Should Joe and Hunter Biden be forced to testify before the Senate?

Discussion in 'Opinion POLLS' started by Reasonablerob, Jan 16, 2020.

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Should the Bidens be forced to testify before the Senate?

  1. Yes, they are clearly essential to the case

    23 vote(s)
    65.7%
  2. No, they're immaterial

    9 vote(s)
    25.7%
  3. Other?

    3 vote(s)
    8.6%
  1. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

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    Wish you had a choice

    "Yes if any witnesses are called who did not previously testify"

    Witnesses were called and testimony was taken in the impeachment. THAT is the evidence for the Senate to consider, what was voted on in the House. Nothing more.
     
  2. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

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    Sure it matters. The impeachment was started on matters to which Hunter Biden is material. The entire impeachment is based on the Democrats assertions about Trump's motives. He gets to defend those claims and Hunter Biden's acts and possible corruption, for which there is probable cause, are central and material to those claims.
     
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  3. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

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    Joe Biden was trying to do that does that disqualify him or do we wait and if he gets elected we impeach and remove him? Hunter Biden is central the claims and material to the charge that it was all about Joe Biden and not concern for Hunter Biden's apparent corruption.
     
  4. dairyair

    dairyair Well-Known Member

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    Open a legal gov't investigation.
    Not a personal lawyer working behind the scenes.
     
  5. Le Chef

    Le Chef Well-Known Member Donor

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    I like Trump in certain ways but this is one of the reasons I didn't vote for him. He lacks the requisite government experience to know when he is walking into a minefield.
     
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  6. Le Chef

    Le Chef Well-Known Member Donor

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    You see this in a lot of executives. They excel in business and think they can manage a sports team, build a house, counsel their kids, govern a country. Nobody is good at everything.
     
    Last edited: Jan 20, 2020
  7. Pag

    Pag Active Member

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    There's sth else to it. We ordinary people can say all day that Hunter is corrupt but legally speaking we need some proof and evidence to charge someone. I mean Trump pressured Ukraine and withholded the aid on the basis of Hunter's corruption. On what basis how can he say Hunter is corrupt . He's on the board of directors of burisma so what? I mean he should point to where the law is broken so where is it
     
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2020
  8. James California

    James California Well-Known Member Donor

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    ~ I believe that it's called "pay to play". What better way would a corrupt business influence political favors ? I don't believe the Biden family has any other purpose for Burisma.
     
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  9. Pag

    Pag Active Member

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    I don't believe either. But I want to see if we can justify Trump's did in legal term. Is "pay to play" sth in the constitution? And can we say Trump's claim about Hunter corruption is legal? And is it a crime for Hunter to be on board of directors of Burisma?
     
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2020
  10. Reasonablerob

    Reasonablerob Well-Known Member

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    ???????????????????
     
  11. James California

    James California Well-Known Member Donor

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    ~ If Hunter is innocent of wrongdoing let the investigation go forward. Hire a Mueller type and do the same thing they did to Trump.
     
  12. Pag

    Pag Active Member

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    Reasonable . But does Trump have the right to do anything such as withholding the aid and pressure Ukraine before they hire a Mueller type to investigate it first?
     
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  13. James California

    James California Well-Known Member Donor

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    ~ Of course he does. As president he is obligated to not throw taxpayers money around where it will assist corruption. Folks are just not used to a president who is careful with spending the people's money. Why do you think certain countries in Europe are "angry" at Trump ? He wants them to pay their share into NATO - or fund their own military as it should be. He wants the U.N.to be more aggressive with terrorist countries and stop promulgating unproven "science" about earth temperature and climate in order to scare ignorant and uninformed populations into thinking only government can solve these "problems"
    When certain people "hate" Trump he is doing his job - for the USA - not so the world thinks he's "a nice guy". Trump may come off as a fool - but he is the one actually making a fool out of many by exposing them. Certain powers that be do not like that ...
    [​IMG]" I'm a stable genius !"
     
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  14. Pag

    Pag Active Member

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    NATO, U.N and unproven"science" are all irrelevant to what we are discussing.
    I'm asking how did he know LEGALLY that there was a corruption.
     
