I concede this much to the Christians among us

When people sojourn in this life, they generally know to seek pleasure and avoid pain/humiliation. But we are subtly reminded that it may also be important how one is remembered after they are gone. Unfortunately, that is also a fool's pursuit because folks' assessments can fluctuate and vary widely. You know of the expression, "a household name". There is no more readily-recognized name on Earth than that of Jesus of Nazareth. He is almost universally remembered as a saint and a martyr, and a friend/beneficiary to the people, as well as an enemy of tyranny.

But to say that he rose from his grave adulterates the lore! (It bears a parallel to claiming that the 2020 election was "stolen from Trump".) When you begin ascribing phenomena to sorceries that are deemed "good magic" then you open the door wide to corruptions beyond measure. Be keen to realize that the evilest of Mafia dons are sure to put up a front of decency, philanthropy, altruism.

Those are my thoughts.

 

Another anti-Christian thread. I'm shocked.

 

every religion and philosophy that mankind has invented is premised on one of 2 bases.

1. life is short, so we must concentrate only upon enduring values and things greater than ourselves or

2. life is short so we must "gather the rosebuds" and enjoy what little wqe have.

what happens when, as our more affluent are discovering, life is no longer short, but can be extended almost indefinitely by technology?

 

You thinking christians (of which I was born and raised) are special and above criticism and/or ridicule. I’m shocked.

 

Do you condone bigotry?

 

I don’t condone any bigotry. But what does that have to do with my comment?

 

You comment condones bigotry.

 

Nope. If that was the case then you condone bigotry

 

Another misunderstanding on your part. I'm not surprised.

Should Christians be protected from well-deserved criticism?

 

Seems he does. Or maybe he just doesn’t understand the difference between criticism and bigotry.

 

I haven’t figured out what exactly you’re conceding. Can you be more clear? All I’m getting is Jesus is remembered as a good guy. Not much of a concession unless I’m missing something

 

All religions use faith. Faith is the substance of things hoped for, the things not seen. We believe that Christ raises from the dead in three days because of our faith. People who follow Shinto have faith in providing blessings to the Gods for success in their businesses and life because they have faith. Muslims have faith in what is written in the Quran and those that interpreted the Quran in the various hadiths. And the list goes on and on. And that faith is something that is better beyond this life whether it is in reincarnation or in "heaven" or Elysium or wherever.

 

So what was it, that you were conceding to the Christians? Did I somehow miss that?

I haven't been Christian for several decades, now, but your comparison of believing in God, to believing conspiracy theories, is a massive fail. For things that take place where evidence should abound, evidence can be expected. But science is as unable, as is religion, to verify anything about the hereafter, including whether there is one, or if there isn't one. I understand your way of thinking: that the onus of proof should always be on those making the positive assertion, not on those who deny it, for lack of anything evidential, to disprove it. But we just do not have the tools to know, once we move from our own dimension, to that other, supposed realm. Therefore, there obviously would be no indications, on which to predicate the doubt, due to lack of proof.

Put another way, religious ideas are all hypothetical. For an imperfect analog, look at the way that mathematicians have shown that this or that number of dimensions could, theoretically, exist. While one might accept the mathematics, that is not the same as accepting that this number of dimensions do exist. We only accept the possibility, based on the math. But what sort of math, must apply, in a spirit world? No one can say. So we have to acknowledge, we don't know what is possible: and, therefore, what is impossible. Any religion could potentially be right, even if we feel sure that it is not. This will always be something that for anyone to declare he knows, will be an unfounded act of hubris. That goes as well, for those who claim to know what does not exist.

There is far too much, basic info about our own planet, even, for any truly reasonable person to think they could have certainty about anything beyond our own visible universe. We do not even know what is at the greatest depths, at floor of our own oceans. We know almost none of the life in rainforest canopies. In fact, biologists estimate that we have only identified about 10% of the living things sharing the planet with us, of current species. So, is it not utter foolishness, when so many things (the 90%, of undiscovered species ) are accepted to exist, even though we have no direct sign of them, for one to claim that he does precisely know, however, what exists beyond the veil of life?

 

No you missed nothing

 

Here is a treatise that I wrote 13 years ago. I don't want to be quizzed on it though.

The Ascendant - age 58 - speaks of Nirvana firsthand​

Remember that Nirvana is the stated goal of religions that profess the desirability of ESCAPE from the vicious cycle of eternal transmigration of the soul beyond death. Nirvana has everything to do with that and nothing whatsoever to do with one's moral code, behavior or so-called 'clean thinking'. A modicum of good intent is presumed.

Nirvana is basically one's blessed return to Plain Life, and I cannot emphasize enough the word "plain". Your body is something natural and mortal and when it dies, your sojourn is over, plain and simple. You haven't lent credence to any falsehoods, haven't become complicit in any devilish schemes, such as any schemes that promise eternal life or reincarnations; nor ceded your natural authority to any 'powerful' consortium or to any religion per se. Your body is certainly NOT "the temple" of any 'spirit', but it is merely part-and-parcel of the Natural World, indistinguishable from animals, forests, clouds or the wind. Oh you can still get angry at times but there's no larger scheme by which to 'get even' because life is KNOWN to be a zero-sum game... you'll receive unearned benefit in one area of life, and suffer undeserved punishment from another (the opposite) side/province of the sphere. Enjoy the first and learn to accept the latter unbegrudgingly. Once you dispel entanglement/possession by the Devil you'll KNOW that you're home free and clear. It's your detractors who were sent from down below, not you!

