Discussion in 'History and Culture' started by Oldyoungin, Dec 20, 2022.
Yeah a few of us wrecked the "Hitler was a right winger" pretty fast, didn't we.
When the American public stopped shopping for quality and domestically made and only purchased on price, it slowly changed the dynamics of companies in the US. Until we have what we have today.
And they literally had no choice, it was send the jobs overseas or go bankrupt. And the last 40 years is littered with companies that did not do that and are now gone.
The US once dominated the TV industry. Included was almost anything that attached to them, including VCRs. Are you even aware that the last US owned TV company left that industry 28 years ago? In fact, only one US TV company is even in business anymore, as they fought the trend for so long that they all went bankrupt. The only company still in business is Motorola, because they saw what the cheap import TVs were doing to the market and sold off its TV business to Japan back in 1974.
Magnavox, RCA, Zenith, Curtis-Mathes, Quasar, GE, Admiral, Packard Bell, Westinghouse, Craig, Fisher, Realistic, the list just goes on and on. Hell, you can see it in the garment industry also. There is almost no clothing or footwear made in the US anymore. Even the ILGWU collapsed in 1995 as there were not enough companies left in the US manufacturing clothing to stay in operation any longer.
It is not "if they can", it became 30 years ago that they either had to do that or go bankrupt.
I have not read a single word of this thread. I will make a prediction. This thread will get us nowhere for two reasons. 1. Our own political ideological lens will prevent any realistic conclusion. 2. The concept of 'right wing' and 'left wing' simply do not translate well into fascist dogma. Fascism seeks temporary economic policies that ensure an efficient and ruthless exploitation of brazen power and authority inward and outward.. Those policies are not consistent with any single economic ideological theory. They are all about political control and expansion of one party and one person rule. There are economic goals to achieve, and maybe a hazy vision for the future, but nothing is based on a consistent application of left wing or right wing economic theory.
Soo people here will work very very hard to pound fascist political pegs into ideological economic holes.
The most important thing to remember in discussing Hitler, Germany and the WW 2 era is that the victors who write the history are not yet finished propagandizing the event.
For that reason, I try to stay as objective as possible while accepting the fact that many reading this have been adversely influenced by continued anti German propaganda in the classroom, on MSM, out of Hollywood and from the fraudulent Holocaust Industry (1), (2).
While some members. of Germany's National Socialist (NS) government may have talked a lot about preserving racial purity, their actions spoke louder than their rhetoric.
The research of at least one historian indicates that the German WW 2 military was one of the most ethnically diverse military forces since Hannibal. (1)
Additionally, about 150,000 Jews were not only allowed to serve in Germany's military but many rose to Germany's highest ranks and also received Germany's highest military with the full knowledge and approval of Hitler and the German High Command.
Some argue that the Jewish soldiers in Hitler's armies were just reluctant conscripts but, as an American Veteran, I have only seen eager participants rise to the highest ranks and earn the highest honors Germany had to offer.
Not only were Jews allowed to serve in Germany's military but Slavs, Asians and Arabs fought side by side with German soldiers against armies that that were, in fact, much more racist than the German army.
My only point is that I question the degree to which the Germans were any more racist than leaders of the British Empire who subjugated India and starved millions to death or the authors of the American race laws on which the Nuremberg Race Laws were based
While virtually every major power in the world is guilty of murderous racial excesses including Israel, the Holocaust Industry, its global glut of grisly theme parks and its complicit Hollywood movie moguls ensure that only Germany's criminal excesses remain omnipresent before the world's eye.
(1)"17 CHARGED IN $42 MILLION HOLOCAUST FRAUD CASE"
EXCERPT "Federal prosecutors said Tuesday they have broken up a long-running scam in which people falsely claimed to be victims of the Nazi persecution so they could get money out of a fund that pays Holocaust reparations."CONTINUED
(2)"HOLOCAUST CLAIMS CONFERENCE FRAUD LIKELY ‘MUCH HIGHER’ THAN $57 MILLION"
EXCERPT "For over a decade, a criminal ring within the organization embezzled tens of millions of dollars through false restitution claims.”CONTINUED
(3) "Adolf Hitler’s Armed Forces: A Triumph for Diversity?"
