Pentagon will send more than 50 F-35s to Europe to deter Russia

Discussion in 'Latest US & World News' started by Thedimon, Oct 23, 2019.

  1. Sobo

    Sobo Banned

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    We have no enemy who poses a threat. Who you think will attack us? Switzerland?

    Add the fact that we dont defend others and you get why things are like they are.
     
    Ethereal likes this.
  2. gnoib

    gnoib Well-Known Member

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    Hihihihihihihihihihi
     
  3. Robert E Allen

    Robert E Allen Banned

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    that's also called not pulling your weight!
     
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  4. Robert E Allen

    Robert E Allen Banned

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    just for argument sake how long does it take to fuel a ICBM


    and given russian technology and manufacturing i expect a 70% failure rate for Russian icbms
     
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  5. Talon

    Talon Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    LOL - For what its worth the Luftwaffe could use hot air balloons to protect your skies. The days of worrying about defending Germany's airspace ended when you were a little boy.
     
  6. APACHERAT

    APACHERAT Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Again the F-35 is not an air superiority fighter. It's # 1 mission is ground attack, battlefield air interdiction not close air support.

    But like the F-4 Phantom that wasn't excellent at any mission, it was good at performing all missions.
    (Interceptor, air superiority, dog fighter, ground attack, close air support, deepstrike attack, high altitude bomber. reconence, electronic warfare...the jack of all trades)

    The F-35 is a dual purpose warbird, the F-4 Phantom of the 21st Century.

    But I just don't see the F-35B being able to provide CAS for Marine grunts.
     
  7. Badaboom

    Badaboom Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Mach 2.4 isn't needed anymore, that's 60s tech.
    You need the speed when you dogfight but nobody dogfight anymore. IN the majority of modern air combat you'll never ever be in range to dogfight anyway which mean that the one being stealth has all the advantage.
     
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  8. Sobo

    Sobo Banned

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    I think we have the duty to defend our country, we have no duty to fight in syria or some other shithole.

    Its that easy.
     
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  9. Sobo

    Sobo Banned

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    Ground attack? We should attack targets on our own soil?
     
  10. Badaboom

    Badaboom Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Only somebody suicidal would only prepare to fight on their own soil. Defense doesn't win wars, and as they say, the bombers always go through. So unless you want your own citizen to die, you'd be better served by fighting your wars on your enemies territory.
     
  11. Badaboom

    Badaboom Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Troops and tanks will be invading on the ground... You're really not thinking this through.
     
  12. gnoib

    gnoib Well-Known Member

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    Ever heard of Topol?
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2019
  13. Robert E Allen

    Robert E Allen Banned

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    Nope
     
  14. APACHERAT

    APACHERAT Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Not exactly, that's why there's a Poland so Germany can fight it's wars in Poland and not in Germany.

    Now America does it a little differently.
    America prefers to fight its wars 3,000 to 8,000 miles from the CONUS in exotic, distant lands where American soldiers and Marines meet exciting unusual people and kill them.
    Or in some hithole country.
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2019
  15. Badaboom

    Badaboom Well-Known Member Past Donor

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  16. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    When you get desperate you go off the turnip truck. Germans can't do maintenance ... are you serious - do not ever stop and listen to yourself and realize how absurd what you are saying is.

    The Grounding of the F-35 has nothing to do with the skills of the technicians -(and Germany is Top Tier - and everyone but you knows this) - and everything to do with the fact that it is poorly designed plane .. described as "a Lemon" by Pierre Sprey - one of the team who was involved in the design of the F-16 and the A-10.

    .
    Bombshell report finds some F35 fighter jets will only fly for a QUARTER of their expected life because of 'major structural issues'
    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/science...-QUARTER-expected-life-structural-issues.html


    Who would want such a piece of Junk .. a plane that will be out of service (2026) before the problems are fixed.

    https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2013/09/joint-strike-fighter-lockheed-martin

    The above is from 2013 - 3 years after the plane was supposed to be combat ready - Oh .. but they were working on the problems and said they would be resolved.

    2019 and the problems are still not resolved. 9 years after this lemon was supposed to be ready for combat.

    F-35 stealth fighter is still struggling with a string of big problems even as the Pentagon talks about ramping up production

    https://www.businessinsider.com/f-35-still-struggling-with-more-than-dozen-big-problems-2019-6

    A few problems are listed below.
    The F-35 Finally Met Its Nemesis: Weather
    https://www.esquire.com/news-politics/politics/news/a53734/f-35-thunderstorm/

    America Is Stuck With a $400 Billion Stealth Fighter That Can’t Fight

    https://www.thedailybeast.com/ameri...ar400-billion-stealth-fighter-that-cant-fight

    So here is a plane that

    1) Cant fly in the rain or bad weather
    2) Cant fly if it is too hot or too cold
    3) Cant go supersonic without damaging the stealth coating
    4) Has oxygen issues to the point where pilots are refusing to fly
    5) Must avoid "steep climbing or other hard maneuvers" things that other planes can do - can't dogfight. “It is infeasible for the Navy or Marine Corps to operate the F-35 against a near-peer threat under such restrictions,”
    6) Software Still doesn't work properly = 5th generation doesn't work
    7) Helmet issues
    8) Corrosion issues
    9) lifespan that is 1/4 of what it is supposed to be .. the plane will be retired prior to being combat ready at this rate.
    10) Structural problems - cracking - corrosion

    So what - we have to wait for good weather to take out those Russian ICBM's that are fueling and getting ready to launch ?

