 'right I have had enough of this group of people. They must go back to where their skin colour or religion hails from'. No. They have laid their bed and now they must work out a way to help all people of the society to work together and feel accepted into that society. What is going on now is the opposite. It is what was going on to the Jews in the 30's and is not only dangerous but no solution. It simply creates problems. IMO it is also a way of dividing the working class so that rather than working together about the real problem 'neo liberalism', they fight each other and so do not manage to make the changes which are necessary to make life acceptable for all.


    I didn't know that. I thought you were a fan of hers. Possibly just protecting her view. I do not know yet where you stand. Possibly you are still working it out?

    That of course was not what I was talking about. I defo thought what you were saying was racist so lets look back at what it was. It was from post 16 and I had been thinking this already simply because you were giving the arguments in a way those trying to get people to think in a racist way do (I am not accusing you of that) - but the usually things like you suggesting that the left responds to issues by saying 'shut up you are racist'. No they don't but that is almost a regular line now to stop debate on racism. If someone is doing that my sensors are picking up that the person saying it may be racist or at the very least is seeing things through the veil of race. You then were talking about the white people of France, singling them out which again is pretty much a cliche in racism. This race that race. When all the people of France are involved, I would say should all be identified as French. This I think was where I felt the need to say something

    and it goes with what I said before. Your argument is embedded in racism. It argues for the white person against those of colour. You may not feel a racist person and may act well towards people regardless of whether they are blue or green but you are arguing from a racist position imo.

    I agree. I did another of my not reading properly and thought you had said you thought they were lower than you. When I read it later I discovered that you had said you did not think so. White Supremacy is without question growing again but you were not expressing such a position. Please accept my apologies.


    Again stop arguing by race. 'Corporate Power wants more people so that it can lower the wages of everyone irrespective of the colour of their skin.

    This is just another example of the propaganda which the hard right have put out. There is nowhere where I have said or would say 'native people bad' - or indeed 'immigrant nice'. I hope I have managed to begin to give you an idea about my real position in this post.
     
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2019

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