EXCERPTS " I ask those historians who still believe that Hitler and the Nazis were “white supremacists”: how do you account for the incredible degree of non-German and ethnic minority (i.e., 150,000 Jews and Jewish Mischlinge) collaboration during World War II? Again, some two million non-Germans helped the Nazis.
The important thing to realize is that had the Nazis been as racist as most historians have argued, then they could not possibly have garnered the immeasurable level of support that they did. Even after Stalingrad; Spaniards, Slavs, Franks, and tens of- thousands of other non-Germans continued to fight for the Nazis on a volunteer basis. Frenchmen and Arab volunteers gave their lives in the final fight for the capital of Berlin in 1945.
Hitler continued to allow thousands of Jewish men to serve, and many did so with incredible tenacity and valor. One has to call into question whether all of these Jewish men and other non-Germans were really as opposed to the Nazi regime as they have claimed after the fact. Their tenacity and determination suggests otherwise in many cases. The Jewish soldiers Bernhard Rogge, Helmuth Wilberg, Erhard Milch, and Ernst Prager come to mind.
The Nazis never racially segregated their troops. Blacks, Slavs, Asians, and Arabs fought shoulder-to-shoulder with Germans." CONTINUED.
(4). “When Hitler Honored Jewish Soldiers”
EXCERPT “The Nazi regime conferred honors on many of the 100,000 Jews who fought in the German army in the Great War, even on some who had already escaped to Palestine.” CONTINUED
is this insect thing and Bill Gates the new fear Q is pushing on the right? Hearing it a lot lately?
I would be more worried about the heavily processed seed oils the corps are pushing on you
yes, AI will advance that too, much potential change on the horizon
some did not like that truth, agreed
Pretty sure you didn't say anything about it other than "Orange and Oranges man bad" the entire thread.
The WEF is telling you exactly what they want for the serfs of the world and you just pretend it isn't happening.
Trump was the right wing.... that is the truth... like it or not
you don't have to eat it, any more than you have to eat the seed oils that are killing us... but yes, the corps may try to use it.... called capitalism
It wasn't "Germans" that was the race. It was "Aryans".
Hitler was an opportunist. Enemy of my enemy and all, and nobody hated the Jews more than the Muslims he wanted as allies. They also hated the English and French.
As far as Jews in the army, there are many reasons for that. There was a term that the Nazi's used for them but I don't remember what it was.
Is that really any different than the Vichy French? There are people who will turn their back on everything and everyone hoping to be accepted by people that hate them.
I spose it depends largely on which definition of 'right wing' we're using.
Top 'bing' search returns:
(THE RIGHT WING)
the section of a political party or system that advocates for free enterprise and private ownership, and typically favors socially traditional ideas; the conservative group or section:
"a candidate from the right wing of the party"
the right side of a team on the field in soccer, rugby, and field hockey:
"he reverted to his normal position on the right wing"
advocating for or taking measures to promote free enterprise and private ownership, and typically favoring socially traditional ideas; conservative:
"their allies are starting to push back against the mostly right-wing criticism" · "he's very right wing"
Based on that, there isn't much overlap with the National Socialist Party. The only overlap with Hitler would be the 'socially traditional ideas' he publicly promoted, though given his affiliation with the Thule Society and his eccentric lifestyle, its safe to assume many of these traditional ideals were only promoted as a tactic to appeal more to common Germans for political clout.
However, there are other 'definitions' of right wing that can be found if one looks hard enough, such as
"Right-Wing politics is centered around beliefs that certain social orders and hierarchies are inevitable and natural, with this belief being supported by natural law or tradition."
Difference Between Left-Wing and Right-Wing With Their Detailed Comparisons (byjus.com)
"Right-wing extremism is usually defined as a specific ideology characterized by ‘anti-democratic opposition towards equality’.
It is associated with racism, xenophobia, exclusionary nationalism, conspiracy theories, and authoritarianism"
What is right-wing extremism? - C-REX - Center for Research on Extremism (uio.no)
Basically, 'right wing' can be found to mean anything from just 'individualist' to 'Literally Hitler' depending on where one chooses to source their information.
