Would we choose vaccine passports?

Fair enough. I was talking about the situation in the US. I do realize that it is worse for countries that only have the AZ.

 

Note the VAERS report shows severe reactions to the vaccine are now at 3k. And most observers are of the opinion that it severely undercounts everything. There is also anecdotal evidence that it can mess about with a woman's menstrual cycle. In what way and to what extent I don't know. The real problem here is uncertainty. And the current admins mask fetish even after having been vaccinated isn't making things better.

 

mRNA vaccines don't tamper with a person's DNA, period. If you think they do, you are listening to a conspiracy theory. And no, the lethality of this virus is not 0.03%. Seems like you're grossly misinformed.

 

Agreed. Thanks.

 

Poor people tend to have poor health for reasons that should be obvious to anyone paying attention.

 

LOL, mRNA is a small piece of genetic code that attaches to the cell nucleus that signals it to manufacture a spike protein. It is possibly less dangerous than direct manipulation but not without inherent risks or as one doctor put it, they will create more prions which a build up of could lead to ALS, etc and would only start showing years down the road, like 4 years. The direct manipulation has the inherent risk of causing cancer. That said, these may be wonder miracles but have been avoided in the past due to the inherent risks and have NOT been fully tested and are NOT FDA approved as of yet.

The lethality of Covid by age group is different. For the teens they want to give this to is 99.97% survivable. For me at 68 it is 98.5% and for over 80 it is close to 90% so more dangerous for over 80 but with morbidities which is the most critical factor.

 

The information about DNA and mRNA vaccines on a level lay folks can understand is widely available.

Searching for "mRNA vaccines DNA"...

https://www.google.com/search?q=mRN...AFHkgEBMZgBAMABAQ&sclient=mobile-gws-wiz-serp​

As a retired teacher, I wonder how many students I successfully encouraged to live in a fact-based reality instead of modifying their perception of reality to their wishes.

 

Are you trying to teach ME cell biology? LOL

No, the mRNA from these vaccines does not enter the cell nucleus. Get informed. They act in the cytoplasm and they do not interact with the DNA.

DNA viral vector vaccines do enter the nucleus (although they don't change the human genome either). Not the Pfizer and Moderna mRNA vaccines.

The prion issue is junk science by a known anti-vaxxer and quack, debunked over and over.

You are right about the age group differences. I thought you were talking about overall lethality.

 

Conspiracy theories = a way for dumb people to fell smart and think they are in the know.

 

What doctor? Why are you propagandizing the forum?

 

A lot more people are dying from covid.

 

What are you talking about?

 

Can’t read? I never said the mRNA entered the nucleus.

 

Studies that masks do not work for a virus so we have mask mandates. Studies that social distancing is arbitrary so we have social distancing. Stupid people wearing a mask and face shield in their car driving alone with the windows rolled up. Pushing these experimental treatments with possible unknown unintended consequences on the young that have a 99.97% survival rate. Lots of stupidity going on.

 

I can read, but you don't know zip about cell biology, and you are trying to teach a medical scientist who has 40 years of experience on this, LOL.
You said:
"LOL, mRNA is a small piece of genetic code that attaches to the cell nucleus that signals it to manufacture a spike protein."
No, it doesn't attach to the cell nucleus. If it were to interact with the cell's DNA it would need to ENTER the cell nucleus and it doesn't do it either. Like I said, it works in the cell cytoplasm, with the ribosomes that are there. The nucleus doesn't make the spike protein. It's the ribosomes that do (which are in the cell cytoplasm, not in the nucleus); they read the mRNA and make the spike protein.
Look, stop trying to teach a professional about something the professional knows very well and you completely ignore.
What do you do for a living? I won't try to teach you your profession. Don't try to teach me mine.

Here, see this; maybe even YOU will be able to understand it... I hope:

https://www.snohd.org/DocumentCenter/View/5999/How-COVID-mRNA-vaccines-work

Observe: the mRNA goes to the ribosomes, not the nucleus. The ribosomes make the spike protein, not the nucleus.

The cell then degrades the mRNA and it does NOT become part of the host cell's genome as you mistakenly believe. It degrades precisely as a safety mechanism to avoid too much of a protein being produced by the ribosomes. That's why the mRNA vaccines are mostly harmless and don't change the human genome.

Get it now?

Jesus...

 

Yeah. You're right about lots of stupidity going on. We have examples right here, right now.

By the way, giving these VERY safe and very efficacious vaccines to youngsters who have a lower death rate makes sense due to two aspects:

1. It's not just to protect them. It's to protect the entire population through herd immunity so that the pandemic fizzles and the economy restarts. If we leave out a large chunk of the population, the youngsters, the virus will continue to circulate and mutate, eventually becoming resistant to the vaccines and restarting the whole thing.

2. It's not just the death rate. Even young people can survive but can have bad consequences from an infection with the SARS-CoV-2. And the P.1 variant is known for being harsher on younger people.

-------

Sometimes I'm getting from one location to the next one in my car and instead of donning/doffing the PPE all the time, I keep it. Say, I go from Lowe's to a grocery store, nearby. Given that I usually use an N100 mask which is relatively difficult to get on and off and reseal, I typically keep it when I'm driving a short distance. People may look at me driving with it and may think I'm stupid... I'm anything but.

