Why did Reagan sell weapons to Iran?

Right and many of you Liberals also think our Constitution is outdated and want to change it, except when you can use it to your advantage.

Say what you want about Reagan, his record speaks for it's self. What it doesn't say, Europe will say it for him. He was one of our greatest Presidents, like it or not. This country and the world were much better off because of him.

 

So...after reading all the response to this thread, basically Reagan broke the law but is excused by the right because........???????

 

You have to show evidence of that, but so far ...

 

Lotsa cash to be made for the war mongering Bush types though, you must admit. War for profit. People for profit. Long as there's profit...it's great.

 

Post #78.

 

Because as usual, you have no proof of you wild accusations.

 

There is no link is post #78 as expected.

 

Allow me; if Reagan knew in advance of the missile deals and chose to proceed with them, it is clear that he broke the law. The following indicates not only that, but that citing 'national security' was the excuse used not to prosecute him.

http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB365/index.htm

 

Your speculation is evidence?

 

It fell because he pushed it into falling it was his strategy and design and began while he was president.

 

It was doomed from the start to fail…

trying to give Reagan credit for it is lame.

The athletes and artists and even KGB agents that travelled outside of the USSR would bring back stories of a much better life material wise.
It broke down the Communist ideals..
who cares about philosophy if you have to line up for hours only to find empty shelves.

I lived with a soviet Jewish girl.
She told me horror stories of life in the USSR.

Apartment buildings designed to house two to three families in each unit.
across the hall that apartment had a washroom and the one you lived in had the kitchen..

bah…it just could not last.

 

While President Ronald Reagan was a supporter of the Contra cause,[6] no conclusive evidence has been found showing that he authorized the diversion of the money raised by the Iranian arms sales to the Contras.[2][3][7] To this day, it is unclear exactly what Reagan knew and when, and whether the arms sales were motivated by his desire to save the U.S. hostages.[8] After the weapon sales were revealed in November 1986, Reagan appeared on national television and stated that the weapons transfers had indeed occurred, but that the United States did not trade arms for hostages.[9] The investigation was impeded when large volumes of documents relating to the scandal were destroyed or withheld from investigators by Reagan administration officials.[10] On March 4, 1987, Reagan returned to the airwaves in a nationally televised address, taking full responsibility for any actions that he was unaware of, and admitting that "what began as a strategic opening to Iran deteriorated, in its implementation, into trading arms for hostages."[11]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran–Contra_affair

Don't you absorb what you read? There was no evidence that Reagan was involved. While they were searching Ollie North's office for evidence, his secretary was in the other room destroying evidence.

They sold weapons to Iraq through Israel to keep financing the Contra who were fighting a Soviet back regime in Nicaragua. Congress had been funding them for over two years, after the CIA got them to leave their homes and family and fight the government. But after the Contra blew up a ship in the Nicaraquan harbor, Congress got cold feet and was afraid the Contras might blow up a Soviet ship and bring the Soviets into a war with the US and cut funding them. Reagan knew the Contras could no longer go back home and he wanted to continue the fight to topple the Nicaraquan government to keep the Soviets from getting a foot hold in Central America on at our back door. So he continued to fund them. The weapons to Iraq were nothing big to turn the balance of power in Iran's favor and we were still giving Iraq intelligence on where Iran's forces were.

 

Your right, but Reagan had plenty to do with helping to bring the Soviets down. He started the arms buildup that Carter cut, forcing the Soviets to put even more money trying to stay ahead. Reagan scared them to death with Star Wars. The Soviets pumped billions into that. Then Reagan armed the Afghans that took the toll of plenty of men and equipment the Soviets had to replace. Then to top it off, he made a deal with Saudi Arabia for AWAX planes in exchange for cutting the price of oil to around $15.00 a barrel, knowing that oil and gas was the only real money maker the Soviets had. He was determined to bleed them dry and see them fall and he did.

 

Nothing lasts but that is irelevant.

The third reich had horror stories as well but had to be destroyed. Who can say that without a war the thousand year reich may have lived up to it's name.

The Soviets were primarily pushed into destruction by Reagan, history shows this.

To deny this is weak revisionist spin.

 

Ronald Reagan’s determination to destroy communism and the Soviet Union was a hallmark of his eight-year presidency, carried out through a harsh nuclear policy toward Moscow that softened only slightly when Gorbachev came to office.

He is vividly remembered in Russia today as the force that precipitated the Soviet collapse.