  15. James California

    James California Well-Known Member Donor

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    ▶ Under Section 503 of the Foreign Assistance Act : President “is authorized to furnish military assistance, on such terms and conditions as he may determine, to any friendly country or international organization, the assisting of which the President finds will strengthen the security of the United States and promote world peace.” Section 116 of the act states that the president has authority to withhold military or economic assistance “to the government of any country which engages in a consistent pattern of gross violations of internationally recognized human rights.”c

    ~ The president does have the legal right to do it. U.S. presidents have broad authority to condition aid to a foreign nation and even delay it if there are concerns that it will not be used for its intended purposes. Was it wise ? Perhaps not. Illegal ? The Senate will decide.
    Democrats charge that the hold on Ukraine aid by Trump does not appear to have been exercised lawfully - in this case the president's intent was to personally benefit him at the 2020 election. ( I thought Putin did that ? )
    Republicans say "Balderdash ! "
    Stay tuned for more ...:pc:
     
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  16. Pollycy

    Pollycy Well-Known Member

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    The Trump admn. did not 'hold-back' the money for Ukraine beyond the stipulated deadline which was part of the congressional giveaway package to that country.

    The facts: Joe Biden was given the opportunity to 'ride herd' on Ukraine for the Obama admn., and the Ukrainian oligarchs, who were very familiar with how bribes, corruption, and 'gratuities' work in the REAL world, made sure that ol' Joe's sonny-boy, Hunter, was well taken care-of (he needed a nice 'job' after being thrown out of the U. S. Navy Reserves for snorting cocaine).

    During this cushy deal, the political waters in Kiev were roiling (Ukrainian oligarchs don't always play 'nice' with each other), and a Ukrainian prosecutor began examining Burisma, the company that the oligarchs selected for the Biden's to get their 'salary-money' through, but Joe Biden made his now-infamous threat to cut off funding by the Obama admn. if the oligarchs didn't fire that prosecutor. The rest of this sad, sick, sordid story you know -- or at least -- YOU SHOULD. The result? Sonny-boy, Hunter, kept his 'job' at Burisma until just last year -- when Trump started nosing into it, and all hell finally broke loose! But it was a very sweet deal while it lasted.... :lol:

    Don't remember any of this? Need a refresher? Happy to help! Here's ol' Joe, in his own words: https://thefederalist.com/2019/09/2...he-prosecutor-investigating-his-sons-company/

    [​IMG]. "Hey, if YOU could have pulled this off and got away with it, wouldn't you?!" :dog:
     
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2020
  17. Junkieturtle

    Junkieturtle Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The Biden's doing everything they are accused of or not doing any of it do not change Trump's actions. Regardless of their potential guilt, he still manipulated U.S. foreign policy in an attempt to smear a political opponent. As we are often reminded by folks who take pride in their ability to miss the point entirely, there is already an agreement in place with Ukraine where Trump could have simply asked them to investigate Biden, without the need for withholding aid. But he chose to involve himself in a way that is unethical and dirty. That's on him, not the Biden's, and that's what the impeachment trial is about.
     
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2020
  18. Junkieturtle

    Junkieturtle Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    And even if his concern was legitimate, his actions were not. He's on trial for his actions, not his concerns.
     
  19. James California

    James California Well-Known Member Donor

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    ~ I miss the days when Trump was part of the Moscow Mafia and "Putin's puppet" ... :-(
     
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  20. Bluesguy

    Bluesguy Well-Known Member Donor

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    This is about money appropriated by Congress which Biden DIRECTLY threatened to Ukraine to withhold, Trump never DIRECTLY threatened to withhold it to Ukraine. So if Biden gets elected does he get impeached? Presidents use personal envoys routinely. The discussion with Ukraine was cooperation with a DOJ investigation, Trump didn't bring up Guiliani Zolensky did.
     
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  21. yabberefugee

    yabberefugee Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Oh come on now....apply the same logic to President Trump. Where has a law been broken? Abuse of power is not a charge for partisan impeachment anyway. At the very least, there will be a partisan acquittal anyway.
     
  22. Pag

    Pag Active Member

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    Yes I agree that Hunter is corrupt no one advocated for him. I just wanted to know if Trump's dids on this withholding and so on was legally justifiable so we can say that democrat's claim is a total crap. As @James California pointed out to the law I'm officially CONVINCED that it's a total sham . Thanks to @yabberefugee for the opportunity :).
    The problem is that when someone is saying that I'm not a republican everyone think that he is a democrat. Unfortunately everyone even the people tend to think partisanly.
     
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  23. yabberefugee

    yabberefugee Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Pag.....just wanted to let you know, I never considered myself "partisan" until Trump. The establishment in that party is being weeded out. In the Senate, we're down to four.
     
  24. yabberefugee

    yabberefugee Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The money was delayed but delivered. Do you know if Congress expressed a timeline as to when it had to be delivered?
     
  25. Pag

    Pag Active Member

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    It's a serious problem. Politics are just converting to fight between parties instead of handling people's problems.
     
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2020

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