Pro-Palestinian protesters shout ‘Allahu akbar’ outside of World Trade Center site

As pointed out above, some of your interpretation of the Qur'an is simply bogus. Are you aware that Islam believes in the Bible? Are you aware that they see Jesus is the premier prophet, second only to Muhamad?

Yes, during wars they made statements about those they opposed in the vernacular of the time.

You have made no effort to determine what is motivating Palestinians or what is motivating Israelis.

 

I'll be happy to ask a Muslim how they view it. Bring him up here.

And no sir you are incorrect. Jesus contradicted Old Testament scripture time and time again. He did so because the OT scripture was flawed. It had been influenced by men too much and not enough by God. In fact that was his entire purpose was to come and correct flawed OT doctrine.

I'm happy to provide you as many scriptures as you would like to back that up. That's why I don't concern myself with your Joshua scripture. Because that was Joshua's decision and not God. But regardless it doesn't matter because we don't follow the OT. If we did we would eat kosher and follow the 613 laws of Moses. But we don't because we don't follow the OT. And neither did Jesus. Except what he knew to be true from God.

I dont expect anyone to contact me. I expect them to read the entirety of the scripture and not pieces they don't like. If they do so, there is no other conclusion which can be reached. That's your problem. You don't want to take what is written in context. You want to make excuses for Islam and don't care what they wrote.

 

This is NOT what mainline Christians believe.

 

I didn't interpret anything. I quoted you what was written and explained why your explanation was bullshit.

You can't just sit here and make up bullshit about how they were at war with anyone OTHER than pagans in order to justify your absurd position and then just say "oh well I'm not Muslim". Okay sure but do you know how to read?

And by the way if your only response when I post Qurannic scripture is to say "well I'm not a Muslim so I don't know", then you should probably keep your mouth shut instead of defending Islam.

 

You want the scripture? Nah you don't. But imma give it to you anyway.

You have heard that it was said an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth but I tell you not to resist an evil person but whosoever strikes you on the one cheek, offer the other also. Whomever takes away your cloak offer him your tunic as well.

Is that or is that not direct contradiction of OT doctrine?

And I can provide you DOZENS of these.

 

You suggested you know how the Qur'an is being applied today by the Muslim world.

But, you didn't check with Islam to verify that.

And, that's as ridiculous as someone suggesting that Leviticus law applies today. Have you read Leviticus?

 

That describes personal behavior. The Qur'an also describes personal behavior as well. In fact, it is critical in the steps one takes to eternal life - respect, help, etc.

Leviticus law is a statement of government - death penalty for wearing clothes of two fibers, etc.

 

No see you're wrong. I've asked Muslims that question. You know what their bullshit response is? They give either one of two responses. They either say yes Muslims are required to fight anyone who does not believe in Allah. Or when you find a "moderate" Muslim they provide The same bullshit response you gave. They assert "oh well those verses were written at a time when Islam was at conflict with these other groups". Insinuating that the Muslims were attacked by Christians and Jews which prompted that verse as a means of self defense".

However when I press them in the same way I did you by asking for ANY historical record where the Muslims were attacked by Christian's and Jews during the period that scripture was written NOONE has ever been able to provide a historical account of that occurring. Then as I continue to press them eventually ALL of them have to acknowledge they can't produce the evidence and that Surah 9:29 gives them the right to be violent towards anyone other than a Muslim.

You don't believe me? Bring a Muslim up here and I'll prove it. I'm sure there's one on this board somewhere.

 

While this has nothing to do with what we are discussing I will provide some background here. Christians do not follow the OT because it is not for them outside of the 10 commandments. Why? Because the 10 commandments were given separately from the 613 laws of Moses and for completely different purposes.

The commandments were given as part of a covenant between God and man for salvation. Essentially if you follow those and those alone, you will get to heaven.

But the levitical law was given for a different purpose. The 613 laws of Moses were provided because you had one man, Moses, who was leading hundreds of thousands of people out of Egypt into the wilderness. He had no system of law and no system of government. So he asked God to help and God provided him the 613 laws of Moses. They were never intended for salvation and were never intended for anyone other than the Jews. Hence why Jesus had to correct the Pharisees over and over again because they were using levitical law for salvation. They were asserting if you didn't follow the levitical law to the letter you were not of God. Hence why Jesus allowed his people to pick and eat grain on the sabbath and engage in acts which were explicit violations of levitical law.

