there is no reputable geneological source that claims that Eisenhower's ancestors were Jews. just cause he had an offensive nickname at West Point doesn't mean he was a Jew. nevermind the fact he has NO Swedish ancestors.MOD EDIT>>>RULE 3<<<
an after thought, and just to show how incredulously over the top ridiculous and the depths of denial and lies that the apologists will stoop, we are supposed to believe that this war criminal who openly admits his war crimes that he wanted to exterminate innocent germans, and he single handedly murdered over 1.2million germans AFTER the war is over by starvation, and states on many other occasions how he he hates germans to others and in letters to his wife is not really jewish! Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight! If it were not so sad that america would stoop to harboring and supporting war criminals then force feed its own citizens propaganda to cover it all up this would be hilarious. Then add churchill who admitted he will stop at no level of terror: You ask, what is our policy? I will say: It is to wage war, by sea, land and air, with all our might and with all the strength that God can give us: to wage war against a monstrous tyranny, never surpassed in the dark, lamentable catalogue of human crime. That is our policy. You ask, what is our aim? I can answer in one word: It is victory, victory at all costs, victory in spite of all terror, victory, however long and hard the road may be; for without victory, there is no survival. -Winston Churchill
http://law2.umkc.edu/faculty/projects/ftrials/nuremberg/hoesstest.html PS Gittin wasn't even a person. It has another meaning.
riiiiiiight and the ONLY court in the history of mankind that accepted testimony from someone who had the livin (*)(*)(*)(*) tortured out of them is nuremburg. shining example of truth and justice!
! Samuel 18:7 Saul as killed his thousands and David his ten thousands. Of course David had not killed ten thousands. This was his first battle. This is the Hebrew was of saying the people preferred David. 2 Chronicles 14:9 Zerah the Ehtiopian came up against them (King Asa and Judah) with an army of a million men and 300 chariots. Asa had 300,000 men and 280,000 warriors of the tribe of Benjamin. No army of that time could ever assemble a million men, neither could Asa assemble that many from Judah and Benjamin. There may have been a battle, but the numbers are ridiculous if you've studied ancient history. They are simply saying that Asa was outnumber so didn't he do well to defeat the Ethiopians. 1 Chronicles 19. The Arameans supposedly hired 32000 chariots to fight David. David's army is supposed to have killed 7,000 chariteers and 40,000 foot soldiers. 32,000 chariots is laughable. The largest chariot battle of all time between the Egyptians and the Hittites only involved 5-6,000 chariots. Another example of exaggeration. I can give you many instances from the Tanakh when figures mean little. The event is recorded and facts are exaggerated. This is the way the Hebrews wrote. They also used picture/story language to get a point over. Jesus the preacher followed their example. So the numbers of Jewish children is certainly disputable - if only you know how to read Judaism and Jewish ways. The Romans massacred the people of the village of Bethar - that is certain. The Talmuds were written long after Bar Kokba's stronghold of Bethar was destroyed by the Romans. Do the Talmuds lie when the people they were written for (the Jews) know how to read them, how to interprete them. It's like the Tanakh. We all read them without understanding the Jewish meaning behind them. Why? Because we're not Jews. They weren't written for us. Christians use it in their Bible because they claim it is where Jesus was prophesied. The Jews don't believe that, neither do I. The Tanakh should stand alone. That the Holocaust occurred I am in no doubt. That Gas chambers were used I am in no doubt. The only thing I don't know is how many Jews were killed. And I doubt anyone ever will Now that's my last comment. I'm quite happy not bothering with the Talmuds. Having tried reading them I gave up - bored. They have no meaning for today. Try Rambam's Mishneh Torah for a change. Good Luck
So that magic 6 million figure was pulled from thin air. They were just following tradition of puffing things up. Maybe it was more like 60,000. 6 million does sound more impressive. I can see why they went with the larger number. It would have been cool to have seen that million man Ethiopian army march all the way to Israel. I wonder how long it took them? And then they got defeated when they got there. What a bummer. Once the story starts unraveling because of exaggerations then everything in it loses credibility. It's just another fairy tale, and that's the truth.
