Nobody Hates Trump...

LMFAO!!!

Now THAT's the entertainment I'm paying for!

I think we've got a contender for Post of the Year alongside Vman12's Not-So-Excellent Adventure in Time Travel...

http://www.politicalforum.com/index...and-will-bother-trump.565546/#post-1071246154

 

Until obvious abuses are dealt with severely, institutions tacitly surrender their legitimacy.

 

Agreed Still laugh out loud occasionally.
I vote Sanskrit #1

 

Duly noted.

I'm going to have my cake and eat it, too, and vote for both.

I should start a thread on this...

 

1. There's a difference between "reigning in a runaway bureaucracy" & utterly killing that bureaucracy so it no longer functions at all. America has a population of over 330 million people. A defunct government is of no benefit to a nation with that many people. That kind of population requires a substantial government, just to maintain order. But of course governments do more than just maintain order. They provide many diverse services, all respected & desired by their citizens.
2. I know of no such American leaders. Can you name a few to give me a clue, along with what they did to deserve your intense criticism?
3. Brexit does seem to reflect the same world view as Trump & his minions hold. I see it differently. With the internet promoting (even requiring) more globalization across national borders, the trend of history is toward more universal interaction involving different cultures working together in ways never before seen. I think that's going to continue. I don't think it's planned, but is a result of advanced & advancing technologies that open new avenues of human exchange that are immensely attractive & intriguing. I think eventually the old idea of separate national governments will become obsolete, along with individual associations with & loyalty to, individual nation states. I think that trend is already well under way, & will be far advanced by 2075.
4. I agree. But America (& probably several other countries) have gradually enriched & empowered a few of their wealthiest families at the overall expense of the working classes in their citizenry. That's NOT a positive development, & surely one that will elicit an uncomfortable response from those left out. Actually, that's already happening with the election of Trump. But the electorate didn't realize that Trump was a core part of that privileged few, responsible for their pain. Hopefully, they'll learn before the 2020 election. But as I say in #3 just above, I think technology is making individual nation states increasingly obsolete. And that factor will become increasingly important as time passes.
5. One world government would be far less complicated or intrusive than the more than 100 individual national governments now, fighting each other over more intrusive ways to afflict their isolated populations.

 

Well finally sentence that doesn't use Trump and crap interchangeably

 

I clearly stated in my post that there are individuals in the Democratic party who harbor hatred for Trump. I said Pelosi, most Democrats & myself don't. You can either accept that truth, or ignore it & bury yourself in your own imaginative reality, like Trump so often does.

And, Obama was a man of integrity, honesty & commitment to his oath to the Constitution of the U.S. Trump is (has) none of those. History will record Obama as far superior to Trump as an American President.

 

Meh, just because he could read from a teleprompter. The 'Constitutional Scholar' said he couldn't use his pen and phone for DACA for 1 1/2 years because that would be unconstitutional before he did it. He sent pallets of cash to Iran because he couldn't do it legally through the banks. He got Americans killed with Fast and Furious. He let the JV team explode in the ME. I could go on but your savior isn't as great as you want to believe.

 

There are more ways to deal with abuses than enact another abuse as punishment. Psychologists have known for decades that we get better results with every kind of person using positive feedback rather than punishment. Instead of simply seeking punishment & the infliction of pain, why not simply acknowledge the fault & find positive ways to fix it so it doesn't occur again? That way, everybody wins.

 

First, I never claimed Obama as my "savior." He wasn't. He had his faults, but he was a good man, trapped in an economic crisis he played no part in making, and did a good job with the limitations he faced while in office. I admire him. I don't worship him like Trumpsters do Trump.

 

To increase human happiness. To preserve the wonder and beauty of Western Civilization and other civilizations.

Many Trump supporters are, certainly. Many would start a war to preserve their freedom and culture.

 

Trump may be a negative force in your life. Others may fee differently.

Nothing is inevitable. There is no such thing as progress. You can't fix all wrong things.

You want to see the future of globalization, look at China: strict social control and a loss of individuality. The only way to maintain a large diverse society is through totalitarianism: everyone must be kept in line.