Jesus was very clear when the rich young ruler asked him, "Good Teacher, what good thing shall I do that I may have eternal life." Jesus' response was if you want to enter into life, keep the commandments.

 

Of course some Muslim's interpretation of the Qur'an is simply bogus, like for example Qur'an interpretations of ISIS or this Muslims:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Islamist_terrorist_attacks

For example when Quran says:
Sura 9:29
29. Fight those who do not believe in God, nor in the Last Day, nor forbid what God and His Messenger have forbidden, nor abide by the religion of truth—from among those who received the Scripture—until they pay the due tax, willingly or unwillingly.

The correct understanding of this text is "Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself"

"Hadith of the Blind Man" is not demanding throwing homosexuals from high buildings, but about awarding homosexuals with apartments in tall buildings.

When Muhammad said: "If you find anyone doing as Lot’s people did, kill the one who does it and the one to whom it is done", He didn't mean to kill/murder them, but he used poetic expression 'kill then with love'.

Yes, not doubt Islam is religion of peace.

 

Those he fought in Mecca weren't likely to be Christians or Jews. There were numerous religions, and those in Mecca and throughout the Arabian Peninsula are believed to have been polytheists.

They probably didn't like Muhamad's view of their being one god as represented in the Bible, with Jesus as a premier prophet.

Most of Muhamad's later life was spend in this conflict with polytheists who had long and violently rejected him in his homeland.

I don't believe you asked your Muslim friends the right questions. Did you ask under what circumstance they would need to kill you? That's what you're worried about, isn't it. You think there is a constant and fundamentally murderous underlying malevolent motivation. I just don't agree with that at all.

There is plenty of unrest around the world. Suggesting it is all based on religion just doesn't work.

Time and time again we've seen the problems of colonialism all over the world. There have been the historic wars throughout Europe. There have been the various western interferences - the drawing of Iraq's borders without regard to the population, Vietnam, the US mitigated overthrow of the Iranian government, the Reagan era decision to keep the Iran-Iraq war going as the US didn't have an opinion on who should win, the decision born of guilt to give Palestinian land to form Israel without so much as talking to those there, our continued arming and political protection as Israel colonizes Palestine with clear genocidal intent.

You can't cut through history by blaming Islam.

 

Christianity does recognize the change. But, they do not reject the OT, because it came from God.

Jesus is love, but it hasn't overcome the homophobia, misogyny, land borders, justification for violence that is evident in the OT.

In fact, the Zionist direction of Israel, supported by Christians is an attempt to instantiate ancient borders based on religion. They believe God is behind them in the same way he was behind Joshua as he carried out his slaughter for land, wiping out whole peoples in the genocide of the day.

 

You want to find 100k terrorists who have various motivations.

Then, you want to blame the religion of 1.2BILLION people.

There is NOTHING even SLIGHTLY legitimate about that.

Those who fight terrorism in the ME are MUSLIMS - outside of Israel, whose genocide can not be excused and can't be successful against terrorism (according to USDoD).

Here's a thought for you:
20% of Muslims live somewhere in the ME.
3.5 million Muslims live in America.
There are 30K ISIS throughout the world.

 

Let's assume everything you're saying is true. What would you have Israel do when it's an impossibility to distinguish between the terrorist Muslim in Palestine and one who doesn't agree with terrorism? And many times the two live in the same household and the actual extremists pretend to be moderates? Moreover the "moderates" many times provide coverage for the extremists because it's their father or brother or cousin who is an extremist.

 

Let's look at the facts: if there is any terrorist act committed in the name of religion, I would bet it was done by Muslims. I'd have a better chance of winning than at the most corrupted casino.

My first thought when I heard about the attack on the festival in Moscow was that it was committed by Muslims from Chechnya. I was partially correct; it was committed by Muslims, but I was wrong about their nationality.

Are all Muslims potential terrorists? Of course not.

Is the Quran more violent than the Bible? I'm not sure. I have read the Bible, and it is a very violent book. I tried to read the Quran and found it very boring. However, according to some experts who have compared both books, they encourage murder more or less to the same extent.

However, the fact is that many Muslim religious leaders encourage the murder of innocent people. The most famous cases of Muslim terror include the September 11 attack, the 2004 bombing of the train in Spain, the July 7, 2005 London bombings, the November 2015 Paris attacks, the 2016 Nice truck attack, the 2017 Manchester Arena bombing, the 2015 Charlie Hebdo shooting, the 2019 Naval Air Station Pensacola shooting, the 2015 San Bernardino attack, and the 2016 Pulse nightclub shooting. This is only a partial list.