Are 60,000 innocent human 'sacrifices' any better than 6 million? Not at all. The fact that an event is exaggerated does not mean it did not occur. Some of the 'exaggerated' events recorded in the Bible are confirmed by extraneous records - without the exaggerations.. It's a matter of dragging facts from fiction which can only be done by understanding the subject. The savagery of the supposedly intelligent lifeform called humans is unequalled in the animal world where killing is usually for food and territory. Humanity wants these things for greed. An intelligent race would settle things reasonably amicably. Still, one day in the future man will destroy himself unless he uses his intelligence.
Which Jews were exterminated at the concentration camps, and which Jews emigrated to various parts of the world depended on the decisions of influential Jews like the Rothschilds, Warburgs, and Schiffs. These Jews decided that Jews who would not be able to assimilate into the communities they were being directed to would have to be exterminated. To blame the world for the decisions made by the heads of the World Jewish Community concerning which Jews were "old believers" and therefore unlikely to assimilate, and which Jews weren't is ludicrous. These same leading Jews, financed the Russian Revolution. If they were 'detailed oriented' enough to pull off a bloody revolution in Russia, certainly they were savvy enough to obtain the release of the Jews who had been rounded up and placed in concentration camps. It is ridiculous to suggest that leading Jews of the time did not know that Jews in Europe were being rounded up and sent to concentration camps. Why didn't they help these Jews? Read a book called the The Warburgs. It is quite telling.
They didn't 'pull off a 'Bloody Revolution' in Russia. If they had they were to be sadly disillusioned. Russian Bolsheviks executed over 150,000 Jews in 1918 and the persecution continued for a while. What a supposed waste of money, and the real loss of Jewish lives. 'Detailed oriented'? What went wrong? By invading Germany? Many Jews did manage to escape and settled in various countries. Others were not so fortunate. We have the same situation today in the Middle East The UK and the US brought about the situation and refuse to resettle their victims. We've been through this earlier.
It's quite fascinating to follow a discussion about Talmud, Jews, and Zionism, between people who haven't the faintest shadow of an idea about Judaism, Jewish history and present, and the meaning of the word Zionism (I'm talking about some of the posters, not all, obviously). There are three major points to be remembered in any discussion about Judaism: 1. There are no dogmas in Judaism. 2. There's no centralized leadership in religious matters in Judaism. The chief rabbis in Israel fulfill a bureaucratic function rather than a religious one. 3. Rabbis' opinions on different issues differ greatly. They freely contradict each other, even such "sacred cows" as Maimonides or Ovadia Yosef are not beyond critique and criticism. There are another three major points to be remembered in any discussion about Talmud, keeping in mind the three already mentioned above: 1. Intimate knowledge of the Torah is imperative for understanding the Talmud. 2. Talmud consists of two main parts - Mishna and Gemara. Mishna contains the oral laws. Gemara contains the discussions about the oral laws. Mishna is mandatory. Gemara is not - there are different opinions of different rabbis, those rabbis frequently contradict one another, none of their words is law. 3. Taking any phrase or paragraph in the Gemara out of its context and presenting it as a stand-alone talmudic law is not only horribly wrong - since there are no laws in the Gemara - but it's also stupid, because a stand-alone phrase from the Talmud can't be understood properly outside the wider context of the chapter and the even wider context of the Torah as basis for the oral laws. There are some fringe extremists who think like this. But the widespread mainstream opinion about the end times is that all nations will live in peace. From an orthodox Jewish site: http://www.beingjewish.com/toshuv/real_messiah.html This is also what Chabad says. You probably meant to say "ultra-Orthodox", the extremists within the Orthodox community (they all look extremists to an atheist like me, of course, but from a religious perspective not all of them are extremists). The words "Orthodox Jews" cover quite a sizable portion of the religious sector in Israel and abroad. There are significant differences between various communities. None of those two rabbis are famous in Israel. They might be famous in their communities. Yosef Mizrachi is a religious bigot, defending another religious bigot. Shock...not. http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/news...omments-made-about-6-million-kedosim-hyd.html To be continued. Stay tuned.
