Islam v The United States: How To Diffuse a Political Time-Bomb

Ok, so they've got the Right to do so....

My point was, in response to the comments about not being able to single out a particular group or religion, clearly in certain circumstances, the supreme court DOES this...

What I am asking, what STANDARD is used to interrupt those exceptions to the 14th Amendment Rights?

In the creation of Affirmative Action, the 14th Amendment Rights of White Males were superseded, in the judgement of the supreme court, by the need for society at large to provide redress for the past wrongs done to Black Americans.

Well, when they made the judgement for the creation of Affirmative Action, they must have had some standard by which they judged it was needed? What was it?

Does the threat of escalating Radical Islamic Bombing on a Daily basis met that criteria?

Would it be appropriate to suspend the Radical Muslim's 14th Amendment Rights in order to protect the rest of society from escalating bomb attacks?

If so, for how long? What criteria should be used to continue the suspension? On what period of time will it be reviewed? What is the Scope with which the suspension is given? Does it apply to equal treat for ALL Laws, or just particular ones having to do with security issues?

You see, Affirmative Action was done completely in the WRONG WAY!

It has existed for far, far longer, than the anti-black, kkk, lynching threat it was created to counter.

It was stated that AA would be given Strict Scrutiny, but we never followed through.

It was stated that the 14th Amendment Rights of White Males would be temporarily suspended, but it would end with the threat, it did not!

We have created a whole Industry out of Racial Preferences and made new Career Fields in Ethnic Studies.

If we are going to use the Supreme Court to overturn the 14th Amendment Rights of Muslim Americans, we certainly do not want to turn it into the debacle that Affirmative Action has become.

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It is the Religion of Cain. The actual fact of banishment of criminals that the story of Cain represented led to groups of predatory tribes who, millennia later, were susceptible to Mohammed's preachings. Another interesting fact was that the Mongols, the most vicious predators in history, converted to Islam after they conquered the Middle East.

Hitler regretted that Europe had not stopped the Jihad in 732. He wished his Germans had been forced into Islam, which he viewed as totally devoted to merciless unprovoked war and conquest.

Of course, some appeasers would look at us as apes if we fight back to total victory. A man would look at us as chickens if we don't.

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And put Islam out for all time.

 

Uh...that's not the point. Two wrong apes don't make a right ape.

 

Well, whether you believe in it or not, two wrongs canceling each other to make justice is exactly the logic used to create Affirmative Action.

Our society tries to use a "Countering Wrong' approach all the time.

Maybe we should re-evaluate those policies?

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Maybe we should try to understand why people hate us so much, and not do so by glorifying what we do like a bunch of narcissists; but instead by a fearless moral inventory...

There's nothing that would grind their gears more at this point than for us to turn a new leaf and gain world respect by some soul searching....if you must try to hurt them, hurt them more creatively than with military machinery.. look at how much they and their ever-willing Russian buddy are trying to bait us to do something crappy in Syria? I mean, if you can't smell the stink bait in that situation, you need your nose examined...

 

So we change ourselves to be less offensive to them as an Appeasement Concession?

And when you've finished with that change, then they'll pick out some new thing to "Hate" U.S. About, until we change again, and again, and again,..


Until we are a Sharia Law State totally under the control of Radical Islamic Rule.

No Thanks.

I don't need their judgement to tell what is right and wrong with America. I reserve the right to judge that for MYSELF.

I won't let some foreign power(s) dictate my sense of what America should be, and through that judgement, gain control of our country. They've shown they have enough problems governing their own country.

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No, I understand the perspective. No concession in isolation will temper their desire for the destruction of what they view as the 'Great Satan'. We could denounce all the gays and even eradicate them (just like many of our Christian fundies want I suppose) and it wouldn't make a dent. They don't want us to merely modify our private lifestyles. They want to force us to submit completely to their creed. There is alot more to it than the their hatred of the gays.

 

You are trying to change us in a way that any rational human being finds offensive. You are trying to change our government from being religiously neutral to being overtly anti-Muslim, which implies that Christianity is superior. Take that stuff back where you got it.