LoL you clearly don't have any idea what the WEF is promoting, or just pretend it's not happening.
just like the governments pushing seed oils, telling us they were heart healthy, your choice to eat it
if it's more profitable, corporations will push it.... that is capitalism
Sure. Enjoy the warm embrace of ignoring reality.
that was the reality of it, feel free to give us a different take on reality as you see it if you want
It wouldn't help you, and it would just waste my time.
This is pretty much true.
I think most of the work in this is largely propaganda to try and distance the Left (Socialists-Communists) from him and his beliefs. But the problem is, the most murderous governments in the 20th Century were all "Socialist" in their core beliefs.
The Soviet Union, People's Republic of China, Kampuchea, and NSDAP Germany are estimated to be somewhere around 100 million. And of those, Kampuchea is only second to Germany because it had a much smaller population.
This is not saying that all Socialist Governments are horrible butchers, but Socialism combined with a Totalitarian extremist leadership tends to go that way more often than not. And to be honest, I find it fascinating how so many are almost eager to tout those beliefs to others, and at the same time try to distance themselves from the horrible deaths those government caused.
But it is not really about Fascism, or anything else other than their attempt to distance themselves from select Socialist governments, and deny that they either ever existed, excusing their excesses, or just try to convince everybody they were never Socialist in the first place.
lol, sure, and I am not the only one here, if you think it would help, up to you to if want to share
I don't think so. Right-wingers believe in the rights of others only if they are like themselves. They were against gay marriage. They have gone against individual rights in drug use, immigration, prostitution, almost every chance they get unless it has to do with a rich guy keeping his money and professing his faith.
Conservative is really the best word, because what they want is to resist social change and make things like they were when white men had more dominance. Whether they accomplish that by defending liberty, or abolishing it, seems irrelevant to them.
Fascism is more right than left, but both parties are actually still a long way off from it.
You are talking about beliefs and values. You are talking about difference of opinion. (Conservatives are bad because they believe this...and they make laws based on their beliefs..)
What creates a Hitler --is a system of government that can concentrate power to a select few or one person.
For instance liberals believe that a woman can kill her unborn child. A conservative believes an unborn child is an individual human being with a right to life.
Leftists succeeded in making all 50 states conform to their view.
Conservatives succeeded in making the issue a state by state issue as per our constitution which allocates moral and ethical issues to the citizens of each state. Same with drugs and prostitution. And on issues like allowing biological boys to play and win in girls sports and take girl scholarships.
Ultimately leftists want to federally impose their views over others. That aligns with Hitler..
Conservatives don't see white or black. Asian or Mexican. (AMERICAN Indian is complicated and different) Ultimately leftists want to superscede the constitution to create Utopia of equality. By putting the constitution on a shelf to get an agenda done you are aligning with Hitler.
By "They" do you mean the Germans or the Muslims?
Hitler offered to make peace with England when he sent Hess with peace proposals.(1) Since Churchill knew that he could draw America into the war and preferred to destroy Germany which he viewed as a threat to British Imperialism.
Hitler's peace proposal was to withdraw from all of the conquered Western territories in order to focus on fighting Communism in the East.
Churchill rejected the peace proposal, he had Hess locked up and the rest is history.
This was not the only peace offer that Hitler proposed (2) to have a "well wishing neutrality" with the West so that Germany could concentrate all of its resources fighting the spread of Communism since a clash between National Socialism and Communism was inevitable.
It was because Germany knew Stalin planned to sweep westward on "M Day" (Mobilization Day; June 1941) that Germany initiated a pre emptive attack when it did.
Many of the early German successes were because Stalin's troops were in offensive positions and not defensive positions (3)
As I mentioned earlier, some of the 150,000 Jews and part Jews who served in Germany's WW 2 military(4) rose to the highest ranks and were awarded Germany's highest military honors. Reluctant conscripts rarely do either so these Jewish men clearly wanted to fight for Germany.
The word you may be thinking of might be "Mischlinge" which referred to individuals who were who were only part Jewish as opposed to Full Jews who also fought in Hitler's military. Another term you may have heard is "Kapo" which was an inmate who supervised other inmates.
I think that you might be surprised at the degree to which some Jews were quietly accepted in Germany from Hitler to everyday Germans who married them.
