The dumbing of America

He didn't ask any questions. He made a fallacious statement and disguised it as "fact."

 

It would be nice if this were true, but it's not. Ethnic disparities in IQ are well established. No serious researcher denies them What is controversial is the CAUSE of these disparities.

 

Grade inflation:

The average GPA at Harvard in 1890
was 2.27. The average GPA in 2004 was 3.48. Both were on a 4.0 scale.

If it's happened at Harvard, it's happened as bad (or worse) elsewhere.

 

yA, i reely like spelchek. I run it evry time befur i hit the postt buton. As to y i didnt due so wel on the SAT tist, ken we git bak to that qestion layter?

 

You apparently have been living in a cave beyond the reach of Donald Trump's tweets or remarks ("s***hole countries"; Mexicans as rapists). Or Rush Limbaugh ("“Have you ever noticed how all composite pictures of wanted criminals resemble Jesse Jackson?”), Ann Coulter (“America is just bringing in a lot of rapists.”).... I could go one, but. Of course someone who is a racist will think these remarks are just a reflection of the truth. They are not!

But then you were the guy who posted in another thread that recreational sex is banned in the USA.

 

Tomander: since you and I are both 'moderate Republicans', I'm going to ask you for a favor. Can you point me to any actual data about rates of rape among different countries and/or ethnic groups and/or socio-economic layers? I think you seem to be arguing that the rate is the same for all countries and ethnic groups and socio-economic groups ... or I may have misunderstood you.

 

SATs have not been dumbed down: just the opposite.

 

He asked me a question? I missed it. I have never read a serious question that he has written in this forum. I have only read rhetorical questions that push his racist agenda. I have also never read one of his posts that didn't imply white supremacy.

 

Actually, American school students are doing rather well, compared to other countries. (What this says about other countries is another matter -- it's just that Americans aren't worse than others.)

What you have to do is to dis-aggregate the data: compare African Americans to African Africans, European Americans to European Europeans (indigenous, not immigrants), Asian Americans to Asian Asians.

When you do this, America does not look too bad at all. I'm not arguing hat the American education system is wonderful, or even very good -- just that on international comparisons (the PISA test, to be specific), it does not look all that awful.

Those interested in more information about this should read the essay by a very good analyst, Tino Sanandaji, an Iranian Kurd whose parents immigrated to Sweden. (He's also an invaluable source of information about what's really happening in that country.) The essay you want to start with is here.

 

Are you speaking for Christians here?

 

I own a farm in Central America with a Nicaraguan manager with plenty of jungle (not dangerous) around it. Without him I'd be lost but in NYC he'd be lost. Although an intelligent man he'd also be lost on any IQ test.

We're all smart in different ways and all of should be allowed to enjoy the one life we have without concerning ourselves about meaningless intelligence tests which mean nothing outside our accustomed environments...

 

I agree that dumping our social problems on teachers is unfair. It is also inappropriate.

I'll disagree with you on other points at some future date.

I just wanted to post in order to say:

Thanks for teaching our kids!

 

And yet during that period technology, invention and innovation soared.

 

Fred Dobbs: As a general guide to getting along with others, what you say is unimpeachable. I absolutely agree with that attitude.

However, there is still a question about brain functioning. No one doubts that someone who has lived in a certain environment for a long time knows far more about it and how to negotiate the problems it presents, than someone who hasn't lived there. Thus if someone came from the Amazon jungles to New York City, he would -- whatever his IQ -- find it bewildering.

But if he observed the native New Yorkers, people who had lived there all their lives, with equal local knowledge, he would find that some of them were not ... well, not very intelligent. And others were very intelligent indeed. This in terms of understanding and responding to the challenges of life in New York.

So there is such a thing as intelligence, independent of knowledge about the local environment. Why one person has significantly more than another is a question deserving of research ... because if we can eventually understand it, we may be able to do something about making sure everyone has a lot of it. (Our descendants, not us.) But I certainly agree that 'IQ' doesn't equate to morality, decency, common sense, knowledge, or human worth.