Latrine is that way------->

 

No, we change ourselves because self searching is a noble goal. I realize islamics won't give a fig; at least the ones that are as irrationally stubborn and adamant that their shortcomings are somehow attributes. We do it for ourselves and by doing we strengthen our nation. Islamics fear our strength and may then want to not look so looney in comparison?

It's worth a try. What have we got to lose? We still have the world's largest nuclear arsenal. We can afford some self-reflecting time without too much fear of "looking weak"..

 

we do not punish Americans because some overseas group of people did this or that

our constitution did that to black people and women, it was later removed, so there was a corrective action put in place

 

If you're saying we Americans should take some time for introspection, and after finding some fault in ourselves, we should seek to improve on that fault, with our own, and ONLY our own judgement guiding the process. And making no capitulation what-so-ever to the demands of Islam...

Ok, Fine, I'm always good for introspection and self-improvement.

But if that's the case, why bring up Islam at all?

You could have simply created a thread calling for Americans to review their own society for faults and try to improve?

Why the title of the thread indicating a This Vs. That contest between Islam and America?

Because of that title, in this situation, sorry, I don't quite trust your motives...


P.S. If there's one area were this Thread has brought up a problem in America, I would say we should start reviewing our policy of suspending the 14th Amendment Rights of White Males, and perhaps if we're going to champion "Diversity", we begin doing so in a 14th Amendment Compliant fashion.

IOW: If you can have too many Whites, you can also have too few. If you can have too few Blacks, you can also have too many.

White Americans DO have Civil Rights. Quite often, particularly by the current Obama Administration, this seems to get forgotten.

If you're going to honor and teach about Black Culture and History, You should also Honor and Teach about White Culture and History.

A few of those Ideas of the Greek Philosophers just might prove valuable, you never can tell.

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That "corrective action" has grown in scope out of all reasonable proportion, and has continued beyond any reasonable time, and has been narrowed to target just one particular group for exemption from the benefits given to all others, namely, white males.

What possible justification can there be today, in 2013 America, not 1960s America, to continue to restrict the 14th Amendment Rights to White Male Americans?

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Because they need to do the same. And it's harder for them to convince the rest of the world that we are infidels if we are exhibiting signs of self-reflection and restraint on our run-away "freedoms" [read: debauchery]

 

Given what I've seen of Islamic Sexual Practices in many, but not all, Islamic societies, I suspect if you knew more, you'd say they were the people committing "Debauchery".

Most Western civilizations don't approve of sex with 12 year old girls. Mohammad had a 12 year old wife. With that example, sex with young girls is common, though they reserve the out side of marriage sex for foriegn, non-Muslim sex slaves.

In the Scandinavian countries, there is an epidemic of Islamic Rape occurring, where rape is being systematically used as a weapon of international invasion and cultural domination.

The attitude expressed most often by the Rapist in trial is not one of shame but of "They deserved it for dressing that way, and who cares, they're just impure non-Muslim women anyway"..

The level of hypocrisy among many Muslims on the subject of sexual morals is staggering.

Furthermore, America is not of one mind about sexual morals. Some Americans, namely Christian conservatives, often abstain from sex until marriage. Other Americans, Namely Liberals, see Sex as just part of the dating ritual which serves as a means to "Get to know the person better".

In America, We cannot correct our Sexual Morals as a society, because we don't have a common conception of what "Correct" sexual morals are...

We will have to leave those corrections to be at an individual level, as it always has been in America.
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Yes, back when women died commonly before they were 30. The idea was that if you wanted any children you took young women just menstruating in order to have them. If they waited until a female they loved was 18, she would probably be dead by then. Times have changed and so have our customs and laws. And rightfully so. A 12 year old back then was just as immature mentally as now I'm sure, well, maybe a bit more seasoned to the realities of life just because of the hardness of life then. So now that we have the luxury of letting our children grow up, we do. Thank goodness.

The context of all things written in these ancient texts, the Koran and the Bible needs to be examined in the light of the differences in technology, wisdom, enlightenment and how it has evolved over the centuries. The truth about the basic, say, 10 Commandments never seems to waver with time though.

 

I had never looked at that issue in quite that way before, but I suppose from a historical perspective, you're probably right. It is an interesting observation.

So what is about Islam that keeps its culture and people locked in the medieval mindset, where almost all other cultures are able to progress in morals, culture, and social norms to keep up with the opportunities presented by advanced technology?