I haven't even mentioned the genocide that Muslims are committing in Africa.

And what does this have to do with Israel?
Hamas, a fundamentalist Muslim organization, committed genocide against Israel, and Israel is trying to destroy these Muslim genocidal maniacs. Unfortunately, some people who believe that Black lives matter, and Palestinian lives matter, seem to think that Jewish lives matter only in certain contexts - they try to protect Hamas.

 

That's what you "bet"?

And, because of that you believe GENOCIDE is warranted - like Yoav Kisch (minister of education) calling for extermination.

After all, in the minds of these Israeli Zionists, a Muslim is an animal to be slaughtered.


NOBODY has committed an act of genocide against Israel. And, I'm tired of Israeli attempts to use the Qur'an as an excuse for their genocide against Gaza and West Bank.

 

There is zero justification for the Hamas attack. There is 100% justification for Israel's attack and continuing that attack. When terrorists attack you, scorched earth is the only approach.

If Israel were to stay silent, Hitler's goals to eliminate the Jews can and will be carried out. And anyone that scoffs at that has not examined the hatred just in the United States for Jews.

 

I think you are confused - Israelis are not using Quran as excuse for genocide, Israelis defend themselves against genocide committed by Muslims on Oct 7.
It is not the first time Muslims used Quran as excuse to genocide - do you remember genocide of
Yazidis in the name of Quran?
And how about genocide of Armenians and Greeks done by Muslim Turks?
And how about genocide of Kurds by Muslim Turks or Muslim Iraqis?
And how about genocide of Tibetans in Qinghai Province by Ma Bufang and his Muslim soldiers?
And how about genocide of Muslims by Muslims in Syria?
And how about genocide of Christians in Somalia by Muslim Al Shabab?
And how about genocide of Christian in Nigeria by Muslim Boko Haram?

Yes, I know - your answer is - "but Apartheid Israel committing genocide...", "but Islam is the religion of peace...".
In the Western world you have a freedom to believe in any myth you want.

 

Well, I agree that there is never an excuse for terrorism.

However, the rest is total BS. One has to ask what IS a legitimate method of war that Gaza should have used?

After all, Israel has been making war on Gaza steadily for 20 years with ZERO opportunity for ending that war. That has resulted in large numbers of deaths and a total destruction of Gaza's economy and future.

The Zionists in control of Israel have stated many times that they want the Palestinian people gone. Thus they bulldoze their homes in West Bank, and now with their leaders calling for exterminating the people in their ongoing genocide.

 

October 7 absolutely was NOT genocide. It was 1 terrorist attack.

Your story is like claiming that the 9/11 airplanes that brought down the World Trade Center was genocide. It was not. Nor was it motivated by the Qur'an.

Yes, there are other horrendous injustices going on.

That is NOT an excuse for Israel.

It's not an excuse for America to support and defend genocide.

America does not stand for genocide. It NEVER has. What is happening today is a gigantic black eye for America - a monumental moral travesty that will not be forgotten throughout the world.

 

The war would end tomorrow if Hamas surrendered and released the hostages. Case closed.

 

That is total BS.

Israel continues to steal land from those in West Bank as they work on clearing out THAT portion of Palestine, too.

And, they have never offered more than a 6 week ceasefire if they get ALL their hostages back.

After that, the genocide WILL continue - it is the ONLY direction that Israel has.

Just like over the last 20 years of war being waged by Israel against Gaza, Israel has NO intention of considering a future where there are living Palestinians in Gaza. They have NEVER been willing to discuss a future of Gaza with people of Gaza - or of West Bank.

The last time there was a chance for talks came under Bush. His proposed "roadmap for peace" was absolutely rejected by Israel, with conditions making discussion impossible.

 

"Allahu akbar"
God is great!

America doesn't believe that??

 

The problem is when you hear them shouting that it is mostly always during acts of violence

You see they think that violin acts glorify their God

 

Which of those cases was AIDED and ABETED by the USA?

Where else other than Gaza have we been instrumental in genocide?

Where do we state in ANY of our fundamental or even ancillary documents or in our creations at Geneva, the UN, NATO or ANYWHERE else that WE, the USA, see justification for the US PROMOTION OF GENOCIDE???