The European / Syrian Refugee crisis

Really? If you think that they were behind the Arab Spring, then answer following questions please:
Was the Mubarak regime a close friend and important ally of the USA and did USA support Egypt much with military assistance etc.?
The answer can only be a full Yes ... or do you think USA modernize an unfriendly county and army with for example about 1,000 M1A1 tanks?

So then answer please why USA shall support or being behind Arab Spring which put away Mubarak from power?

 

I’m sure that all those Afghanis, Pakistanis, Syrians etc…etc….have obtained much better education than an average German and will greatly enrich the German society. They also have exceptional social skills and are well-known the be the most tolerant human beings on the planet. It will take years for them to learn to speak German language properly. Not to mention reading and writing. An engineer without language skills is as good as a street attendant. Get a grip Mandelus. I'm certain you will sing a very different song in 5 years time.

 

You sound a bit like some of these self proclaimed yankee experts on this forum, who, for some reason, think they know just about everything about Europe, when in reality the concept of different European countries using different health care systems seems to be too demanding.
Anyway, I live in Germany and I'm not happy with the current situation. In my opinion, the country really needs a clear immigration act to handle this situation.
Right now, pretty much anybody can come, apply for asylum and then authorities check each case individually. Very time consuming and not effective, imo.
There's definitely room for improvement.
However, who says there are masses of uneducated migrants? How do you know they are all uneducated and will be on welfare for the rest of their lives?
1. There are numerous studies that clearly show that non-Germans (including migrants), in the long run, pay more money into the social security system than getting money from it. You know what sucked the money out of the German welfare system? Helmut Kohl's dream of a unified Germany. Even millions of more migrants won't be as expensive as that.
2. The idiotic thing is, people who have just arrived in Germany are not allowed to work. Many want to work and local business owners and companies would like to hire migrants, but they are not allowed to.
3. Lack of language skills? Absolutely. Somebody from Syria doesn't usually speak German - no surprise. Many official institutions, associations, and organisations demand a focus on language learning and I'm under the impression that politicians have started to listen.
4. We have to distinguish between refugees and migrants. Refugees from war zones are accepted to stay. Migrants from non war zones are alllowed to enter the country and apply for asylum, but more than 95% of them are not accepted and sent back. Roughly 40% of those coming to Germany at the moment are from non war zones, mostly the Balkans. Official EU number from May '15. Almost 4,000 from Kosovo came, 4 were allowed to stay.

As I said, I don't like the situation and I really think this needs to stop, but it never hurts to look a bit more carefully and pay attention to details.

 

They also supported Saddam, Gaddafi with money, arms ect .....until they didnt. Its pretty bloody obvious thats the case. A people's movement all of a sudden became so well armed they could overthrow countries with full US/West support? No, support switched under the threat of continued terrorist attacks, thats why in Libya they created a central bank almost straight away lol. Btw Obama was wining and dining the Muslim Brotherhood just before they rose to power, took the military reversing that which now comes under attack from the Arab Spring ISIS.

 

Please watch the following and then please explain to me how your proposals help anything?

[video=youtube;LPjzfGChGlE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LPjzfGChGlE[/video]

85m new born into poverty every year - how many are you going to take? If you take ones you claim add to first world economies, how does that improve the situation for those in the their homelands?



Oh and i highly doubt those stats on welfare/wages - in Australia stats show something like 80% of refugees rely on welfare. Here ill even supply links: A world of long-term welfare for refugees.

And one from Denmark, Report: Western immigrants create profit while non-Western cost society

 

Nobody actually expects Obama to bring in any Syrian Christians fleeing persecution from the Islamic state do they? Seriously, how many terrorists driving Humvees do you have to see before you let that dream die?

 

I believe this is an invasion crisis more than a "refugee" crisis. As I've stated several times in this forum, Europeans and Americans have had their share of civil and international wars, and more than their fair share of war refugees. Everyone in Europe after the world wars could have been considered refugees. The difference is there was no MSM filming the war frame-by-frame, and stirring up sympathy for the survivors of those wars. We managed, even after two world wars, to build a civilization that the Muslims covet and are vying to rule over. If someone told you that the pot of gold really is at the end of the rainbow, wouldn't you do anything to get to it? Europe is the pot of gold for these so-called war refugees.

