the minimum wage: reality check

What has really ticked me off regarding this debate on raising the minimum wage to $15/hr is when some joker says, "why did I bother going to college when I could just flip burgers now?"

Well toodles, for starters if you're lucky enough to get a full time job right out of college based on your college degree, you'll be working 8 hours a week, most likely 9 am 5 pm with an hour off for lunch, some type of basic health insurance, and limited PAID vacation and sick days.

the average fast food worker gets shifts they have to choose from (if they're lucky to have that choice) during the work week which may NOT add up to 40 hours (the shifts are either during the day or night....some franchises have graveyard shifts from dusk to dawn), so they would have to take on extra shifts. Most do NOT get an hour off for lunch, much less a paid hour.... and prior to the enactment of the ACA (Obamacare), many saw NO paid sick or vacation days (still don't) and no health insurance of any kind.

Then there's the little thing of BEING ON YOUR FEET CONSTANTLY DOING REPETITIVE WORK.

So next time the anti $15/hr folk want to raise that old mantra, I suggest they think it through.


Oh, and just to cover all the bases http://www.raisetheminimumwage.com/pages/job-loss

 

Why not 20 dollars an hour?

Or 30?

 

15 is a nice number and it isn't high enough to have a big impact on inflation. However, economists say you can raise minimum wage up to 60% of median wage without impacting inflation.

Raising the minimum wage isn't radical enough for my sensibilities, but it's better than nothing.

 

so you can't logically fault the OP? Figures. But to keep you from parroting this silly question....because it has been determined that those rates are wholly unsustainable as a national minimum wage. Do the research from something other than right wing websites to understand why $15 is possible.

 

personally im ok with minimum wage increases on a by city level but can get behind state level but only if you actually set policies that encourage wage to increase.

If you set policies that encourage wage to decrease (adding more labor thru illegal immigrants and decreasing jobs due to nafta + TPP) and then mandate a wage increase all you do is close down businesses.

Be consistent. Push thrue the wage increase and set policies that encourage wage to increase.

i explain it more clearly here

https://tsukesthoughts.wordpress.com/2016/04/24/the-trump-effectwages/

 

You keep creating scenarios as if nothing else exists, then expand on said scenario as it's a reality. Of course, reality has a way of puncturing your supposition and conjecture laden balloon. Nafta and TPP are detrimental to the economy, but since corporate wages for management and shareholders seems to doing gang busters, and I've already documented how the myths of a $15 destroying small business is NOT true, and the aforementioned are STILL out sourcing and relocating while charging you and I higher prices, I dare say there is no excuse other than personal greed and arrogance.

 

its really economics 101. Wage increases where you decrease the supply of labor and increase the supply of jobs. Less people competing for more jobs means that the individual laborer has more bargaining power to get a higher wage.

If you remove the illegals and send them back to mexico the supply of labor decreases drastically and people are now forced to pay minimum wage or higher to get the jobs done. If you remove nafta and tpp then you increase the supply of jobs so there is more to go around. The reduced competition also increases labor bargaining power.

Illegals are also problematic for the minimum wage because they create a special protected class that acts as something equivalent to a "veto" power by the corporations. For example if the government were to put a minimum wage of 50$, the corporations have the option to say no and hire exclusively from illegals. Since they are currently not punished for that they have effectively circumvented your minimum wage.

 

raising to 60% of median income would sure as hell have a big effect on employment. The reason there would be no inflation is because so many people would be broke and unable to spend their pink slip.

 

Anyone with a college degree making $30K a year should definitely not have gone to college.

 

A pointless rant, utterly disconnected form reality that, doesn't even come close to addressing the the statement of which it complains.

 

I never understood why anyone is concerned how little or how much someone makes. We are paid for the worth of the work we perform. What others make is none of our business. Believe me I have worked for very cheap wages and mixed hours. I have worked two full time jobs. But I knew it was up to me to claw my way up the salary chain and not blame my employer for paying me minimum wages for sweeping the floor. I learned my craft well and retired from management at age 55 with enough money to live comfortably.
The market will adjust all wages. When Henry Ford couldn't keep workers on his assembly line at $2.50 a day he raised their pay to $5 a day. Afterwards he had plenty of men wanting to work for him. And the government never got involved.