    Not that this slow flying Turkey could get through Russian air defenses even if it was a clear day and the temperature moderate.

    This plane is a national embarrassment - A plane that is such a piece of junk that as of 2018 the Pentagon has made its problem report "Top Secret".

    F-35 troubles: Pentagon refuses to accept new aircraft as its makes problem report ‘Top Secret’
    https://www.news.com.au/technology/...t/news-story/220610ce01157b1c32dbc947135a3b26
     
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  17. gnoib

    gnoib Well-Known Member

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    Solid Fuel mobile ICBM, multy warheads, 10 to 11,000 km range.
     
  18. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The Baltic nations are what they are .. shipping 100 F-35s to some location in Europe is not going to deter Russia from doing anything.

    " I think it's clear that securing a port for the Black Sea Fleet was what the invasions of both Ukraine of Georgia were ultimately about"

    Exactly. Russia and the US are not going to war with each other. Look at Syria - and how they avoided each other. Did our planes in proximity the of Syria deter Russia from helping Assad ? Nope.

    This is nothing but the Military Industrial Complex looking for a reasons to justify our 1 Trillion dollar annual Total Military Spend.

    The war in Syria is over - and we some new threat to justify our massive military spend. Perhaps we will have a go at Libya again.
     
  19. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Red Flag is a joke - and everyone knows it :)

    Contrary to your claim - 1) there is no "actual record" with respect to combat - not of any significance ... although in the limited combat the plane did get in Syria by the Israeli's The ancient Syrian Air defense managed to hit one with a missiles - the plane was able to make it back to base but will never fly again.

    linked to in an earlier post.

    1) Cant fly in the rain or bad weather
    2) Cant fly if it is too hot or too cold
    3) Cant go supersonic without damaging the stealth coating
    4) Has oxygen issues to the point where pilots are refusing to fly
    5) Must avoid "steep climbing or other hard maneuvers" things that other planes can do - can't dogfight. “It is infeasible for the Navy or Marine Corps to operate the F-35 against a near-peer threat under such restrictions,”
    6) Software Still doesn't work properly = 5th generation doesn't work
    7) Helmet issues
    8 ) Corrosion and structural issues
    9) lifespan that is 1/4 of what it is supposed to be .. the plane will be retired prior to being combat ready at this rate.
    10) Structural problems - cracking - corrosion
     
  20. gnoib

    gnoib Well-Known Member

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    The war in Syria is not over. The US plans to send troops and tanks into East Syria.
     
  21. Robert E Allen

    Robert E Allen Banned

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    Red flag is not a joke..

    The Russians are liars.
     
  22. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The war in Syria is over - with respect to the radical Islamist Jihadist proxy army that was fighting against Assad.
     
  23. Robert E Allen

    Robert E Allen Banned

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    Update your info.

    Thr f 35 now flies in all weather

    The supersonic limitation is the c and b models.
    The much more numerous A models have no such issue..

    It's new tech there will be issues.

    By all accounts it's still a great fighter that has no trouble dealing with any threats.
     
  24. Talon

    Talon Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    LOL - What does that even mean?

    I'm inclined to disagree. Upgrading one's defenses usually does deter aggression.

    We'll ignore our little run-in with the Russians at Deir el-Zour, but while I'm optimistic we won't be going to war with them that's kinda beside the point. The point is deterring the Russians from expanding its revanchist aggression and invading one of our allies in Eastern Europe, and if sending 50-100 F-35s over there accomplishes that goal it sure beats the alternative.

    The Russians are a new threat? We just started to deploy forces in Europe to deter Russian aggression? Where have you been the past 74 years? :lol:

    Don't be so glum, chum. Trump's decision to pull our men and women out of Syria - a move I happen to support - is hardly consistent with a policy that needs to find new threats and get us entangled in more conflicts just to enrich the MIC. I could be wrong, but he seems set on reversing the course Woodrow Wilson set our country on a century ago, and if I'm right that's a development we should all welcome.
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2019
  25. Giftedone

    Giftedone Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I didn't quote any Russian sources - While this is a not so admirable but highly desperate attempt to grasp at straws - because you have no retort to the evidence.

    Combat Simulations are notoriously flawed to begin with but you did not get the kill ration correct .. was 15-1 not 20 and it is not known whether these kills were attributed to the F-35 or other aircraft in the battle.

    Let’s Talk About Those F-35 Kill Ratio Reports From Red Flag

    https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zo...t-those-f-35-kill-ratio-reports-from-red-flag


    The F-35 gets waxed by F-16's and other aircraft in dogfights

    https://www.businessinsider.com/f-35-vs-f-16-15-18-lost-beaten-flatley-comeback-2017-4

    Pentagon’s big budget F-35 fighter ‘can’t turn, can’t climb, can’t run

    http://blogs.reuters.com/great-deba...t-f-35-fighter-cant-turn-cant-climb-cant-run/

    The only way the F-35 can win is if it can avoid other planes - it is simply not designed for dogfighting .. and every analyst admits this.

    The F-35 is reliant on Stealth. Unfortunately for the F-35 ... Stealth is a Scam :)
    .
     

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