If Islam could be given a strong dose of whatever that difference is, could it be somewhat "Cured"?

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Oh geez, their attacks on us have nothing to do with our debauchery. Again, from our first encounter as a nation with the Muslims

But one cannot get around what Jefferson heard when he went with John Adams to wait upon Tripoli’s ambassador to London in March 1785. When they inquired by what right the Barbary states preyed upon American shipping, enslaving both crews and passengers, America’s two foremost envoys were informed that “it was written in the Koran, that all Nations who should not have acknowledged their authority were sinners, that it was their right and duty to make war upon whoever they could find and to make Slaves of all they could take as prisoners, and that every Mussulman who should be slain in battle was sure to go to Paradise.”
http://www.city-journal.org/html/17_...jefferson.html

 

Only seems that way to you because you are unfamiliar with Christian doctrine.



Ephesians 2
15 by abolishing in his flesh the law with its commandments and regulations.

Hebrews 8
13 By calling this covenant "new," he has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and aging will soon disappear.

Romans 10
4Christ is the end of the law so that there may be righteousness for everyone who believes.(*)

Romans 7
6But now, by dying to what once bound us, we have been released from the law so that we serve in the new way of the Spirit, and not in the old way of the written code.

2 Corinthians 3
13We are not like Moses, who would put a veil over his face to keep the Israelites from gazing at it while the radiance was fading away. 14But their minds were made dull, for to this day the same veil remains when the old covenant is read. It has not been removed, because only in Christ is it taken away.

Galatians 3 13Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us, for it is written: "Cursed is everyone who is hung on a tree."

23Before this faith came, we were held prisoners by the law, locked up until faith should be revealed. 24So the law was put in charge to lead us to Christ[h] that we might be justified by faith. 25Now that faith has come, we are no longer under the supervision of the law(*)

Matthew 5:
38 You have heard that it was said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth.
39 But I say to you, Do not resist the evil man [who injures you]; but if anyone strikes you on the right jaw or cheek, turn to him the other one too.
40 And if anyone wants to sue you and take your undershirt (tunic), let him have your coat also.
41 And if anyone forces you to go one mile, go with him two [miles].
42 Give to him who keeps on begging from you, and do not turn away from him who would borrow [[a]at interest] from you.
43 You have heard that it was said, You shall love your neighbor and hate your enemy;
44 But I tell you, Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you,

 

...lol... I know enough to know that the New Testament came after the Old Testament. Matthew is in the New. And that's the one you cited that have some of the Ten Commandments. Actually, boiling it down further, the Golden Rule is really the one that stands the test of time..

And one we should all remember: "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you".

 

Actually, that is just the King James Bible translation version of the Adage.

The original, for the old testament, or more specifically from the Jewish Torah as passed down in a form of unpointed text, or a type on encryption which removes all of the vowels, and makes the text verses all the same length of characters. This encryption mechanism makes the checking of the text very concise, and makes the chance of transcription errors and/or re-interpretation much less likely.

There are two different ancient Hebrew Verb Tenses at work in the passage you have quoted, and the agendized translators of King James, chose to use a translation which met the needs of justifying the Crusades, at the time the translation was made.

The Tense of the verb chosen by King James is the Active sense, meaning to take action to make something happen.

The actual correct translation from the original encrypted text would use the passive tense of the verb.

A more correct translation of the original Hebrew in the Torah would read:

But King James needed a Justification for "Do Unto-ing" to encourage the crusades, so the verse was converted.


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Google "gates of ijtihad"

 

Describe the "gates of ijtihad" instead dixon?

 

What was wrong with racial exclusion? The results of its correction prove that it was right in the first place, especially since the few who were unfairly excluded turned into Hate Whitey militants when allowed admission. For example, Stokely Carmichael was brilliant but used his new right to education to lower himself into supporting the worst elements of his race. If you give them an inch and they take a mile, you should not only take back the inch but penalize them an inch backward from where they started.

 

Any "waver with time" by definition would have "came after" the earlier time.

The golden rule isn't found within the ten commandments.

Not even sure what your point is in regard to your original claim that the ten commandments never "waver".(*)

 

She thinks that we are all apes and that she is Tarzan's Jane. Nag, nag, nag.