Abortion is Better than the Alternative

Indirectly, there was. There was this snarky undertone to your post.

Not true. The woman needs a man to fet pregnant.

 

That analogy is absolute sh-t. But I get your point and do not entirely agree. I believe both men and wimen xan be much mire careful with their bodily fluids to avoid unwanted pregnancy.

Do you think abortion is something beautiful?

Only a very small minority, yes.

Firstly, I am not dome kind of religious Conservative who opposes contraception and sex-ed and secondly, calling a pregnancy an "injury" is disgusting.

Well, where is the hypocrisy? Their stance is more like;

1. Girls and boys have full rights.
2. Life begins at conception.
3. The girl or boy in the uterus has full rights (see 1).
4. Nor man nor woman is allowed to injure, hurt or kill the boy or girl in the uterus because "number 1".
5. Boy or girl is born. No one lost their rights.

Same can be said about pro-choicers from a pro-life perspective.

If this is true it is really messed up.

 

A d and c is a procedure used for several gynological problems and most gyn's perform this procedure. This same procedure is used for many abortions. So a dr who performs this procedure is not required to do it for someone who wants to terminate a pregnancy. I'm surprised that pro choices have no problem with a dr choosing what procedure he or she will do based on their beliefs. The procedure is the same whether it's for a medical necessity or for an elective termination of a pregnancy.

 

And why are these same drs given a pass by the " pro choice" community?..

 

This is to answer your : """calling a pregnancy an "injury" is disgusting"""""


To ignore what pregnancy does to a woman's body is truly disgusting..


Normal, frequent or expectable temporary side effects of pregnancy:


•exhaustion (weariness common from first weeks)
•altered appetite and senses of taste and smell
•nausea and vomiting (50% of women, first trimester)
•heartburn and indigestion
•constipation
•weight gain
•dizziness and light-headedness
•bloating, swelling, fluid retention
•hemmorhoids
•abdominal cramps
•yeast infections
•congested, bloody nose
•acne and mild skin disorders
•skin discoloration (chloasma, face and abdomen)
•mild to severe backache and strain
•increased headaches
•difficulty sleeping, and discomfort while sleeping
•increased urination and incontinence
•bleeding gums
•pica
•breast pain and discharge
•swelling of joints, leg cramps, joint pain
•difficulty sitting, standing in later pregnancy
•inability to take regular medications
•shortness of breath
•higher blood pressure
•hair loss or increased facial/body hair
•tendency to anemia
•curtailment of ability to participate in some sports and activities
•infection including from serious and potentially fatal disease
(pregnant women are immune suppressed compared with non-pregnant women, and are more susceptible to fungal and certain other diseases)
•extreme pain on delivery
•hormonal mood changes, including normal post-partum depression
•continued post-partum exhaustion and recovery period (exacerbated if a c-section -- major surgery -- is required, sometimes taking up to a full year to fully recover)

Normal, expectable, or frequent PERMANENT side effects of pregnancy:


•stretch marks (worse in younger women)
•loose skin
•permanent weight gain or redistribution
•abdominal and vaginal muscle weakness
•pelvic floor disorder (occurring in as many as 35% of middle-aged former child-bearers and 50% of elderly former child-bearers, associated with urinary and rectal incontinence, discomfort and reduced quality of life -- aka prolapsed utuerus, the malady sometimes badly fixed by the transvaginal mesh)
•changes to breasts
•increased foot size
•varicose veins
•scarring from episiotomy or c-section
•other permanent aesthetic changes to the body (all of these are downplayed by women, because the culture values youth and beauty)
•increased proclivity for hemmorhoids
•loss of dental and bone calcium (cavities and osteoporosis)
•higher lifetime risk of developing Altzheimer's
•newer research indicates microchimeric cells, other bi-directional exchanges of DNA, chromosomes, and other bodily material between fetus and mother (including with "unrelated" gestational surrogates)

Occasional complications and side effects:


•complications of episiotomy
•spousal/partner abuse
•hyperemesis gravidarum
•temporary and permanent injury to back
•severe scarring requiring later surgery
(especially after additional pregnancies)
•dropped (prolapsed) uterus (especially after additional pregnancies, and other pelvic floor weaknesses -- 11% of women, including cystocele, rectocele, and enterocele)
•pre-eclampsia (edema and hypertension, the most common complication of pregnancy, associated with eclampsia, and affecting 7 - 10% of pregnancies)
•eclampsia (convulsions, coma during pregnancy or labor, high risk of death)
•gestational diabetes
•placenta previa
•anemia (which can be life-threatening)
•thrombocytopenic purpura
•severe cramping
•embolism (blood clots)
•medical disability requiring full bed rest (frequently ordered during part of many pregnancies varying from days to months for health of either mother or baby)
•diastasis recti, also torn abdominal muscles
•mitral valve stenosis (most common cardiac complication)
•serious infection and disease (e.g. increased risk of tuberculosis)
•hormonal imbalance
•ectopic pregnancy (risk of death)
•broken bones (ribcage, "tail bone")
•hemorrhage and
•numerous other complications of delivery
•refractory gastroesophageal reflux disease
•aggravation of pre-pregnancy diseases and conditions (e.g. epilepsy is present in .5% of pregnant women, and the pregnancy alters drug metabolism and treatment prospects all the while it increases the number and frequency of seizures)
•severe post-partum depression and psychosis
•research now indicates a possible link between ovarian cancer and female fertility treatments, including "egg harvesting" from infertile women and donors
•research also now indicates correlations between lower breast cancer survival rates and proximity in time to onset of cancer of last pregnancy
•research also indicates a correlation between having six or more pregnancies and a risk of coronary and cardiovascular disease

Less common (but serious) complications:


•peripartum cardiomyopathy
•cardiopulmonary arrest
•magnesium toxicity
•severe hypoxemia/acidosis
•massive embolism
•increased intracranial pressure, brainstem infarction
•molar pregnancy, gestational trophoblastic disease
(like a pregnancy-induced cancer)
•malignant arrhythmia
•circulatory collapse
•placental abruption
•obstetric fistula
More permanent side effects:
•future infertility
•permanent disability
•death.