“Reagan bolstered the U.S. military might to ruin the Soviet economy, and he achieved his goal,” said Gennady Gerasimov, who served as top spokesman for the Soviet Foreign Ministry during the 1980s.

http://www.nbcnews.com/id/5145921/n...helping-bring-down-soviet-union/#.UqILXuLc87J

 

ok then explain to me in detail historically speaking how this is true.

Look the whole tear down this wall thing was just in part of the whole Polish Solidarinocs , Pope Jean Paul, LAk walenska..stuff.
i mean your ronnie was there….but saying it was his doing…wow….

and speaking of revisionist spin…lol…


lets see you answer my question…i will stand corrected if you actually show me.

 

The loses to the Soviets by the shoulder fired missiles Reagan supplied the Afghans

1981

17 April 1981– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down, killing one crew member.
15 June 1981– A MiG-21 aircraft was shot down. One crewman, Mikhail Korchinsky, was killed. The other crewman, Yuri Moscowchuk, was captured, becoming the first Soviet air force pilot to be a prisoner of war.
24 July 1981– An Mi-8 transport helicopter was shot down, killing four crew members.
5 September 1981– An Mi-8T transport helicopter was shot down, killing four crew members.
10 October 1981– An Mi-8MT transport helicopter was shot down, killing one crew member.
17 October 1981– An Mi-8T Board Guard helicopter was shot down, killing one crew member.
28 October 1981– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down, killing three crew members.
13 November 1981– An Mi-8 transport helicopter was shot down, killing one crew member.
18 November 1981– An Mi-8MT transport helicopter was shot down, killing two crew members.

1982

10 March 1982– An unidentified aircraft crashed, killing one crew member.
15 April 1982– An unidentified aircraft was shot down, killing one crew member.
17 May 1982– An unidentified aircraft crashed, killing one crew member.
27 May 1982– An Mi-24 attack helicopter was shot down, killing one crew member.
27 May 1982– A MiG-21 aircraft was shot down.
? June 1982– A MiG-21 aircraft was shot down.
13 June 1982– An Mi-8 transport helicopter was shot down near the village of Taghaz (245 km to the Southwest of Kandahar), killing two crew members.
10 July 1982– An unidentified aircraft was shot down, killing one crew member.
6 August 1982– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
13 August 1982– A MiG-21 aircraft was shot down. Pilot was killed
18 August 1982– A MiG-21 aircraft was shot down.
23 August 1982– An Mi-6 heavy transport helicopter was shot down, killing one crew member.
11 September 1982– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
7 October 1982– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
11 October 1982– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
12 October 1982– An unidentified helicopter was shot down, killing one crew member.
24 October 1982– A MiG-21 aircraft was shot down.
30 October 1982– An unidentified helicopter was shot down, killing three crew members.
4 December 1982– A Su-17 aircraft was shot down. Both crewman were killed

1983

4 January 1983– An unidentified helicopter was shot down near the village of Kholm (East of Mazari Sharif), killing one crew member.
15 February 1983– An An-12 was shot down while on approach to Jalalabad. The five crew members were killed.[3]
22 February 1983– An Mi-6 heavy transport helicopter was shot down, killing one crew member.
5 June 1983– An Mi-24 attack helicopter was shot down, killing two crew members.
19 July 1983– An Mi-8 transport helicopter was shot down, killing one crew member.
24 July 1983– An Mi-8 transport helicopter was shot down near Jalalabad, killing two crew members.
7 August 1983– An unidentified helicopter was shot down, killing one crew member.
9 September 1983– An Mi-8 transport helicopter was shot down 120 km South of Faizabad, killing one crew member.
16 September 1983– An Antonov An-12 transport plane was shot down, killing four crew members.
3 October 1983– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
18 October 1983– An Mi-8 transport helicopter was shot down near the Kajaki reservoir (Helmand province), killing two crew members.
21 October 1983– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
25 October 1983– An unidentified aircraft crashed, killing one crew member.
29 October 1983– A MiG-21 aircraft was shot down.
15 November 1983– An Mi-6 heavy transport missed the Soviet landing strip near the town of Kunduz and crashed due to a faulty tail rotor. Two crew members were killed.

