July 1st The Countdown

Yes, so it seems that your unsupported opinion is far greater source than several people who are charged with running the SYSTEM you proclaim as a good one...LOL how about something of substance? oh that is right, you have none.

 

You haven't looked into this indepthly have you Garry. Talk about blindly following!!

You need to do some hard work. The calculator will be handy............Once you work it all out, get back to me with your honest calculations. It's not rocket science. You just need to work out things for yourself rather than listen to rhetoric and mantras! I've provided the source that will provide you with the figures below!

At what stage have I alluded to the the cost being absorbed by the big polluters. Have you not read what I wrote. It is being facitious, but surely you can read between the lines.....Wow!!!! you can't be serious man! You guys are so superficial, seriously!!

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/ne...carbon-tax-compo/story-e6freuy9-1226321169512

 

It is day 17 and Abbott blames the carbon price for the dismal downturn in tourism.......lol

 

That's a bit of a reach. Everyone knows that our high Australian dollar is the axe over tourisms head. The carbon tax won't help, but can't be blamed for the downturn.

Was chatting with a family member last night who works in Canberra. Works in the right place if you know what I mean. She was saying that the word is that the Libs are getting a little nervous with abbotts leadership. Watch this space.

She is Labor aligned however. Lol.

Perhaps this is why the government has slipped into campaign mode. Hmmm!

 

Apparently I have looked deeper than you. Blindly following?

So I am to work both sides of the debate? oh that is right your rhetoric is enough for the world isn't it. Perhaps you could provide the evidence of your claim that a pensioner will be $170 better off? but no, all we get is your rhetoric telling me to do your work for you. come on then tell me, How many self funded retired people qualify for a seniors health benefits card? Answer that one.

LOL...so that is your supportive evidence? I was thinking you where actually going to provide something of substance.

apparently, we demand evidence from you and you can not provide anything but your own rhetoric.

Oh and this provides both sides of the story as well doesn't it.

 

Days to go and I can not see who the 250or is it 500 top polluting Companies are the ones that pay for this whatever ,for it is a Tax without revenue or its ANOTHER tax on the Working Class NOT the rich ,gee i wonder which way this is falling ,DER!

President of the 52nd state of america Julia Gizzard,and tony BIG EARS mad monk Abbott ,both know that whatever happens NO COMPANY WILL BE PAYING FOR IT!

 

Of course the big companies aren't but as always stated it is about emission reduction! It is a very smart system that looks after those of lower economic status but challenges those from the higher end to strongly consider alternatives, especially as they will be able to afford it. Everybody wins eventually. Australia is finally leading the way on something, which will also put us in the box seat to innovate and produce energy alternatives, and stake a large claim in the world market.

 

The purpose of the carbon tax ETS is to reduce CO2 pollution is it not?, because we are told by alarmists that we are at the tipping point and if we dont do something about it we will cause irreversible damage to the Earth's atmosphere.

Now how can a carbon tax ETS which allows the big polluters to go on their merry way polluting so long as they purchase carbon credits so on paper they look as though they have reduced their carbon foot print when in reality they will be increasing it every year do anything to save us from this knife edge we are constantly told about.

Really dude do you think this is the best course of action to save us from detruction?

Or is the carbon tax/ETS the first New World Order tax that will be imposed on all peoples of the earth by the globalists you know the one world one government mob.

I mean even the top people in the IPCC have admitted they,

THEY WILL DISTRIBUTE THR WORLD"S WEALTH through climate policy!

And that climate policy and the Environment are not related.

There's only one way to view the wrold these days and thats by taking your political blinkers off.

 

Yep and we listen to some hothead who like yourself who is trying his best to spread negativity due to his dislike of Gillard and the perception she told a "LIE". Common Dumb. You've tried every website and every trick in the book. If you can gather together a substantial group of noted experts who oppose then let us know. Otherwise, you aren't convincing anyone but right wing beliefs.

 

15 days to go, but who's counting.....lol! There is an Eerie silence.....where's tony?

 

C'mon yourself Vigilante. There was no perception she lied, she bloody well did. And she copped to it.

But you are right Abbott is conspicuously quiet. I wonder if his promise becomes a lie when it comes to rescinding the carbon tax. Its a whole lot of dough to let go.

Should be an interesting twelve months ahead. Which ever way you sway.