If someone did any of the above to YOU would you fight back ? They are ALL injuries.


Did you think NOTHING happened to a woman's body while developing a fetus ???

 

The term "Pro-Choice" does NOT refer to doctors, it refers to women having the freedom to choose to have a kid or an abortion.....NOTHING ELSE.

 

I am referring to people in general who either consider themselves pro choice or pro life.

 

You can ask specific Pro-Choicers what their feelings on a particular subject are BUT

Pro-Choicers are individuals , not all think alike on subjects other than the right of women to CHOOSE abortion or gestation.

Pro-Choice is not a club where we all have to agree we like bingo or football or bowling or what doctors think or do...

 

So, here's your post. Speaking of foolish questions:

What could possibly be gained from asking if someone wishes they were never born? The point in time where a "preference" would be realized can never exist.

How is it possible for competent and qualified physicians to "decide" on anything based on the "patients wishes"? The patient is the final authority; not doctors or clergy. Its not your decision.

I agree that unwanted pregnancy should be avoided and those getting abortions did something irresponsible in most cases.

After reading your post, it appears that you believe the decision should be the doctors, not the patients. Did I misunderstand you?

 

Every time you and I started discussing abortion, 3-4 posts in you ignore every argument I present and you resort to "Its not a baby, its a mass of cells! Abortion is the law, live with it! If you don't like abortion then don't have one!". Why should I repeat that pointless process again with you or a couple of other abortion zealots? You have always followed the same path, I see no change in your irrational attitude.

Why should I waste time on a few closed minded, boring abortion zealots when I can spend that time doing something more productive?

 

Nope, absolutely spot on analogy, and yes people should be more careful, but there again they should be more careful when they do lots of things .. but .. we don't expect them to suffer because they weren't.

What a ridiculous question, do you think forcing a woman to continue a pregnancy and give birth is something beautiful?

Really, I suggest you look up the numerous comments by fairly high profile politicians when it comes to rape .. such as

"Rape is like the weather. It is inevitable, relax and enjoy it" - Clayton Williams
"If it's a legitimate rape, the females body has ways to try to shut the whole thing down" - Todd Akin
"Rape victims should make the best of a bad situation" - Rick Santorum
"If the woman has [the right to an abortion], why shouldn't a man be free to use his superior strength to force himself on a woman?" - Lawrence Lockman

These are people who influence others.

Firstly, I never said you were
Secondly, Pregnancy is already deemed legally as a serious injury in some case, equivalent to a broken limb or a gun shot wound.
Medically pregnancy is an injury - Definition of injury - harm or hurt; usually applied to damage inflicted on the body by an external force.

or

Any permanent or semi-permanent disturbance of structure or function of any part of the body caused by an external agency. Such agency may be mechanical, thermal, chemical, electrical or radiational. The term may also be applied to damage caused by infecting organisms or to psychological trauma.

ALL pregnancies cause injury to the female.

With rights come restrictions, what you are advocating is that the fetus has a greater right than any other person . .the right to impose and injure another person without consent, a right no one else has.

The woman loses her right to decide who, what, where and when her body is used by another person.

How exactly .. the fetus has the same rights as you or me as far as I am concerned .. that means it cannot impose onto another person without the consent of that person, and the woman has every right to defend herself, up to and including deadly force, to stop any and all non-consented intrusion and injure to her body .. exactly the same right you have, or would you accept a group of people being given the right to use your body without consent?

 

Its called choice.. funny enough the very thing that pro-choice people want for women .. I no more want to force doctors to perform abortions than I want to force women to remain pregnant or not.

 

HMM.. just think of what cancer does .. perhaps cancer is more than just a "ball of cells" as well.

 

Says the coward whose only argument is repeated in every thread and has been destroyed numerous times .. onl,y one thing to say really .. pot .. kettle .. black.

 

No, I respond, with facts, to your arguments which are based solely on your opinion.

I NEVER said "it's a mass of cells"........and you have been shown time and time again that a fetus is NOT a baby. Talk about "close minded" !

 

I still don't get it. If a doctor doesn't want to perform a procedure, wouldn't a "pro-choice" person want the doctor to have the choice?

 

Why is morality based on what is economical or what is good for society? Should we be allowed to assassinate anyone we think is not good for society?

 

Please see bolded above.....

 

And they obviously do have the choice. Just as I have a choice in my profession and you in yours. Obviously any doctor must have the training and skills when perfoming ANY procedure, they make the decision to do so.

Then they make it known they can do it.....if they then decide not to that is on them and means they wasted a lot of money and time.

 

Then you, I and we all are "just balls of cells" as well.

 

It's called the death penalty...

 

The referenced quote included:

Your response to that was:

You did NOT refute the assertion that only the woman gets pregnant, Did you?

You responded with a related factoid that sperm from a man is required (which, technically, is no longer true). Fertility researches have discovered a synthetic chemical mixture which can trigger the egg to clone itself (i.e. duplicate the woman's DNA) and begin growing a potential human being. My point, however, is that you claimed "Not true" so where is your evidence that men also get pregnant??

If you cannot produce such evidence then your "Not true" assertion is a lie and Fox is correct in the assertion that "Only women get pregnant."