I hope a GOD exists but I am not holding my breath!

Discussion in 'Religion & Philosophy' started by AboveAlpha, Dec 27, 2015.

  1. AboveAlpha

    AboveAlpha Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2013
    Messages:
    30,296
    Likes Received:
    545
    Trophy Points:
    83
    You know....very often on this forum I am accused of being an Atheist....which I am not.

    I am an Agnostic just like anyone who follows the Scientific Method worth their salt should be.

    But some forum members mistakenly believe just because I point out the logic and reality of things that very often point out that a loving and caring GOD is highly improbable.....that this somehow means that I would not LOVE IT if an actual loving and caring GOD existed.

    I would love that.....but all indications are against it.

    It's a fact that we cannot determine either way if any GOD or even GODS exist or not.

    There is a possibility.

    But is it PROBABLE?

    No....unfortunately the existence of any GOD or GODS existing as advertised in any known religion is highly improbable in the extreme.

    But as we change the definition of what a GOD might be...Probability changes as well.

    It really would be nice if a loving and caring GOD existed.

    But to be honest....being a man who has been all over this planet....I am just not seeing it.

    AboveAlpha
     
    FreedomSeeker, ARDY and DennisTate like this.
  2. Edial

    Edial Active Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Dec 25, 2015
    Messages:
    1,350
    Likes Received:
    6
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Ok, do you believe Jesus Christ existed in history and if you do do you believe he was a good man?
     
  3. Deckel

    Deckel Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2014
    Messages:
    17,613
    Likes Received:
    2,035
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Yeah I totally disagree with that position. Otherwise, okay.
     
  4. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2013
    Messages:
    80,791
    Likes Received:
    8,805
    Trophy Points:
    113
    its absurd to believe in the God of the Bible/Koran/Torah
     
    FreedomSeeker likes this.
  5. Edial

    Edial Active Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Dec 25, 2015
    Messages:
    1,350
    Likes Received:
    6
    Trophy Points:
    38
    I wonder why is it absurd to believe in God as defined in the Bible.
    The simple list of prophecies DOES support supernatural origin of the author.

    Things that were predicted (to a most minute detail) in the Old Testament (written before birth of Christ) happened exactly as predicted ... even naming the town of Bethlehem as the birthplace of Christ.

    Thanks,
    Ed
     
  6. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2013
    Messages:
    80,791
    Likes Received:
    8,805
    Trophy Points:
    113
    LOL!!!

    who says the prophecies in the OT came true?

    I didn't see em'.

    no one else wrote about them coming true.

    the NT was written by a guy who lived 30 years after Jesus.

    one of the Gospels doesn't even include Jesus' resurrection.
     
  7. Edial

    Edial Active Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Dec 25, 2015
    Messages:
    1,350
    Likes Received:
    6
    Trophy Points:
    38
    You do realize that even Soviet Encyclopedia believed in the historical Jesus born 4 BC in Bethlehem ...
     
  8. Jonsa

    Jonsa Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2011
    Messages:
    34,320
    Likes Received:
    5,664
    Trophy Points:
    113
    To me, there are only two points in the ultimate creation of our universe and biosphere where
    "GOD did it": is as valid an argument as any.

    The first is the what came before and what caused the big bang. this is an area of 100% speculation since we cannot comprehend a place where space/time does not exist. so God did it is as relevant and acceptable an answer as say the multiverse hypothesis.

    the second instance is the inception of terrestrial life. This is also an area of pure speculation, since each of the prevailing hypotheses is as yet unprovable, therefore believing that "GOD" created the first living cell is as valid as believing in "panspermia".

    After that, EVERYTHING THAT EVERY GOD SUPPOSEDLY SAID AND DID CAME FROM THE IMAGINATIONS AND BELIEFS OF MEN. Every significant religious scripture was written long after the events described by people who were not direct eye witnesses. And those men were profoundly ignorant of both their universe and their world. Yet for some reason, their storytelling is blindly believed and accepted.

    If god did create the universe and our biosphere, great.

    and if he did, I should think one of our key RELIGIOUS responsibilities as both a product of that biosphere and "god", would be the maintenance and preservation of our environment. the environment which has given us all the things that surround us.

    And if he did, I should think one of our key RELIGIOUS responsibilities is to preserve, maintain and enhance our species existence, especially those less fortunate, like the starving illiterate hundreds of millions that are currently struggling with their lives.

    And if he did, I should think one of our key RELIGIOUS responsibilities is to continue to explore, discover, invent, advance and apply our collective knowledge to the betterment of our biosphere and our society.

    Just sayin' that perhaps the real spiritual issue of our day is not whether god exists or which dogma is superior.
    Perhaps its more about redefining god to align its "works" with both our knowledge of those works and our participation in them.
     