 

1.Trump isn't within a million miles of killing the largest most expensive bureaucracy the world has yet seen. 20% of Us workers work for state, federal, local,and county governments directly. Another few percent have as their job description filling out compliance paperwork for one or the other of our four levels of government and trying to sort out which of as many four mutually exclusive sets of regs take precedence in any given situation and it isn't always the feds.

2. The first campaign speech I remember was 1958, when Adlai Stevenson tried to convince American voters. The Dems since Kennedy have spent an inordinate amount of time calling Republicans Nazis, fascists, stupid, racists, and any other awful claptrap they could thing of ever since. And it's been an equal opportunity verbal beat down by virtually every left of center politician, and the only thing the neo cons and Bush's ever did was apologize to the bully boys and nasty girls. Pardon me if I don't get all choked up over the political demise of both of the latter set. As for selling out the country a piece at a time. Please what other reason is there to send billions of dollars to world's leading sponsor of Terrorism? Helping fund the NK nuclear program? Our failure to figure what China was up to long before Trump was elected?
3. Lovely fantasy, get back to me when Iran renounced trying to claim the world for the Shia version of Islam, China, renounced its dream of trying to puppet the rest of the world to save themselves from the results of a second Boxer rebellion, NK gives up on nuclear blackmail to acheive its ambition to unify Korea under the rule of the family Kim, Russia gives gives up on their grand plan of the last 500 or so years.
4.You couldn't be more wrong. The hollowing out of the middle class was the result of high taxes and a massive regulatory overburden
5. Again one world government will not replace national governments. Look at the EU for an example. The national governments weren't done away with, another even less responsive and I'd say less responsible government was simply layered on top of all the rest.

 

Really??

You want to give them 'attaboys' for conspiring to interfere in an election?

I don't know what to say.

 

You see? It isn't the Democrats or the liberals who are thinking about inciting a war. It's the far right extremists & Trumpsters. The thing about war is that it's outcome is always unpredictable. All you need to do is look at Viet Nam, Afghanistan, & even Iraq to see that truth. None of those wars worked out to deliver what America entered them to achieve.

 

No, the Democrats want to wear the boot stomping on a human face, forever. In all the wars you cited, the underdog wins and Trump's deplorables are the underdogs here.

They are fighting for their families and their way of life. You are fighting to suppress them to advance an elite agenda. You sure you want to do that?

 

1. Trump is a negative force in ALL our lives. It's just that some Americans aren't perceptive enough to figure that out.
2. Nothing is inevitable? Tell that to anyone dealing with a terminal disease. I think human rights in America have progressed greatly since 1865. You're right, you can't fix all wrong things--not all at once at any rate. But you can fix a given number of them at any given time. Life is a process, not a destination. Let fixing what we can along the way, be part of that process.
3. I disagree. First, China is a poor example because it's not representative of globalization. It's an example of individual nationhood/statehood. The forces at play are quite different. Globalization is at work showing us that we are all part of one race--the human race. We are all human. We share far more in common with each other than we have as differences. The more we interact, the more we realize these truths. The more we interact, the less reason we have for conflict. The human race has far more to offer any of us than any single race can offer. There's NOTHING inherent in globalization that threatens the outcomes you describe in China. That's just unsubstantiated & unnecessary fear. You can do better than that.

 

Perhaps that's an illusion.
You can feed them, house them, give them money, increase their wealth, increase their power...
You can change their situation, but not increase their happiness.

You mean all countries would look the same with globalization? That does seem to be happening. But maybe other cultures would prefer it that way.
I don't know.

I completely agree with that. But do they know who the real enemy is?
Is simply getting rid of the lefties gonna solve their perceived problems?
Or will it make their problems even worse? I don't think the left is their enemy.
But I do think there are those that hope to benefit from the division.