-------

I see you're still one of those who still think that studies show that masks don't work for a virus... LOL. There's numerous studies saying otherwise. I've posted the link to a meta-analysis here with hundreds of studies, showing a reduction in transmission of coronaviruses with odds ratio and relative risk dropping enormously for the masked people. But I'm sure you wouldn't understand the study, so... Oh, and it addresses social distancing too. For what's worth, here it is:

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0140673620311429

 

I can't speak for America, but where I live there is evidence that clot deaths are not making the media. That's very very concerning, IMO.

I'm a mask fetishist, FTR. I'm into hard lockdowns and all that.

 

Like I said, it's unacceptable. We must have at least one other option - one with a completely different risk profile.

 

What studies? I wear this respirator...



This is what some people who work directly with covid patients wear.

Arbitrary? In what sense? You're at less risk if you're distant.

Maybe they just robbed a bank.

The vaccines are not "experimental" and a lot of people will avoid businesses where there is risk of transmission. Cruise lines, air carriers, movie theaters, bars, restaurants, malls--they all lose business because people don't want to get sick. Anti-vaxxers seem intent on screwing up the economy, especially guys like DeSantis who won't even let cruise ships insist all passengers be fully vaccinated. There are ports who won't let cruise passengers off the ship without every passenger and every crew member being vaccinated. If we don't thoroughly beat down the virus with vaccines and treatments, it will continue to cause economic problems.

People who get the vaccine are helping themselves, others, and the economy. I would see you as "the enemy" if I owned a restaurant, bar, hotel, airline, gym, sports franchise, church--just about anything where people gather or interact.

No vaccination? Forget travel outside the U.S. If our virus numbers are significant, Americans won't be welcome, vaccinated or not. Countries will quarantine their own people if they travel here.

A lot of jobs are at risk if sectors of the economy remain depressed--restaurants, bars, hotels, clubs, etc. continue losing business because the risk if getting covid keeps people away.

Take the vaccine. Be part of the solution instead of part of the problem. We may have a hard time getting back to normal if you won't do your part. If you have another solution, I'd like to hear it.

Seems to me you're at greater risk if you get covid than you are from the vaccine.

 

What good is served by any of us pretending to know something we don't?

 

Shows how little you actually know about the alleged vaccines which are not vaccines but experimental treatments still without FDA approval. Emergency Release Authorization is not the same as FDA approval so yes they are still experimental and you are the test subject. Think of yourself as the new GMO.

 

"Feel" smart. Pardon my typo (I typed fell smart). You know, conspiracy theorists think that THEY are smart and we're all sheeple. Often they are the dumbest, most naïve, easiest to influence and manipulate, but they think they know better, which makes them feel better about themselves. The psychology of it is pretty simple.

 

Pfizer has applied for full approval, did you know? You probably didn't, because you don't seem to know a lot about this topic (you thought that the nucleus makes spike proteins, LOL, when it's the ribosomes in the cytoplasm that do, betraying the fact that you're repeating what conspiracy theorists told you, like a parrot, without the faintest notion of how it actually works). Full approval should come in a couple of months. Once it's not "experimental" any longer, will you take the vaccine? Your analogy with GMO is faulty because these vaccines do not manipulate the human genome. Pretending that they do is utterly absurd. The genome CAN be manipulated but it's through a very different technique called CRISPR-Cas9, which is NOT what these vaccines do.

 

Evidently you think applying for full approval means instant approval. It still means the alleged vaccines are not FDA approved as no long term testing has been done. Do you know how long that takes? Last approval for SARS took six years. Long term affects will not show up for at least four.

 

Did I say that? Please kindly quote where I said that applying for approval means instant approval. Do NOT put words in my mouth. I said they applied. The FDA is likely to respond in a few months, given that all timelines have been blown to pieces in this pandemic. If we go by what was done before, the fastest vaccine had taken 4 years to be developed. The Pfizer vaccine took ten months. Just wait and see. Full approval will come relatively soon (and has been granted in other countries, already) given how safe and efficacious these mRNA vaccines are.

How in the hell do you conclude that I think they've already been approved when I just told you, ONCE it's not experimental any longer, etc. Do you understand English? Do you know what the word ONCE means? Jesus. It's quoted by you, right there in my post. I say, "once they are no longer experimental" etc. and you conclude that I'm saying that applying is approval? LOL. If you didn't exist, you'd need to be invented, for a good laugh.

It's not long term "affects." It's long term "effects." And no, it is very unlikely that there will be any. Like I said, the mRNA degrades in hours and gets eliminated. If by 3 weeks after the second dose you haven't had any side effects, chances are you won't have any.

But anyway, talking to you is not very compelling, given how profoundly you ignore this topic. It's interesting to realize that you NEVER replied to my explanation of your blunder that the mRNA "attaches to the nucleus" and makes the nucleus produce spike proteins, LOL. Have you ever studied biology? What is your level of education? Your ignorance of this is surprising. Most people, even non-specialists, can understand the basics of protein production in cells, when they are given the explanation. You don't seem to get it. Terrible. I pity you.

Buddy, just quit.

From my end, I'll "quit" you for me. I have zero interest in dialoguing with someone with your level of misinformation. Over and out.