Trump clarifies 'Sweden' remark, says he was referring to Fox News report

i wouldn't say it is an ugly government. They don't have a litigious legal environment, so instead of civil suits they use criminal law. So instead of slander or libel you get a law that prohibits people saying stuff. Perhaps OK for a country of 5 mln or so ethnically homogeneous people, but it looks like perhaps it has gone its course with demographic growth and change. They honestly mean well.

But its weird how evil people can be when they are trying to be nice.

I don't know how liberals got so turned around to supporting illiberal ideals. If it was intentional by some evil party then it was genius, but I suspect it's just the folly of group-think.

(Mr Carson must be very happy with all the free publicity!)

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That's not correct, in respect to this issue he issued a clarification.

 

He issued a rationalization...a pretense at a clarification.

Under any circumstances...he either made a huge mistake...or he made a huge mistake.

If he doesn't know how to express himself with greater clarity...perhaps he ought let one of the puppets do the talking and just keep quiet himself. It was, after all, a "campaign" speech he was making.

 

Nyar, I wouldn't call it a huge mistake.

The correction was too perfect to be an after-the-fact rationalization: it connected to an actual show (i.e. is more independently verifiable than the erroneous statement) and made more sense in context than the erroneous statement. That very rarely happens, and never with so much speed.

The Democrats definitely seem to find the more elocutive presidential candidates. Trump's puppets are a pretty poor show as well, so looks like we'll probably be doing this dance a lot for the next few years.

 

You have a point. The Swedish journalist came across has very "nice" while excusing her government for prosecuting speech codes. She pointed out that violators do not actually go to jail. She also challenged the soaring rape stats pointing out that their rape laws now cover assaults other than "rape".

She look very nice, but the image of Sweden she projected seemed rather ugly to me. But compared to most authoritarian states Sweden could be described as "nice".

Tucker Carlson's popularity may be rising even faster than the popularity of rape, or whatever passes for rape, in Sweden. He has to love all the publicity.

 

Yes, when all is said and done, "prison" in Sweden is probably quite pleasant.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/comment/...ers-like-human-beings-not-like-criminals.html

"put her in.....the Comfy Chair!"

 

Where do else do Presidents and Congressmen and Cabinet members and LOTS of people in government get their NEWS? There is not government NEWS agency that has reporters and journalist all over the world doing stories. Guess what they actually have TV's in the White House. And it was a journalistic documentary about current events in Sweden, why do you try to marginalize that?

 

It's not even close to a 500% increase. Nevertheless...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rape_in_Sweden (my emphases)

For example, Sweden reformed its sex crime legislation and made the legal definition of rape much wider in 2005, which largely explains a significant increase in the number of reported rapes in the ten-year period of 2004-2013. The Swedish police also record each instance of sexual violence in every case separately, leading to an inflated number of cases compared to other countries.[9][12][16] Additionally, the Swedish police have improved the handling of rape cases, in an effort to increase the number of crimes reported. ​

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rape_in_Sweden (my emphases)

Unlike the majority of countries in Europe, crime data in Sweden are collected when the offence in question is first reported, at which point the classification may be unclear. In Sweden, once an act has been registered as rape, it retains this classification in the published crime statistics, even if later investigations indicate that no crime can be proven or if the offence must be given an alternative judicial classification.[12][29][30]
The total number of convictions for rape and aggrevated rape in Sweden 2015 was 176. The total number of convictions for sexual offences, which includes rape but also less severe crimes such as buying sexual services, was 1160.
Sweden also applies a system of expansive offence counts. Other countries may employ more restrictive methods of counting. The Swedish police registers one offence for each person raped, and if one and the same person has been raped on a number of occasions, one offence is counted for each occasion that can be specified. For example, if a woman says she has been raped by her husband every day during a month, the Swedish police may record more than 30 cases of rape. In many other countries only a single offence would be counted in such a situation.​

 

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/pol...trump-call-filmmaker-madman-article-1.2977840 (emphases mine)

On Monday, two Swedish police officers interviewed for the film lambasted its American producer, Ami Horowitz, for supposedly taking their quotes "completely" out of context.

"I don't understand why we are a part of the segment. The interview was about something completely different to what Fox News and Horowitz were talking about," one of the cops, Anders Göranzon, told Dagens Nyheter.

Trump suggests Sweden troubled by refugees after Fox News report
Göranzon and his colleague, Jacob Ekström, told the Swedish newspaper that Horowitz asked them general questions about crime in Sweden. What Horowitz didn't ask, however, was whether they believed the rising crime rates had anything to do with immigration.

"It shocked us. He has edited the answers," Göranzon charged. "We were answering completely different questions in the interview. This is bad journalism."

Göranzon claimed Horowitz has eroded his trust in reporters.

"It feels like hell," the cop said. "The real questions should be shown along with our answers.​

It wouldn't be the first time that a film maker edited an interview to produce the effect he wanted. Would that come under the category of Fake News?