 

I don't think you understood what I wrote. I said that Iraq didn't cause the Arab Spring.

 

Angela Merkel is importing millions of Muslims who will eventually rule over the German people; and she knows this. I think she is insane and needs to move to Saudi Arabia or some other anti-Christian Muslim country.

 

Overall Germany, now that Merkel has promised asylum to all the refugees escaping from Syrian war ... Germany will become New Syria soon.
[And Angela is depicted as an angelic mother on Arab newspapers!]. Take a look at this article on Bild [in German, of course],http://www.bild.de/politik/ausland/angela-merkel/wird-zur-heldin-der-syrer-42355280.bild.html, that picture is quite curious, isn't it?

The German sentence "Wir lieben dich" means "we love you" [it seems it's a way Syrian Arabs thank Frau Angela ...].

 

Not all Muslims support radical Islam and jihad, but there isn't one of them that wouldn't gladly rule over and enslave a country full of Christians (practicing or not), force them to pay tribute, and worse--force them to convert to Islam. That is their goal. To pretend that they are just refugees fleeing from the chaos in their own countries is naïve. Look at pictures of how most of these refugees live--mud huts with no running water, electricity, sewer, etc. If you spent your life in a mud hut and someone offered you a free apartment with running water, electricity, sewers, free cell phones, computers, internet, free victimization bragging rights, free education, free medical--all the things you did not have in your countries (not by the West's fault, but by their own) wouldn't you risk everything ? This 'refugee' crisis is an invasion crisis and nothing more. They want what we have and they will displace us as soon as they can. Then our countries can look like theirs. Someone needs to tell them it is not the geography that makes a great civilization but the people who built that civilization.

 

About the reasons of this humanitarian tragedy, the immediate cause is evidently the ongoing war in Syria. So we should wonder which are the causes of the war ...

The war in Syria was already there when ISIS appeared in Syria, in fact it joined the party of the Syrian civil war in 2012 against Assad.

Then we have to understand the causes of the Syrian civil war ... [ISIS is substantially irrelevant, may be it has accelerated the events, but also without ISIS we would have reached a wide humanitarian crisis as well].

The Syrian civil war can be considered a consequence of the Arab Spring and of the refusal by Assad to accept the change. So that we can say that this humanitarian crisis is due to the resistance of the dictatorial regime of Assad. The movements, guerrillas and similar who stay on the other side are simply actors of the tragedy.

 

So you think the release of the program in 2006 was fake, but the release of the program in 2013 is real? I'm not sure what your point is. Just because something is in the papers doesn't make it real, but you are arguing that it's real because...you read it in the papers. Unless of course you don't believe there was ever such a surveillance program? Tin foil hat time...

So you say that just because something was in the papers doesn't mean it's true unless it's a point you want to make? Heh...

I am thinking objectively on this. Someone has to. This forum is filled with ideologically blinded nincompoops. I'm trying to bring the light of sweet reason to the masses, but I admit it's an uphill push.

 

The problem with that is that people are fleeing the Ukraine for Russia because they want to either be Russian or want Russian protection, so it seems those refugees are exactly where they should be.

 

The majority of people would agree that your view is the view of the ignorant minority. Anyone informed knows that the whole immigration crisis started in Libya when US/UK/NATO and Gulf states overthrew the legitimate Libyan government and completely destroyed the country. The terror spread across North Africa, Sunni terrorists got hold of Gaddafi arms and the US helped them ship considerable amount of weapons to Syria via Turkey. Assad did only what any decent man would try to do - try protect his own people and country from the hordes of invading Sunni radical Muslims. Syria under Assad as Libya under Gaddafi were much better and safer countries than they are today. Secular and stable. But hey, the U.S/UK foreign policy makers decided to ally with Sunni radical movements in order to achieve their own geostrategic goals and a as a result of their failed policies we now have to deal with millions of Sunni Muslim refugees heading towards Europe.

 

What utter nonsense:


As is all the nonsense about 'invasions' and Muslims all being 'terrorist supporters' and wanting to 'rule the world'.

Nothing more than ignorant bigotry.

These are human beings fleeing from a war that has destroyed their homes and lives - caught between two powerful, oppressive and well-armed forces that they have no hope of resisting. Human beings who need help, just like other refugees from war through the ages.

