Christianity and drinking

Many Christian denominations say drinking is sinful, but lets see what the Bible teaches. Below are 5 examples, although there are many more in the OT and NT:

1. Jesus turned wine into water John 2:1-11 so that people could drink

2. Drunkenness is sinful: Galatians 5:19-21 The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.

3. Drinking was sometimes encouraged: Proverbs 31:6 Give strong drink to one who is perishing, and wine to the bitter in soul.

4. Drunkenness is a pathway to trouble Proverbs 20:1 Wine is a mocker, strong drink a brawler, and whoever is led astray by it is not wise.

5. Don't let drink control you 1 Corinthians 6:12 “All things are lawful for me,” but not all things are helpful. “All things are lawful for me,” but I will not be dominated by anything.

To me this translates that drinking in moderation is acceptable while raving drunkenness (it leads to other sinful behavior) is not. The "bitter soul" part is for those people who are depressed or have some other reason to feel "bitter" and drink too much. God knows their heart, and they should not feel they are condemned for what they do.

 

I'll drink to that! Like really, a Busch beer right now! Hey, I got off work at 6am. This IS my 5 oclock!

 

Slainte

 

An addition to your list from Deut 14.

Sounds like a good party to me

 

The Greeks and Romans had a god of wine, partying and merriment, who was it, Dionysus and Bachus? Best kind of god imho!

 

My parents were Christians who clearly felt superior to those who drank or smoked based on their religion. Or disapproved of the kids having sex. This was one of the things that caused me to despise the Christian religion at an early age. I could have grasped at an early age not to drinking or smoking for reasons of health - but the sense of moral superiority over not drinking seemed absurd and unamerican. At the age of 16 I noticed for several days my mother was crying at the dinner table. Finally my father took me out to the garage (to be away from my 13 year old sister) and explained in a stern tone of voice that my mother had found a pack of condoms while searching my bedroom desk as I guess a Christian parent is apt to do. This was all a big joke until I found out my girlfriends parents had been called to discuss the condoms But fortunately the mother said "we had condoms when we were young." The girl was from iceland and I learned they were not uptight about sex like bible thumpers in America. But I did have big time rage about my mother calling my girlfriend. A year or two later I always wondered what my mother thought we she found a hash pipe in my bedroom closet. The pipe disappeared and nothing was ever said. What I certainly learned. It was better to be a hippy than religious.

 

/me thanks Jesus for Schofferhofer. ...and the Germans, they deserve some credit as well.

 

The problem I have with these kind of "pick and choose" rules is the Christian bible is full of contradictions. Yes, I know some say it's just a guide book. It is also said that "God will clear a way to understanding" meaning that each reader will "process" this information differently.

One time, my sister and I were at our grandma's house. We had brought along some games so we asked her if she wanted to play "Monopoly" with us. She said that she didn't because she's "a good Christian woman and God says 'don't throw dice'". Even as a little kid, that sounded like BS. Doesn't God have more stuff to worry about? He gives a hoot if a grandma plays Monopoly with some kids? I wasn't buying it.

Also, I know two different who were formerly ministers. They both carried around a bible and were self-righteous you-know-whats. I lost track of them after graduation. As a volunteer child abuse advocate I had to access the sexual offenders list. One of those guys was on there. I wasn't shocked because he always seemed like a creep to me and I saw how he treated the women in the office. The other one was exited "quietly" and probably for the same stuff (just not enough to wear orange).

The point being...take it however you take it. Whatever *speaks* to you will guide you on whatever journey you're on and, guess what, so is everybody else. Until somebody comes back the dead and tells us what happens "over there" ALL of this pearl clutching is just a ball of anxiety.

NOBODY knows. Some of us don't care. I have more than enough on my plate trying to live THIS life. I don't have time or energy to worry about whatever stuff people worry about after we become worm food. I don't even know what I'm making for dinner tomorrow. I'm supposed to worry about some apparent psychopath that made it impossible for people to not break the rules and he loves me but wants to punish me. Hell, I can go visit my family if I just get the urge to be told what a POS I am. LOL If you (or anybody here) want the "fast track" to being punished for no d*mn reason, PM me. I'll give you my crazy family's address.