Hi Pisa, thank you for the elaboration. However, to me it is the way 'world peace' will be established... as a lot of wars are being fought for that, which I don't think should be the way to go. And I have another question, as it seems there is written in the Torah (or Talmud) that 'every Jew will have +- 2000 slaves' once all is set. [video=youtube;1UUXzHNxHOo]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1UUXzHNxHOo[/video] What's that all about?
It's not 2,000 slaves. It's 2,800 slaves. http://www.come-and-hear.com/shabbath/shabbath_32.html Shabbath 32b = "Resh Lakish said: He who is observant of fringes will be privileged to be served by two thousand eight hundred slaves, for it is said, Thus saith the Lord of hosts: In those days it shall come to pass, that ten men shall take hold, out of all the languages of the nations shall even take hold of the skirt of him that is a Jew, saying, We will go with you, etc.14" *footnote 14: "Zech. VIII, 23, 'Skirt' is regarded as referring to the fringe (cf. n. 2.). There are four fringes, and traditionally there are seventy languages: we thus have 70 X 10 X 4 = 2800." The Jews got rich financing the slave trade to the Western Hemisphere, especially to Brazil. And since the idea of owning slaves is part of their religious doctrine it was only natural that they would participate in it for their own benefit.
and yet the vast majority of the World's Jews had nothing to do with the slave trade. and btw, slavery is not illegal in Christianity.
Just about everyone has a cell phone today but only a few people make them. Owning slaves is part of the Jewish religion. It's in the Bible and in the Talmud. Each Jew is promised 2,800 slaves if he follows the religion. If they think that's evil then they should stop following the religion but they don't. Some people might be willing to volunteer to be a Jew's slave for eternity like it says in Shabbath 32b but I won't. Ethnocentric Middle Eastern Jewish and Arabian religious fairy tales are __________________. Why anyone else believe them just proves that they are idiots.
by that logic, misoginy is part of the Christian religion, as Paul orders women to not teach men, not have any authority over men, to never braid their hair. btw, Jesus NEVER condemned slavery. not once.
Aren't you supposed to be defending the fairy tale instead of attacking it? Jesus was a Jew. He believed that Jews should own slaves. When he returns he will make Gentiles his slaves. Paul was supposedly a Jew. He preached the typical Jewish belief at the time that women were subservient to men. Christians are supposed to follow that belief. When church people give women equal rights in church they are not following Christian doctrine as stated in the Bible. They have created a new religion.
Really? Where? Bad translation. Very, very, very bad, seeing how there are so many rabbis with so many different opinions and interpretations that obeying them all is mission impossible squared spiced with the finest arsenic. The correct translation is "mocks", not "disobeys". "Everyone who mocks the words of sages". Hell is not mentioned. Of course, if you bother to read the passage yourself, you'll have the nasty surprise to discover that this statement (not a law) is immediately contradicted by another rabbi. As I said, to every rabbi his own opinion. Please provide the quote. I've read the text and didn't find it. http://halakhah.com/pdf/moed/Moed_Katan.pdf Page 65. Almost. Heathen means "pagan", not gentile. "Worthy of death" does not equal "must be killed". The meaning of the phrase is explained in the footnote: "By the Hand of God". The "Hitting a Jew is the same as hitting God" stuff is too heavy for me. The footnote mentions Proverbs 20:25 as a source, but I'm not sure I see the connection. Maybe this is about Jews being a nation of priests, dedicated to God, thus the heathen who smites a Jew is "the man who devoureth that which is holy". Anyway, again, this is the opinion of one rabbi, not a law. "Cuthean" means "Samaritan", not Gentile. The discussion is about robbery. The rabbi argues that withholding wages is not robbery, it's only bordering on robbery, "for actual robbery means depriving a person of what he already possesses". This is pilpul at its best, but not a law. Any questions so far? The peace will come after Messiah will have defeated all the enemies of the Jews. I'll have to study the "Gentiles will be slaves" stuff. I know that ultra-Orthodox Jews have some unsavory views, straight from the darkest period of the Middle Ages. I'm interested in the mainstream opinions, not only of Orthodox but also of Conservative and Reform Jews. Three Jews' opinions - one of them a member of the very extreme and anti-Zionist Neturei Karta - are not a proper basis for debate.