    Passacaglia and ARDY like this.
  9. CrazyAl

    CrazyAl New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2015
    Messages:
    82
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    0
    You are not looking hard enough. Some would say we created God to explain the un explainable How is it going to hurt you to have a little faith? The Bible was written by men who
    were led by God in a way that is inexplicable. It was written in a way that it can speak to you personally. It can be interpreted many different ways. It is a world best seller. It makes a lot of sense. I don't see the logical problems you have. I believe in science and I am analytical. Which came first the chicken or the egg? Its not that simple, but what problems do you have
    not feeling the love of God? Bad things happen, but God is always there especially during the low times. Just pray man! You don't always get the answer you want, but become spiritual
    not just logical. Cool?
     
  10. CJtheModerate

    CJtheModerate New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2013
    Messages:
    5,846
    Likes Received:
    50
    Trophy Points:
    0
    He regularly contradicts science and regularly contradicts himself.

    Name one prophecy that came true.
     
  11. CrazyAl

    CrazyAl New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2015
    Messages:
    82
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    0
    And I suppose the many different beautiful flowers were meant just for bees. The lightning storm and rainbow are of no respective importance.
     
  12. CrazyAl

    CrazyAl New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2015
    Messages:
    82
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Are you talking about the Bible?
     
  13. Edial

    Edial Active Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Dec 25, 2015
    Messages:
    1,350
    Likes Received:
    6
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Town of Bethlehem was named in the Bible as a place of birth of Christ way before his birth.
    And Christ was born in Bethlehem.
     
  14. AboveAlpha

    AboveAlpha Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2013
    Messages:
    30,296
    Likes Received:
    545
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Well if anything the Roman's kept and demanded detailed records of everything including detailed records sent to Rome of what happened in Roman rules territories like Judea.

    So...yes...Jesus existed.

    Was he a good man....I believe so.

    Was he the Son of a GOD....Probability is low.

    AboveAlpha

    - - - Updated - - -

    Why is that?

    AboveAlpha

    - - - Updated - - -

    Probability is low...but not zero.

    But it is VERY LOW.

    AboveAlpha

    - - - Updated - - -

    This has zero supporting evidence.

    AboveAlpha
     
    DennisTate likes this.
  15. Phoebe Bump

    Phoebe Bump New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 11, 2010
    Messages:
    26,350
    Likes Received:
    171
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I agree. All indications are against the kind of God the RELIGIONISTS DESCRIBE. There are certainly other possibilities.
     
  16. AboveAlpha

    AboveAlpha Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2013
    Messages:
    30,296
    Likes Received:
    545
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Nice sentiment.

    But Probability is still low a GOD exists.

    AboveAlpha

    - - - Updated - - -

    You think I have not Prayed???

    Everyone has at some point.

    I have been all over the world and I have seen some things so horrific it is difficult to discuss them.

    GOD has left the building!

    AboveAlpha

    - - - Updated - - -

    I can see you are not educated as far as in how the Bible was created by the Roman Imperial Biblical Canon.

    It is a creation of man.

    AboveAlpha

    - - - Updated - - -

    Yes....as the definition of a GOD is left more open ended then Probability increases.

    AboveAlpha
     
    DennisTate likes this.
  17. Deckel

    Deckel Well-Known Member Past Donor

    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2014
    Messages:
    17,613
    Likes Received:
    2,035
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Because I like to be disagreeable and because the scientific method could be used by religious people who seek to find a greater understanding of their deity through its work. Whether or not one believes in God has no bearing on whether or not a drug cures cancer, a lobster can do laps on a treadmill, or if nuclear fusion occurs in our bowels after eating Taco Bell after midnight.
     
  18. AboveAlpha

    AboveAlpha Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2013
    Messages:
    30,296
    Likes Received:
    545
    Trophy Points:
    83
    LOL!!!

    You might have something as far as the whole Taco Bell/Fusion thing!!!

    I am Agnostic because it is not currently possible to complete rule out that a GOD or GODS exist.

    Plus depending upon definition....if one was to consider GOD as NATURE or perhaps a COLLECTIVE CONSCIOUSNESS....then that changes things doesn't it?

    But the Probability that a GOD or GODS exist in the way advertised in any ancient human religious text or writing is a VERY LOW PROBABILITY.

    Probability of that is....1 chance in 10^178th.

    That's 1 in 10 with 178 zero's after it.

    A STATISTICAL IMPOSSIBILITY exists at 1 in 10^150th.

    AboveAlpha
     
    DennisTate likes this.
  19. CJtheModerate

    CJtheModerate New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2013
    Messages:
    5,846
    Likes Received:
    50
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Yes.

    1. There is no evidence that he was born in Bethlehem.
    2. Coincidences happen.
     
  20. yardmeat

    yardmeat Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2010
    Messages:
    16,060
    Likes Received:
    3,761
    Trophy Points:
    113
    The Bible "predicted" several things that failed. Tyre wasn't wiped out by Nebuchadnezzar, and the second coming was supposed to happen within the lifetime of Jesus's followers. There has been a lot of semantic tiptoeing around such prophecies in order to "prove" them correct, but at best that makes all prophecy too ambiguous to be considered a remarkable success.
     
    FreedomSeeker likes this.

Share This Page