Obama Has Been Defeated By The Taliban

How did the Obama Surge in Afghanistan work out for him? The Taliban are playing him for a fool because they are smarter than he is. Obama is in the process of surrendering to the Taliban just as Uncle Sam surrendered to the North Vietnamese. Any questions?

 

At some point, you have to cut your losses.

We've been there for over 10 years. We've done all we can, and now, it's time for Afghanistan to decide its own fate.

If they go back to being a Taliban hellhole, that's not our fault.

 

Obama never intended to pursue the Afghan war to victory. Obama just didn't want to give his conservative opponents ammunition to use against him. That's why he called Afghanistan the good war in comparison to Iraq.

All of his actions have led to foreseeable defeat. There is a great deal of blood on Obama's hands and on the hands of those who supported his escalation or who remained silent in the face of it.

 

How exactly do you define victory with Afghanistan?

The situation we face is one where our supposed ally (Pakistan) can't keep raids from crossing their border with Afghanistan.

Afghanistan isn't a "winnable" war in the traditional sense, unless you want to invade and conquer Pakistan.

The only other option is to just let Afghanistan split into multiple countries by tribal regions and then let them fight things out on their own terms.

 

Victory is always defined by a successful analysis of cost/benefit ratios. Back in 2009 I knew this day would come because I understand human nature and the limits of human behavior.

Back in 2009 Obama had the chance to do the right thing. He should have announced a complete withdrawal from Afghanistan then and there. Because he did the expedient thing instead of the right thing American deaths have surged and something approaching a trillion dollars has been wasted.

Obama's defeat is also America's defeat. Obama has not been a good steward.

 

Thank Zeus. End this (*)(*)(*)(*)ing pointless war republican lies entrenched us in.

 

That just sounds like you prefer a different tactic of posturing vs. his.

It doesn't really matter though, since the real people making decisions on this aren't elected. Obama is just a face.

 

Define victory in a nation like Afghanistan. Every nation from Alexander the Great to the Soviet Union that has ever tried to "win" in Afghanistan has come a cropper. Afghans are going to have to settle this for themselves. We can occupy that country for 100 years with half a million men and we won't change it.

 

Serf,

What is the lesson of the years since 2001? There's only one lesson. Don't intervene in the affairs of the Muslim world or there will be blowback in American cities.

Forget posturing. The only correct course of action Obama could have taken in 2009 was withdrawal. Instead he has waged war irresolutely and in the process gotten something like two thousand Americans killed for nothing. Wouldn't it be better if Obama had withdrawn and that those dead Americans were still alive?

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Your post is historically incorrect. The Afghans have been subdued on numerous occasions. No one on earth is invincible.

 

Yeah, the Brits did so well, as did the Soviets. In fact, several invaders have temporarily subdued them, but always at very high cost and never for very long.

 

Going into Afghanistan and Vietnam, someone didn't read their history.

 

Alexander and the Macedonian Greeks conquered Afghanistan and established the Bactrian Kingdom which lasted for centuries.

A combined group of Arabs and Persians conquered the Buddhists of Afghanistan over the course of two hundred years. That conquest has in many ways been permanent. It also spelled the death of Afghan Buddhism.

The Afghans were conquered by the Mongols. That conquest lasted for several centuries. The Mongols totally pacified Afghanistan and established a colonial community called the Hazara who remain in Afghanistan to this day.

Tamerlane and his Turkic/Mongol Timurid Dynasty ruled Afghanistan for several centuries. Later the Timurids became the Mughal Empire which subjugated India.

While the British were defeated in the First Anglo-Afghan War, they didn't give up. In the Second Anglo-Afghan War Lord Roberts of Kandahar crushed the Afghans at the Battle of Peiwar Kotal, and reduced them to tributary status to the Raj. Lord Robert's famous forced night march through the Hindu Kush to take the Afghans from the rear is called The Left Hook. It's a classic of military history. Lord Roberts was Kipling's favorite general. Check Lord Roberts out:

http://www.pinetreeweb.com/roberts-bio.htm

 

The Taliban are going to continue to kill Americans even though they know the US forces are going to evacuate. The Taliban want to be able to claim that they defeated the US Army on the battlefield. When America does evacuate the Taliban will claim to have brought down the American Empire just as they defeated the Soviet Empire. Allahu Akbar.

 

I would agree that withdrawal would have been preferable, but protecting American lives isn't the agenda of this government.

 

Cutting to the chase huh? Well, I have to agree.

This govt. will learn the true meaning of Blowback. NYC and Washington, DC will be the venues. America has become Sisyphus.

 

Conquering a people is much easier than bringing democracy to a people.

 

Bringing democracy to a people in an alien culture is foolish. Some people are not meant for democracy or freedom.

 

No - the 'States have been defeated by the Taliban, so they want to start it all up again in Syria. Whom the gods would destroy they first make mad.

 

When I think of Taliban, I think of the American religious right. I don't see where Obama has been defeated by them at all.

As far as Afghanistan, if you want to continue that fiasco, you pay for it...or maybe ask some of the mego-corporations to pay for it, like Monsanto and Haliburton....after all they've profited very nicely from this taxpayer paid for fiasco.

 

This defeat belongs to Obama because he escalated the war twice and sent more men and women to their deaths than did Bush. It is Obama who is about to intervene in Syria. As goes Obama so goes the entire American left.

 

The Taliban is the term used to refer to the collective Pashtun insurgencies in Afghanistan. There are at least three separate insurgencies. The Quetta Shura of Mullah Omar, the Haqqani Network, and the Gulbeddin Hekmaytr Gang. The American religious right is not a Pashtun insurgency.

I oppose all of the wars since 9/11. I think Obama's defeat in Afghanistan will cut my real enemy down to size.

 

I agree with this part

I would change this part slightly: Some people do not want democracy or freedom (as we perceive it).

 

Democracy as a political form has appeared on a number of occasions throughout history. Each time it has arisen it has done so exclusively in Western Civilization.

Indian democracy is the product of British imperialism. East Asian democracies will disappear with the retreat of Uncle Sam. Latin American democracies are similarly products of past American imperialism.

In this new era democracy is in the process of being rolled back.

 

Of course... but a little snark goes a long way

I guess that's your opinion. I've seen no defeat. Only a logical conclusion.