There were those who said we shouldn't help the Jews fleeing from Germany in the 1930s. They were wrong, and the same kind of views are equally wrong now. 70 years after what happened then, the UK and USA have most certainly now lost the moral high ground to Germany, and there's no excuse for it.

 

Enjoy what you and your Islam have sown, I will support doing something when you replace "Bush" with "Obama" and convince the Democrats to impeach him and prosecute and imprison him and Clinton for their violation of oath of office:

 

When millions of people that "hate" us are at our doorstep complaining that our meddling is what brought them to us; complaining that it is our fault that they are thronging to our countries and changing the fabric of European civilization ( and soon America), we definitely need to focus on it. If a people hate you and then comes to your country then they are not refugees, but invaders; and only a suicidal maniac, or a traitor would open his door to an invader. Israel is getting ready to stem the tide of Syrian refugees headed for the Golan Heights, seemingly greatly focused on it. Why should we not also fret about it.

 

This is Homs again - a city that used to be home to three quarters of a million people.


That's just one city.

10 million people have lost their homes and been displaced. 10 million ordinary people - families, children, ordinary people like you or me. Some are still within Syria, but millions are in other countries in the region, some in huge camps like this:


That camp became the 4th largest city in Jordan. One sixth of the population of Lebanon are now refugees from Syria.

A small percentage are trying to get to Europe, and Europe, along with the USA, has both a moral and a legal (under international law) obligation to help such people. It would be inhuman not to.

- - - Updated - - -

The hate is coming from one side only, and it's not coming from the refugees who just want to have a place for them and their families to live in safety, away from the war that has taken their homes, and worse.

 

Sorry, but this really nonsense what you write! With Saddam the USA was never ever so closed in friendship as with Mubarak. They only respected Saddam and backed him politcal because he was in war with Iran. Since Kuwait this eas over and ask yourself why Saddam's Army and Air Force was nearly only with USSR weapons equipped!
In case of Ghadaffi it was Sarkozy and so France who went in first, NOT the USA. They came later with Hillary Clinton in advance AFTER the French were still in! The Arab Spring in Egypt was first and unarmed ... and USA were unhappy abozt or why do you think did the Egyptian Army went in after it was clear that Mubarak couldn't be hold in power? This was forcrd by the USA to do to hinder the islam extremists to get power!
Rebels in Lybia were on the first bad armed until parts of Lybian Army changed side an France in front supportet them with weapons .... France and NOT the USA!
Finally ... ISIS still existed far before Arab Spring broke out, so don't mix apples with bananas here. They went later in and yes, they got some support fron US becauae US abd others were so stupid to support everyone who fights against Assad ib Syria.

 

If Europe wants to survive, her only option is to refuse entry to these so-called refugees.

 

How about Saudi Arabia, Qatar, UAE start spending more money on accommodating all those refugees instead of wasting their money on U.S weapons and Sunni radical mercenaries. Why would I pay a single penny for people who will never integrate into the western society? Before you know it they will demand new mosques. Building a mosque takes priority over everything. You are welcome to have them in Wales.

 

Well, paybacks are hell. Perhaps the Muslims in the ME are getting what they deserve after enslaving half of Europe during the time of the Ottoman Empire. They also enslaved blacks, but don't tell them that. It's just easier to blame the West for every thing.

 

Of course they should. Since when did two wrongs make a right? Just because they should take refugees doesn't mean that we shouldn't.

Oh, I don't know....humanity? Decency? Morality? International law?

As for 'integration', of course they do - they just want to live their lives in a safe and secure place, and bring up their families in a society where they are being treated decently. They don't have to abandon their own past, culture, religion, etc. utterly to do that, though. People don't have to all be the same in order to live happily together in an 'integrated' society.

Thank you. We will.

I have no more objection to mosques than I have to churches, synagogues, chapels, etc.. Why would I? Let people worship how they want, in the building of their choice - it's no skin off my nose.

 

That picture is very telling. No wonder they want to come to the Western world. Their free apartments with running water, etc ( courtesy of Westerners) beats these huts any day. I say too bad. If their own kind treats them with such indifference why should we molly coddle them? They need to stay close to home. When the war ends, they will have lots of cleaning and rebuilding to do.