But whoa! you'll be a sitting duck for any sorceries the Devil can whip up, wherein the Dark and Invisible 'spirit' realms revolt against your INNOCENT egress from this slimy existence. The sorceries will always feign an unruly congress of souls with one image (like a son of man) acting the white knight. It's a singular charade, BELIEVE ME, the Devil's last DESPERATE effort to recall you to its service everlasting. But no! you're too smart for that; you don't find witchcraft awe-inspiring or even engaging, so when your number's up you'll die, period, nothing more. That's the way it will be because the Dark Invisible Realm seeks only to harvest your credence, however slight, and thus your engagement and thence your corruption -- oh it's just horrible! But wait, you know that you're already home free and clear. Eventually the sorceries weaken and peter out, though perhaps never fully, and one must accept the inevitability of only *posthumous* recognition of the righteousness of one's sojourn.

Religion is an unwitting accomplice to the Dark Realms ie. evil. Here's just one minor example. The scriptures say "the sow is washed only to wallow in the mire". (Yo, look it up if you're not familiar). That's a lie that gets folks to lend credence to the belief that recall is inevitable even after Nirvana is achieved. It's such total crap, all of it; for there is no mental test, no ethereal venue, no ongoing process of any kind but for the despised witchcraft, the Devil's assault of imagery and torture and words into your head and about your person. Hold fast by not holding at all, for the arena and all its players, though sublimely compelling, are a fake.

Your detractors are most likely your kinfolk, for they are but reincarnated reprobates from yesteryear looking to hitch a ride with a newborn superstar as yourself. Get free or they'll surely drag you down down down. You are the planet's honored guest for just this one go-around -- accept His Gracious Terms and ENJOY.

So Nirvana is the ultra-PAINFUL path wherein you realize that The Creator doesn't set moral standards for us. Alas, virtue is its own reward and not a passport into any 'higher' society. If you transgress, the police and local prosecutor will mete out your come-uppance. The so-called 'soul' is a rental at best... turn it back in when you're done. Have nothing to do with cerebral venues, spiritual or any unseen realms, demigod worship, image worship ...and you'll again be one of God's Natural Creatures, a true unbeliever, disavowed of filthy magic and exempt from dreaded afterlives. You'll be on schedule, but not clamoring, for your personal appointment with the Grim Reaper. It sounds mixed up but that's the way the truth the light. You have to be in the actual shoes of the ascendant to know, and yes boast, of all this.

Note: the sorceries cited in the above are stronger in this age than ever in the past. I suppose it's partly because of TV and the species becoming so jaundiced and so disconcerted in its Last Days. Anyone who ascends above the Devil's grip is likely to really catch hell. The evil is real and the sorceries do inflict real pain. But it's well worth it. You've won the gold mine, righteous egress; be not worrisome that others got the shaft.

 

Typical another leftist meme based on wishful thinking

 

Mark 13:13
Luke 23:34

 

Asking you why you posted this, is not, in your mind, "quizz(ing)" you about it, I hope?

My post's main theme, if you did not discern it, was that it is impossible for anyone to know what is the truth of the hereafter, until one is at that stage. So, I am to believe that, because you claim to be speaking "firsthand" about Nirvana, that you have returned from the dead? If that is the type of question that you wished to avoid answering, I think that is a very unreasonable expectation; it is like telling someone, "I need to perform an emergency medical procedure on you, right now, or you'll die!" but to not want to be quizzed, on whether or not you are a doctor.

*This sounds like your own, ensnaring, theology.

Not that it sounds bad-- though it does leave a lot of questions, unaddressed.

 

You know what I saw after the recent hurricane here? Tons of church groups helping in every form they could but what I did not see was a single atheist group helping anyone.

 

Nirvana is an achievement that occurs during life. I don't know how you derive "returned from the dead" from my writings, sorry.

 

Atheists generally don't have groups. Plus

 

As much as you progressives love to disparage Christianity this town was flooded with religious groups helping in the aftermath of the storm.

 

Then I'll show you:

That could certainly be read as a description of what happens to one's "essence" when they die: dust to dust, once again part of enveloping Nature.

You "don't know how" I thought you were talking about death, from the words, "EGRESS from this slimy existence?"

"When your number's up you'll die, period." Yeah, you're right-- what could lead anyone to think that what you'd written, had to do with death?

But if we aren't talking about death, why would it be the Devil's "last DESPERATE effort to recall you...?"

Again, your words could be taken to mean recall to another incarnation, or recall to heaven/God. Either way, they certainly don't seem to be talking about a breathing meditation, which I guess is something like this is supposed to be.

Take responsibility for the vagueness, of your own text-- if you are such an enlightened being.

That's how, I perceived that you seemed to be talking about death.

 

Not me, I vehemently hate ALL religion.

 

All I can say is remember mark 13:13.