 

Some of these social problems are caused by teachers who have a specific set of poorly thought through social and political beliefs. You must be aware of many of them but here is one concern. http://www.returnofkings.com/105985/how-our-feminized-school-system-is-crippling-young-boys

 

There is a story, true or not, that Albert Einstein would answer the door prepared for sex because so many woman visited him hoping their love child would have his intelligence. Of course, like Churchill mentioned, the child might only have his looks.

 

Whoa ... never heard that one before!!!
I've just come back from a conference where there were several Mathematics Professors from Cambridge and Oxford, along with
several hundred math teachers, about half or more female. And come to think of it ... the professors did seem to be leaving the evening events early, sometimes followed by a young lady ... the devils! I thought they were just getting an early night.

 

Yea, you guys are trying to dumb down general public. There is absolutely nothing about race in those statements, you made this personal conclusion and trying to present it as true. Trump addressed the issue about illegal immigrants from Mexico (Mexico is not a race).
Republican never divide U.S. citizen by race or gender, only Democrats do that to gain political score. They are doing it with only one purpose, to promise race/gender/sexuality based special privileges for their electorate.

 

Arguably just as 'disgusting', is the failure to admit that these 'disgusting' white people very happily acknowledge that Asians are smarter than them.

You fail.

 

This is something of an accidental obfuscation. Plenty of East Asians were subjected to malnutrition in the 20thC, yet they outstrip whites in terms of IQ.

IOW, it's not the malnutrition causing the differences. And no, it's not race either.

 

Are Republicans 'racists'? No doubt some of them are, just as a significant number of Blacks (who largely vote Democratic) are anti-Semites.
But in general, Republicans have, like all other Americans, absorbed the post-war consensus that explicit racial discrimination is wrong; what's more, they are rather pleased when Black conservatives emerge, thus the large amount of support for Ben Carson (who was quite unqualified to be President, not that that mattered, as it turned out). I've seen several other examples of this, and would be willing to bet that if a credible Black conservative candidate emerged in a future electon, the overwhelming majority of Republicans would be overjoyed to support him (or her).

Or here's some micro-evidence: at a family dinner with my relatives in Texas, all of them white Christian Republicans, one of the younger men there used the 'N-word' -- quite deliberately, I'm sure, to shock us. There was a stunned silence around the table, and then he was (mildly) rebuked. There were no liberals present, and the sentiment was entirely unforced.

However, I think when leftists say Republicans are racists, what they mean is that Republicans do not agree with the following Leftist view: "Black problems in the US are entirely the fault of white people. If Blacks, 13% of the population, commit a majority of murders -- mainly of other Blacks -- then this is the fault of white people. If, as Jesse Jackson said a few years ago, 60% of Black men cannot read the front page of a newspaper, then this is the fault of white people." (This view is held by leftists as a quasi-religious one -- that is, there is literally no evidence that could persuade the holder of such a view to change his mind, and even the entertaining the thought that such evidence could theoretically exist is met with horrified denial.)

Since Republicans don't accept blame for Black problems, or not most of the blame, then they must attribute Black problems to some other cause: some conservatives will blame liberal social policies, but it's probably safe to say that most ordinary Republicans, as a default explanation, put the responsibility for Black behavior on the people doing the behavior. And good leftists see this as racist.

I suppose another example of Republican racism would be that, given the choice, they would prefer to live as far away as possible from large concentrations of Blacks. But then, since white leftists in practice have exactly the same attitude (they're not stupid), this can't be taken as an example of specifically Republican racism.

 

Liberals who want to read some pretty objective writing about race and IQ, by a liberal, should look at the books by James Flynn, discoverer of the 'Flynn Effect'. You might start with What Is Intelligence?: Beyond the Flynn Effect ... or just click on that link, which takes you to Amazon, and you'll see a number of other books on intelligence listed, by Lewontin, Wade, and Murray and Herrnstein. And, as I mentioned before, the best quick introduction is by Ian Deary, Intelligence: a Very Short Introduction.

 

And if that really mattered to you, then you would simply move on. Some people care how we got here, because we can't fix what we don't understand. Apparently not understanding is OK from your point of view.

 

Well American students are made up of different ethnic groups, not just white only now is it.

 

So you think the schools, colleges, and universities are dominated by alt right teachers, profs, and administrators?
Where have you been for the last 40 years?