 

She didn't lie. She never ruled out a market based mechanism to reduce carbon, such as an ETS. However she ruled out a carbon tax. The coalition have lied and continually lie and people like you are mesmerized by Abbott's mantra, supported by his colluding buddies in the media. Numerous times she explained this, surely you aren't that challenged slippery. Again, this is one of the newspaper articles prior to the election in which she states this. It's been posted on here previously but for the life of me, no one must be reading. Ziggy has alluded to it time and time again: http://www.theaustralian.com.au/nat...on-price-promise/story-fn59niix-1225907522983

 

Firstly there is no need to get touchy when someone disagrees with your opinion.

Secondly I believe, as I and many others have stated before, that what is coming in on July 1 is a tax and is different from the ETS. So therefore when I heard her say that there would be no tax on carbon with her government it came as no surprise that her government have rescinded that promise and on July 1 we are lumped with, you guessed it, a tax on carbon.

Now I know you and Ziggy are pushing the line that they are one and the same. Well they are not. They both differ in economic structure and the government has been very careful not to say that they are the same thing. In fact you two are the only ones I have heard state this.

And as far as Abbott and his mantra are concerned, save it, as I have told you once before, I don't like either of them. I don't like their lies and arrogance.

Basically you keep saying people who disagree with you are Abbott lovers who are mesmerised with this so called mantra. Perhaps its you who is mesmerised by Gillards lies. It cuts both ways Vigilante. You see we are all on here giving our opinions, and not everyone agrees, doesn't make them wrong, that's their opinion.

You can post all of the newspaper articles you like. I heard her tell the lie, as we all did. Then she apologised stating some crap about being what's good for the country and the environment. The end.

 

Firstly, I tend to get carried away, so thanks once again for the reminder to pull my head in! I've got to watch how I respond to reasonable people of which I am genuinely starting to pick up that you are slippery!

Anyway, there is a distinct difference between a carbon price and a carbon tax, despite the fact that it looks, smells and whatever other senses can be used to describe its embodiment. It is essentially a fixed price ets.

* A carbon price allows trading of permits between emitters. It apparently was recommended to ensure stability in the market heading into market based pricing. Anyway, this provides further potential for rewards for emitters via selling credits.
* A carbon tax does not enable trading of permits, therefore just becomes government revenue, without any real rewards for emitters who reduce carbon emissions.

Therefore, in my eyes and my reasoning gillard was not telling lies, the coalition and media are spinning one big furfie!

 

Thankyou Vigilante for your civility.

I understand to float something we must first establish a base price. This is where we are being told that we require a fixed price for an indeterminable amount of time. This is where the arguement gets tricky. If we have a fixed price for a period of time, I understand that no credits would be traded in that time. With that in mind and in view of your arguement that would make this fixed priced term what ? An ets or a tax ?

 

Yep, you're right slippery! I was a little outdated! However, if this fixed priced period was simply to line government coffers I would consider it to be a tax. It is actually used specifically for purposes related to the carbon reduction, but as you stated is important to set a base price, as was strongly recommended due to failings of the EU's ETS..

 

"..................Yep, you're right slippery! I was a little outdated! However, if this fixed priced period was simply to line government coffers I would consider it to be a tax. It is actually used specifically for purposes related to the carbon reduction, but as you stated is important to set a base price, as was strongly recommended due to failings of the EU's ETS..

 

What! is there 5 days to go?......I'm heading to Coober Pedy just in case!

 

What, do you expect some bomb to go off? Nobody has been stating such, but they have been saying that it is the beginning to the end of the Labor party in politics.

 

Common Garry, it has been doom and gloom! It could be the beginning of the end for labor, but there will always be hope while abbott is opposition leader.

 

I think we can agree on the Abbott thing, but I may be wrong, There maybe a better alternative come along for Liberal party sooner than we all think, as long as there is no major change to the political scene in the near future.

I would consider that should the ALP, Green and independent coalition continue full term (which I would imagine happening) Abbott, is extremely least likely to be leading the Liberals to that election.

 

Both leaders are on the nose, but the liberals won't want to be in a position where they could lose the unlosable election. For the life of me I can't think of anyone but Malcolm Turnbull leading the opposition. Pyne and bishop are as militant as Abbott. Hocking just seems to be a little slow on the uptake and has allowed Abbott's style of politics ruin his character.

 

I Agree, in my opinion there is nobody else but Turnbull, I am not sure yet of if he has the support. He seems to have grown from his previous experience and would appear to me the better for it. His attitude has grown toward the position, and now he would be the only real lead of the Liberal party for the next election. However, Again this is only my opinion, but I do wonder when something is going to come forward as alternatives are light on the ground especially the people you point out.

 

I have very little doubt liberals will win with Turnbull as their leader.

 

You could stand a wild boar pig against Juliar at the next federal election and it would win in a landside. Just like in Queensland and NSW federal Labor will get the boot big time.