1984

16 January 1984– An Su-25 strike jet was shot down, killing its pilot.
6 March 1984– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
2 April 1984– An unidentified helicopter crashed either due to bad weather or a technical failure. One crew member was killed.
? May 1984– 4 MiG-21 Aircraft were destroyed on the ground.
9 May 1984– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
5 June 1984– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
6 June 1984– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
2 July 1984– An Mi-8 transport helicopter was shot down, killing one crew member.
3 July 1984– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
5 July 1984– An Mi-8 transport helicopter was shot down, killing one crew member.
6 July 1984– An Mi-6 heavy transport helicopter was shot down on approach to its base (while returning from a mission). All three crew members were killed. It is possible that this helicopter was captured by Afghan guerrillas.
14 July 1984– An unidentified helicopter crashed. One crew member was killed.
? August 1984– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
6 August 1984– An unidentified helicopter was shot down. One crew member was killed.
23 August 1984– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
27 August 1984– An unidentified helicopter was shot down. One crew member was killed.
19 September 1984– An Mi-8 transport helicopter was shot down, killing all three crew members in addition to a unit of paratroopers.
23 September 1984– An unidentified helicopter crashed. One crew member was killed.
16 October 1984– An Mi-8 transport helicopter was shot down while landing a group of soldiers near the town of Baghlan. All three crew members and four disembarking troops were killed.
18 October 1984– An Su-25 strike jet was shot down, killing its pilot.
18 October 1984– An unidentified helicopter (probably an Mi-24) was shot down, killing two crew members.
27 October 1984– An Il-76 heavy transport plane was shot down during landing, 20 km to the South East of Kabul. Five were killed.[4]
28 October 1984– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down in the Panshir Valley, killing two crew members.
8 November 1984– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
27 November 1984– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
1 December 1984– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
10 December 1984– An Su-25 strike jet was shot down.

1985

22 January 1985– An An-26 transport plane was shot down, killing one.
29 January 1985– An Mi-8 transport helicopter was shot down shortly after taking off from Kandahar, en route to Kabul, killing one crew member.
13 February 1985– An Su-25 strike jet was shot down, killing its pilot.
11 March 1985– An An-30 transport plane was struck in the left engine by ground fire, causing a fire that began to spread. All non-essential crew members bailed out, while the pilot and co-pilot remained, hoping to land the aircraft at Bagram Airport (near Kabul). The aircraft crashed 25 km from Kabul after the fire destroyed the aileron controls, and both were killed.
14 March 1985– An Mi-6 heavy transport helicopter collided with a Soviet Air Force reconnaissance plane, killing three.
20 March 1985– An Mi-8 transport helicopter was shot down while transporting troops from Ghazni to Baraki(?). All five aboard were killed.
24 March 1985– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
27 April 1985– An Mi-8 transport helicopter was shot down 7 km away from its destination of Lashkargah while transporting troops. Three were killed.
11 May 1985– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
18 May 1985– An Mi-6 heavy transport helicopter was shot down near the remote village of Bakarak, killing one.
1 June 1985– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
18 June 1985– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
21 June 1985– A MiG-23 fighter jet was shot down, killing its pilot.
21 June 1985– An Mi-8 transport helicopter was shot down, killing one.
27 June 1985– An Mi-8 transport helicopter shot down, possibly with several troops on board. All those aboard were killed.
10 July 1985– An Mi-24 attack helicopter was shot down, killing one.
16 July 1985– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
11 July 1985– An unidentified ‘special missions’ aircraft was shot down, killing five.
22 July 1985– An Su-25 strike jet was shot down.
23 July 1985– A MiG-23 fighter jet was shot down.
25 July 1985– An unidentified aircraft crashed, killing one.
16 August 1985– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
19 August 1985– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
17 September 1985– An Mi-6 heavy transport helicopter was attacked on the ground, killing one.
21 September 1985– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
24 September 1985– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
3 October 1985– An Mi-6 heavy transport helicopter was shot down.
12 October 1985– An Mi-6 heavy transport helicopter was shot down 23 km South of Kabul, killing two.
13 October 1985– An unidentified aircraft crashed, killing one.
18 October 1985– An unidentified aircraft was shot down, killing one.
25 October 1985– An Mi-8 transport helicopter was shot down 20 km to the Northwest of Kunduz, killing nine crew members and paratroopers.
1 November 1985– An Mi-8 transport helicopter was shot down, killing one.
7 November 1985– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
15 November 1985– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
24 November 1985– An unidentified aircraft crashed, killing one.
6 December 1985– An Mi-8 transport helicopter shot down while transporting troops, killing seven.
16 December 1985– An Su-17 aircraft was shot down.
27 December 1985– A MiG-23 fighter jet was shot down.