Also, please show that they "were sent to the Ministry Truth". Also, please show what you mean by "Ministry Truth".

 

Please provide your alternative estimate.

OK. There are contributory factors but the professional view is that they do not account for the entirety of the increase. The fact is the rise is so extraordinary that any effect from immigration is drowned out. Incidentally, this corresponds to press observations that immigrants were increasingly prevalent as suspects. Then, magically, the data on ethnicity stops being collected.

Of the suspects in the 1990s was 10 per cent are not registered in Sweden and 32 percent foreign born. Of the remaining 58 percent of Swedes had a quarter of immigrant background, which according to the National Council suggests an over-representation of immigrants. In the gang rape of three or more perpetrators are foreign born even higher: 39 percent
http://fof.se/tidning/2013/10/artikel/dramatisk-okning-av-antalet-anmalda-gruppvaldtakter


So when data was collected, 10+ 32 foreigners + (0.25 x 58 =) 14 first generation from foreign immigrants = 56% of rape suspects were immigrants or first gen descendants.

Anyway this was interesting from that website: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2017_Uppsala_rape_Facebook_live_streaming_incident#cite_note-1
2017 Uppsala rape Facebook live streaming incident. I hadn't heard of this event but that's pretty awful, and hardly going to enamour the populace to refugees.

I have a feeling that the dam is going to break on this issue. Cover your shorts.

 

Where else? Seriously? Don't you realize that even the lowliest member of the House has a staff? (From Wikipedia) In 2000, every Representative hired 14 staff members, while the average Senator hired 34.

The President watched a news clip, made an incorrect assumption about what he saw and made a completely false statement to the American people and the World.

He didn't take the time to verify his assumption with his staff before publicly proclaiming it.

Apparently you're OK with that.

 

Look, he was trying to convey the imminent threat of muslim immigrants. You'd hope he would have something more substantive than an opinion segment on fox news. It was weak and poorly executed. It's blatant fear mongering and a pathetic pandering to the dumbest of his knuckle dragging base. The only question I have is why he gave the "speech" in the first place. The election just ended.

 

Sweden has coercive speech codes. Surely you know that. The cops obviously told the ugly truth about the decline of Sweden in the film.

The Ministry of Truth taught them how to Double Think to protect their careers. That is how speech codes work - they cover up the politically incorrect truth.

 

Do you have proof of that or did you just pull it out of your tinfoil cap?

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Do you have proof of that or did you just pull it out of your tinfoil cap?

 

Trump's mind is all twisted:








Not surprisingly, forum right wingers still defend him.

 

Trump Derangement Syndrome. ^^

https://www.pri.org/stories/2017-01...s-calls-trump-administration-stand-all-russia

 

^^#AlternativeFacts

 

Funny how Gates was a hero to right wingers for many decades.

Now that he speaks the truth about Trump, he is attacked.

 

Who is attacking Mr. Gates ??

 

It's not a secret Tom, do yourself a favor and Google before you resort to shallow ad hominem nonsense.

 

Ahh, so it came from your tinfoil cap then...Got it.

 

I'm seeing more and more of this from the Trumpees.

They post Bull$hit. When asked where they got their Bull$hit or to provide evidence for their Bull$hit, they say "You look it up". It really exposes their complete lack of integrity.

 

Lol. Well said, tom!

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Why don't you address his actual reply instead of furthering Chump's hysteria?

 

One can learn from the European experience including Sweden or ignore it and repeat history. Trump has done the learning and has placed the welfare of US citizens above those of non citizens. That is intellectual integrity.

 

Because he provided zero evidence. For you I'm sure that's enough but for those of us interested in actual facts not emotion it isn't.

 

I am not a "Trumpee", but Sweden does have a peculiarly restrictive hate speech setup.
The Swedish penal code is structured in an extremely straight-forward fashion, and this may be a result of that:
http://www.government.se/contentassets/5315d27076c942019828d6c36521696e/swedish-penal-code.pdf

Chapter 16
Section 8
A person who, in a disseminated statement or communication,
threatens or expresses contempt for a national, ethnic or other such
group of persons with allusion to race, colour, national or ethnic
origin or religious belief shall, be sentenced for agitation against a
national or ethnic group to imprisonment for at most two years or,
if the crime is petty, to a fine. (Law 1988:835)

You will note that there is no defence, not even truth, not even for open debate, not for press freedom or governmental work.

This has lead to an atmosphere of fear not unlike what was uncovered in Rotherham and Cologne. From 2016:

As Peter Ågren, police chief in central Stockholm, put it: ‘Sometimes we do not dare to say how things really are because we believe it will play into the hands of the Sweden Democrats.’ As we now know, police officers in Stockholm are instructed not to reveal the ethnicity or nationality of any suspects lest they be accused of racism.
http://www.spectator.co.uk/2016/01/...ks-by-migrant-men-swedens-record-is-shameful/

Choose your battles carefully