 

Ahhh, but in current times the government has gotten involved to defend and support large companies, businesses and corporations to make record profits at the expense of their workers. You and I pick up the slack for outsourcing and relocation for companies who then raise their domestic prices.....remember when it was revealed that Wallmart employees couldn't afford to shop at their place of work, and many needed public assistance because their salaries weren't cutting it? And how much were the owners worth?

YOU were fortunate to be in a situation that gave you enough time and money and opportunity....others should NOT be punished because the same circumstances didn't exist for them.

 

Spare me this convoluted myopic bolder dash. Illegal aliens are NOT occupying the jobs that can allow people to get a rung on the ladder to better their situation....or are you not aware of the situation where Walmart workers couldn't buy their company products on their salaries and many had to go on public assistance to supplement their income?

Illegal aliens were NOT the impetus for corporations to outsource and relocate under Bush laws, or withhold hiring because they weren't sure if Obama was going to be elected. Nor were they responsible for banks screwing Americans with the housing market fraud. or the S&L Scandal...or the other crap Wall St. got away with.

Your dog only flies if you ignore the entire story....and that would be fantasy.

 

I've always favored tying the cost of housing into the wage debate. $15 an hour is too uniform. We need companies to pay employees a minimum wage based on the cost of housing in that county.

 

My friend, if you only knew what companies and corporations are getting away with when it comes to college grads in the last 30 years.

- - - Updated - - -

translation: garyd can't logically or factually disprove or dispute the OP, so he just spews sour grapes.

 

Minimum wage hikes cut crime rates, for obvious reasons. If someone can support themselves adequately with a job, there's less incentive to be a criminal. On a broad societal level, that crime decrease covers the cost of the wage increase.

For the most part, they don't raise consumer prices. They do raise prices slightly in restaurants, being those are so labor-intensive. But as eating out isn't a requirement, no biggy. If you're eating out, pay a little more to give the workers a living wage.

 

You say in your first paragraph that the government getting involved in the situation (*)(*)(*)(*)ed things up royally. In your second situation you berate the poster for not wanting to government to get still more involved.... because apparently if you take 2 turds and smash them together they turn into gold.......

 

Perhaps, but I know a college grad will make more than 30K after a few years experience. The burger flipper is stuck at that wage.

 

We need to get over the "punishment" excuse. If you live in the U.S. the opportunity is there, just as it was for me. I had only a high school education, came from humble beginnings, was only 5 foot 7 in a six foot world, was shy, and wasn't good at pronouncing some words. But I made it through determination, hard work, and planning for my future. If you are satisfied with minimum wage, just plan for the weekend with cigarettes and beer, then you get no pity from me. My dad told me, "You can do anything you WANT to do".

 

Who said ANYTHING about being "satisfied" with minimum wage?

 

Most of the people on welfare have a job. Their wage falls under the poverty line, so they supplement with taxpayer funded programs like SNAP, medicaid and others that cost you and me. All because the corporations know that the government will supplement their slave wages so the CEO can make 45 million instead of a measly 43 million dollars. It should concern you because it does concern you.

Business cannot be trusted to do the right thing and pay a living wage. History has shown that only when forced do private business do the right thing.

 

Just me. But I made good points. I was following the rules of the Forum and addressing the subject of the OP.

 

If I had a job and needed to supplement my income I would find a second job rather than sign up for welfare. There are 24 hours in a day or 168 hours in a week and most people work a 40 hour week. That leaves them with 128 hours. If you sleep 8 hours a day that is 56 hours and still leaves you 72 free hours. Plenty of time to work another 30 hours or even 40 hours at another job to help you get your foot on a limb and start climbing up. But too many people seem to be allergic to work.

 

Not always true. I moved around with a wife and child, living in dumps, looking for a good business. I ended up working for 7 businesses in four different states until I found one that paid a good wage and had excellent benefits for hard, quality work. By this time I was 29-years-old. I retired from that business at age 55 after 26 years with them. Trust me, there are some very honorable businesses out there but you have to find them because they probably won't be looking for you. Again, you have to take charge of your own life. Don't wait for the government to make your life better.

 

Great if you're single. Disastrous if you have children.