Hitler, for example, had several Jewish friends, doctors, generals, and art dealers throughout his life and only expressed hatred toward Communist Jews he worried would consume Germany as they gained control of former Czarist Russia (5).
Because, at times, Hitler expressed admiration for Jewish culture and individuals. I think that the anti Jewish rhetoric in Hitler's speeches was directed at Communist Jews, not Jews in general.
What are your thoughts?
(1) "Nazis ‘offered to leave western Europe in exchange for free hand to attack USSR"
EXCERPT ""A new book claims to have solved the riddle of the flight to Britain in 1941 of Rudolph Hess, Adolf Hitler’s deputy. Historian Peter Padfield has uncovered evidence he says shows Hess, the deputy Fuhrer, brought with him from Hitler a detailed peace treaty, under which the Nazis would withdraw from western Europe in exchange for British neutrality over the imminent attack on Russia. The episode remains, more than 70 years on, shrouded in mystery."CONTINUED
(2) "What the World Rejected: Hitler’s Peace Offers 1933–1940"
EXCERPT " Written by Germany’s foremost diplomatic historian of the early twentieth century, this work maps out all the numerous times that Adolf Hitler made unconditional offers of peace to all the nations of Europe—and how the major anti-German belligerents, France and Britain, turned down these offers each and every time.
The author lists all of Hitler’s offers in detail, complete with quotes, starting with his first offer of May 17, 1933, his second offer of December 18, 1933, his third offer of May 21, 1935, his fourth offer of March 31, 1936, his fifth offer of September 30, 1938, his sixth offer of December 6, 1938, his seventh offer of late 1939 to Poland to settle the Danzig Corridor issue peacefully, and finally, his offer of world peace on October 6, 1939, just over a month after Britain and France had declared war on Germany for invading Poland on September 1 (but not on the Soviet Union, which also invaded Poland on September 17)." CONTINUED
(3) "Exposing Stalin’s Plan to Conquer Europe:…"
EXCERPT "In Icebreaker, Suvorov details the deployment of Soviet forces in June 1941, describing just how Stalin amassed vast numbers of troops and stores of weapons along the European frontier, not to defend the Soviet homeland but in preparation for a westward attack and decisive battles on enemy territory.
Thus, when German forces struck, the bulk of Red ground and air forces were concentrated along the Soviet western borders facing contiguous European countries, especially the German Reich and Romania, in final readiness for an assault on Europe.
In his second book on the origins of the war, “M Day” (for “Mobilization Day”), Suvorov details how, between late 1939 and the summer of 1941, Stalin methodically and systematically built up the best armed, most powerful military force in the world — actually the world’s first superpower — for his planned conquest of Europe. Suvorov explains how Stalin’s drastic conversion of the country’s economy for war actually made war inevitable.
Stalin instead wanted the Soviet regime to take advantage of occasional “armistices” in the global struggle to consolidate Red military strength for the right moment when larger and better armed Soviet forces would strike into central and western Europe, adding new Soviet republics as this overwhelming force rolled across the continent."CONTINUED
(4) “Hitler’s Jewish Army”
EXCERPT “Thousands of men of Jewish descent and hundreds of what the Nazis called ‘full Jews’ served in the German military with Adolf Hitler’s knowledge and approval.
In approximately 20 cases, Jewish soldiers in the Nazi army were awarded(*)Germany’s highest military honor, the Knight’s Cross.
Jews also served in the Nazi police and security forces as ghetto police(Ordnungdienst)(*)and concentration camp guards(*)(kapos).
So what happens to the claim that Hitler sought to exterminate all Jews, when he allowed some of them to join in his struggle against Bolshevism and International finance capitalism?" CONTINUED
(5) “Putin: First Soviet government was mostly Jewish”
EXCERPT “Russian President Vladimir Putin said that at least 80 percent of the members of the first Soviet government were Jewish.” CONTINUED
Nationalism. Germany First. Make Germany Great Again. If you aren't for us then you are "An Enemy of the State". Purity of culture.
There's a bunch more but I'll stop here.
The fact that it USED to be outlawed and frowned upon and now is not is what MAKES the stance against LGBTQ+ rights "Conservative"
Conservative - To Conserve, to attempt to return to an older time when things were "better". Resistant to change.
Separate names with a comma.