 

1. What is actually wrong with having 20%+ of all Americans working for, or connected to government jobs? In your mind, is every other type of employment better? I've know many government employees who took great pride & experienced considerable satisfaction, in working their government jobs. Many felt they were directly or indirectly helping others in some way. I've known & experienced several jobs personally that were far less satisfying, or beneficial to others, in the private sector). I'm clueless how or why you would assume government jobs were any less important or personally satisfying than the private sector versions.
2. I read & reread your post above #2, but was unable to figure out exactly what you were telling me. Sorry. I gather you feel all liberals enjoy calling conservatives Nazis, fascists, stupid racists, & other derogatory names. I'm a liberal & I don't do that. I will state my disagreements, but I try to avoid derogatory name calling, because I don't see that as productive or respectful. But as a liberal, & a Democrat, I can't tell you how many times I've seen or heard Trump call his opponents demeaning names. Simply by supporting him, you endorse such behaviors. I can tell you, having Trump call me & other liberals demeaning names, is no more pleasant for me than having liberals do that to you. I suspect you & I are on the same side here. We should enjoy it.
3. The globalization process is still in its early stages. There will be a lot of resistance from established nation states--probably including our own. Remember, it's a process, & it will take decades at least.
4. Your theory is too simplistic. Taxes alone, regulations alone, or taxes & regulations together, are none powerful enough to explain the extreme disparity of wealth that is now afflicting this country. It was caused by a long history of laws made by wealthy politicians, designed to benefit the wealthy class in every manner possible, decade after decade--generation after generation. Something is seriously wrong with American capitalism. It has become so unfair, working only for the wealthiest families in our country, at the expense of everyone else. It's complex, but it involves far more than your post would indicate.
5. I refer you to my answer #3 just above. It applies here as well.

 

What is happening in China is also happening in the US. A handful of global corporations are controlling what we see and is spying on us.

I don't want to see a global culture. I want variety and that requires separate nations that order their affairs in accordance with their culture.

 

They think left is their enemy. And I think they are right. The left supports the globalization that exported their jobs overseas, imported scab workers to undercut their wages, refuses to protect US corporations through protective tariffs all of which benefits the global elite.

The left attacks their churches, seduces their children into transsexualism and insults their intelligence by telling them they don't know what is good for them.

Who do you think is the real enemy?

 

Then what happened to the dog?

 

Lol, tries to scare people about totalitarianism . . . by spouting and agreeing with totalitarian propoganda. Comedy gold.

 

1. So your good with four other Americans having to come up with enough money to pay a fifth??? Plus another 6% on welfare? Plus another 6% who are doing little more than filling out government forms but don't contribute to the company's production save by keeping the bureaucrats at Bay. And don't forget the ruinous cost involves far more than just the salaries which are frequently higher than similar jobs in the private sector because they are all unionized. 2.Not all leftist just politicians. There are nonpoliticians as well. But all leftists. And the point sir the division this were created by the left in pursuit of raw political power. To the extent Trump js made it worse he has done so by refusing to put up with leftist calumny.
3. You sir are dreaming bureaucracies never get smaller short of the sort of world spanning apocolypse that inhabits our nightmares.
4.Again you misapprehend what's at play here. High taxes and regulations drive money toward wealth preservation schemes making hedge fund managers and estate planners rich but leaving Joe average competing for work in a a labor market with far more job seekers than jobs which depresses wages. Increasing minimum wage makes that situation worse by further discouraging start ups and small business expansion.
5. The problem is the Chinese are interested in globalization that the don't run lock stock and barrel.

 

Well, it’s interesting to visit progressiveland sometimes. But some of us must go back and live with reality so that we can rescue the world when such ideas fail again. You would think the period between WW1 and WW2 would have been enough of a lesson we wouldn’t want to go back down that road. I guess not.

Yes, LE ability to violate the law with impunity at times is definitely a problem. It seems to be almost as bad with politicians.

It’s good to see you in pursuit of truth. It would be interesting to know how you know there isn’t truth in the statement you disliked in that thread. I don’t remember any proof from either side.

Personally I don’t see disinformation as the problem. I see the intentional educational format producing a society unable to determine if something is accurate or not as the problem. We are past the point of no return now. Nobody can think critically about anything anymore. Disinformation is nothing new. The way people are programmed to handle it is the problem.