1986

13 January 1986– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
18 January 1986– An unidentified aircraft crashed, killing one.
19 January 1986– An Mi-8 transport helicopter was shot down, killing all crew members and paratroopers aboard.
1 February 1986– An Mi-24 attack helicopter was shot down West of Maymaneh, killing one.
21 February 1986– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
5 March 1986– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
3 April 1986– An Su-17 aircraft was shot down.
6 April 1986– An Su-25 strike jet was shot down, pilot Alexander Rutskoy safely ejects.
18 April 1986– An Su-25 strike jet was shot down.
21 April 1986– An Mi-8 transport helicopter was shot down, killing two.
2 May 1986– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
17 May 1986– An Su-17 aircraft was shot down.
24 May 1986– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
26 May 1986– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
31 May 1986– An Mi-24 attack helicopter was shot down over Kabul airbase, killing two instantly while another died of his wounds six days later.
3 June 1986– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
15 July 1986– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
31 July 1986– Two Mi-8 medevac helicopters collided near Pagman, killing some of the injured passengers.
22 September 1986– An Su-17 aircraft was shot down.
25 September 1986– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
September 1986 was the month that the FIM-92 Stinger missile was introduced by the CIA and Zia ul-Haq of Pakistan into the war.[5]
16 October 1986– An Mi-8 transport helicopter was shot down, killing two.
19 October 1986– An Mi-24 attack helicopter was shot down, killing one.
22 October 1986– An Su-17 aircraft was shot down.
20 November 1986– An Su-25 strike jet was shot down.
29 November 1986– An An-12 transport plane was shot down while leaving Kabul Airbase en route to Jalalabad, transporting a contingent of newly arrived Russian troops. All crew members (4–5) and all 27 passengers were killed.
29 November 1986– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
29 November 1986– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
3 December 1986– An Su-25 strike jet was shot down.
3 December 1986– An Su-25 strike jet was shot down.
26 December 1986– An An-26RT transport plane was shot down. All crew members bailed out, except the mechanic, who was killed either by the missile or in the crash.

1987

12 January 1987– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
13 January 1987– An unidentified aircraft crashed, killing one.
21 January 1987– An Su-25 strike jet was shot down.
21 January 1987– An unidentified aircraft crashed due to either technical problems or bad weather, killing one.
28 January 1987– An Su-25 strike jet was shot down.
5 February 1987– An unidentified aircraft was shot down, killing one.
27 February 1987– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
4 March 1987– Two Mi-8 transport helicopters were shot down while searching for the pilots from the two Afghan Su-22s that had been downed earlier in the day. Both crews were killed. (Two escorting Mi-24s had been delayed)
23 March 1987– An Mi-6 heavy transport helicopter was shot down, killing two.
12 April 1987– An Su-17 aircraft was shot down. This was the first Su-17 shot down by a FIM-92 Stinger missile.
15 April 1987– An unidentified aircraft crashed, killing one.
16 April 1987– A MiG-23 fighter jet was shot down.
21 April 1987– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
21 April 1987– All crew members and 18 paratroopers when an Mi-8 transport helicopter was shot down 120 km north of Kandahar.
7 May 1987– Mi-8 transport helicopter crashed due to technical reasons or bad weather, killing four.
18 May 1987– An Mi-24 attack helicopter was shot down, killing two.
31 May 1987– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
1 June 1987– An Su-25 strike jet was shot down.
4 June 1987– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
5 June 1987– An Mi-8 Medevac helicopter carrying one wounded individual was shot down North of Kandahar, killing one.
9 June 1987– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
19 June 1987– An Su-17 aircraft was shot down.
24 June 1987– An unidentified aircraft crashed, killing one.
1 July 1987– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
12 July 1987– An-12 delivering ammunition was hit by ground fire while landing at Kandahar airbase, killing four crew members and one person on the ground.
15 July 1987– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
20 July 1987– An Su-22 was shot down near Gazni, killing one.
1 August 1987– An unidentified aircraft crashed, killing one.
13 September 1987– An-26 transport plane was shot down, killing one.
13 September 1987– An Su-22 strike jet was shot down, killing one.
29 September 1987– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
21 October 1987– An An-12 collided with an unidentified helicopter over Kabul Airbase due to the ground controller's error in clearing the helicopter for landing. All involved were killed, including 18 passengers aboard the An-12 who were en route to Tashkent.
22 October 1987– An An-26 transport plane was shot down, killing two.
27 October 1987– An Su-17 aircraft was shot down.
30 October 1987– An Mi-24 attack helicopter was shot down, killing two.
23 December 1987– An Mi-8 transport helicopter was shot down, killing one.