P.S. Here's the deal...

 

I share your sentiments - on the Bible being "pick and choose" and agree that "Don't be a Dick" or similar - aka the Golden Rule - sums up the "Law and the Prophets" .. Matt 7:12

 

The Chinese Menu Bible where you pick out only what suits your own personal agenda and ignore everything that contradicts your agenda is why so many consider Christians to be hypocrites.

You could live a blameless life helping others and still end up suffering for eternity because you failed to do one thing or you could be a sociopathic serial killer who ruined the lives of millions of innocent people but end up spending eternity in heaven because you did that one thing on your death bed. WTF kind of "morality" is that supposed to be?

 

Isn't that kind of how the legal system works? You can be the best person in the world, but if you then steal a million dollars from somebody you're going to jail for a long time.

It's not just "one little thing". They changed their heart and they will never murder again.
They can't continue to be a serial killer and still be in heaven.
(Of course it's not so easy to just suddenly change. If you would do something bad then, there's very little reason you wouldn't just do the same thing again. Those thinking they can just change on their deathbed and everything will be fine are playing Russian roulette with their souls)

These issues you are bringing up, we've talked extensively about them in other threads. Maybe you didn't see those threads or the explanation there was not good enough for you.

Oh well, we're not going to continue to derail the topic here.

 

Its the same message in different words. The Bible says the two great commandments are to love God and to love your neighbor (aka don't be a dick). Those two commandments cover all other commandments no matter how you itemize them.

Don't be a dick commandment: "And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’ All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.” Or the same message in another passage, which someone already mentioned: "So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets."

No one is blameless.

 

Let's not get to philosophical here time to talk about some dranking!!!!

 

OK, some people feel that if they feel something is immoral then it should be outlawed.

Anyone in favor of banning alcohol ?

 

It has nothing to do with outlawing anything.

 

Yep, and most people don't even try to follow that one.

The Bible (Buy-Bull) is fiction. I don't subscribe to any of it.

That's not your place to decide. Let their God/god/gods deal with it.

 

I don't expect everyone to believe it, since people can't decide what to believe. Either they believe, or they won't

Yes, the Bible says that God will deal with it, and it also says no one is blameless. I didn't say I would somehow "deal" with it.

 

Why can't people decide what to believe?

Yep. Most of us believed in Santa, the Tooth Fairy and Easter bunny until we didn't. I am a former Christian and I'm glad more and more are walking away from their places of worship.

Fair enough.

 

It doesn't work that way. Can you decide to believe 2+2=5? I never met anyone who decided to believe God exists, but I know people who have experienced things that persuaded them of it.

Former Christian? Majority of Americans are Christians. Many are "cultural Christians", while others are folks who have a "relationship" with God. The rest are atheists, agnostic, universalists or members of other religions.

 

FoxHastings said: ↑
OK, some people feel that if they feel something is immoral then it should be outlawed.

Anyone in favor of banning alcohol ?

I wasn't referring to "anything".....I ask a question about the topic

 

And my answer is one can of saying "no, not in favor". Lot of things which Bible considers sinful are perfectly legal, so its not about making them illegal. Adherence is voluntary. Even the almighty God won't force you to obey. If He did, we would not have free will.

 

I would bet you've met quite a few in your lifetime. You just didn't know it because they hide in plain sight. I attended religious services after I became an atheist because it would be too much drama with my family if I didn't. I know several atheists and agnostics that attend religious services as well.

A "former Christian" is exactly like it sounds. I WAS a Christian at one point in my life. NOW, I'm an atheist.

 

Sure, there are people who choose to attend services (for various reasons), but if they are still atheists, then obviously they still don't believe.

 

Many people think that the Bible is about trying to have good moral hygiene or about having proper relations with the other humans. This is not he focus of the Bible. The focus of the Bible is about having a proper relationship with God.

 

You are missing the point. A person can be a Christian (or any denomination) and LATER become a non-believer. All atheists don't start off in life as atheists.

Please pay attention to tense - I WAS a Christian. I am NOT a Christian (or believer in any religion) NOW.