1988

17 January 1988– An Mi-8 transport helicopter was shot down, killing four.
6 February 1988– An Mi-8 transport helicopter on a search and rescue mission was shot down with several rescued personnel aboard, killing two and wounding 6.
16 February 1988– An Mi-24 attack helicopter was shot down, killing one.
26 February 1988– An Mi-24 attack helicopter was shot down, killing one.
29 February 1988– An Mi-24 attack helicopter shot down 10 km Southeast of Bagram, killing one.
18 April 1988– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
20 April 1988– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
25 May 1988– An unidentified aircraft crashed, killing one.
23 June 1988– 8 Su-25 strike jets were destroyed on the ground.
? June 1988– 1 Su-25 strike jet was destroyed on the ground.
18 July 1988– An unidentified helicopter (possibly an Mi- was shot down, killing one.
4 August 1988– An Su-25 strike jet was shot down by a Pakistani F-16, pilot Alexander Rutskoy safely ejects.
21 August 1988– An Mi-24 attack helicopter shot down, killing its two-member crew.
27 August 1988– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down.
4 September 1988– An Mi-8 transport helicopter was shot down, killing one.
30 September 1988– An Mi-24 attack helicopter was shot down, killing two.
1 October 1988– An Mi-8 transport was helicopter shot down, killing one.

1989

7 January 1989– An Su-25 strike jet was shot down, killing its pilot.
19 January 1989– An Mi-8 transport helicopter was shot down, killing five.
2 February 1989– An Mi-24 assault helicopter was shot down, killing both crew members.

Summary by aircraft type

 

I'm not saying he did not have a hand in it…but claiming he brought down communism and he was the man that did it…wow…

so many factors went into the collapse…and in any case if you are going to view Reagan as the guy who brought it down, then he failed miserably for a dictator is back in power in russia…communism gone the way of the dodo…but where is Russia now?????

i would not hand out any ribbons to ronnie just yet…lol...

 

ROFLMAO!!!!!

dude…you are forgetting about the military economies of both America and USSR.
all you are showing me is a boost to both economies.

man you really need to to realize what world you really are living in.

 

All of reagan's so called accomplishments have come back to bite the world in the ass…

his economic policy eventually brought about the meltdown of world economy in 2008.
his Iran Contra nightmare is still rippling through the pond…the whole arms race you are so proud of is bankrupting America and has done nothing to lessen the threat from Moscow, now has it lessened Moscow's style of power in the world..

RAYGUN was a failure…and absolute failure and detriment to both America and the world

 

He traded AWACS intelligence planes to Saudi Arabia in exchange for a lower oil price to deprive Russia of hard currency, ended Soviet industrial espionage by ensuring that they found and acted on plans for gas transmission that blew up a huge gas field in Siberia, worked with Pope John Paul II to destabilize Communist Poland and Sandinista Nicaragua and terrified the Kremlin with the prospect of a non-nuclear, entirely defensive, impenetrable anti-missile shield. The USSR was already spending half of its GDP on defence, compared to 6% in the United States, and the entire Soviet Union and international Communism consequently imploded, one of the greatest and most bloodless strategic victories in the history of the nation state.

 

Reagan had a big debt trying to bankrupt the Soviets, but he left with a thriving economy that created About 20 million jobs. Unemployment went from 7.6 to 5.5. Inflation went from 13.5 to 4.1. etc.

http://www.reaganfoundation.org/economic-policy.aspx

 

You forgot to mention the part where unemployment went to 11.5% under Reagan (far higher than it ever went under Obama). It was an illegal act that no one really paid for. Sad really.

 

Not when he left office it didn't. The facts are there, all you need to do is read them. Reagan left a thriving economy when he left. When Carter left, interest rates were up around 15%. Who could afford to buy anything with those rates.

To say he didn't do anything to bring the Soviets is wrong too. Even the spokesmen for the old Soviet Union gave credit to Reagan. Poland built a statue and a Park after him.

 

again where is the victory..where is russia today.

you are confused about how military economics work. lol..

governments spend trillions on military and people earn trillions…the whole part where the weapons have to be used is a tacky necessary exploitation of civilians and governments.
you think the Soviet Union's expenditure on military exploits are bad for it's economy….lol…


as for the gas pipeline.. Europe's main source of gas is from russia…they control the price and have held europe hostage to it …

all this reagan stuff did not work…did only harm and is not even on today's radar except in cleaning his messes up..
he created political nightmares and economic chaos.

your numbers support it..

i realize for some Raygun is some sort of legendary folk hero president and they romanticize about his value…but it is fantasy.

russia is in great economic shape..
america hitches rides into space form them,
they are still a super power

and their government is now more powerful and entrenched …the people don't have communism to revolt against anymore…

so Raygun helped them to get here…if you want to give him all the credit for Soviet change.