What To Do About The Long-Term Implications of Automation

We do that now and its a diaster

Millions of able bodied Americans on welfare doing nothing while ill3gal aliens sneak into the country to do the work

To me that makes no sense

 

So you want basic cars like a Ford escort to cost $200,000 each? Cell phones $10 grand same with computers? A big Mac $59 bucks?


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What would you think everything would cost with out automation and robotics? ( i just made up those numbers) and heck we would need every illegal we could get, we would have to kidnap them ...

Btw, I have been in manufacturing for over 30 years.


Edit: my first computer was $6,000, my first CD player $400, my first VCR $600

 

Good idea!! Fund a WPA-type program to build and update infrastructure, to convert everything we can to alternative power, build high-speed rail, etc. and watch the recover take off. Studies show that for each dollar spent on unemployment, $1.60 of value is created due to spending of that dollar. How much better would such a WPA program be? Plenty better no doubt.

But when it's done, then what?

We will have to phase-in a cut in work hours while paying the same wage.

 

We've watched automation grow ever since some guy used an ox to help plow a field.

There just isn't any place to stop this. Nor should we want to.

 

There it is, right there.

 

Yeah, and anyway, can't stop it, it's a train, we're on the tracks, and it's not all bad, ... at all. The issue is this economic system will not work as this techno world evolves, it's from an economic era to be left behind like feudalism, and for pretty much the same reasons. If there are no adjustments in the economic system it will be feudalism, for some it already is. It's a closed biological system we exist in, unless you're going to be on Newt's moon colony. Nothing expands to infinity but entropy, and this economic system is predicated upon growth to infinity.

 

We need your phase 3 today.

We're seeing the result of having too many unprepared for the rate of change as it is.

In fact, it was a serious issue during the last presidential campaign.

Let's remember that manufacturing production was fully recovered within a couple years of the 2008 crash. Yet, manufacturing employment has not yet recovered.

 

Having had the opportunity to do some traveling since we last discussed this topic I have encountered something that I believe might throw some light on the subject.

It is worth noting that there have been "brain drains" in the past for a variety of reasons and they usually because of better opportunities in other regions for those with skills that can no longer find the appropriate skilled work in the region where they are. America has been a beneficiary of these in that it has had a "brain gain" from what happened prior to WW2 in Europe as an example.

Up until this point we have been primarily focused on job losses among jobs that can be easily automated but what happened with the internet was that it became possible to outsource white collar jobs. Accounting, programming, medical record keeping and the like were jobs that could be done by equally skilled people for lower wages in other nations. This meant that there are fewer of these jobs available here in the USA and so some people are actively looking overseas for jobs now.

https://www.inc.com/paul-grossinger/will-we-see-a-devastating-brain-drain-hit-the-us.html

https://venturebeat.com/2017/02/24/the-trump-effect-the-u-s-is-heading-for-a-tech-brain-drain/

In essence someone with skills in technology could leave America and find a job that provides a better living standard than they have here without the same likelihood of being laid off.

In my travels I encountered young people in Africa who were traveling to Europe to find work and gain experience before returning to take higher level positions. Articles that I have read indicate that this is happening in India and probably other nations too.

What does the above have to do with the long term implications of automation here in America? I suspect that we are already experiencing it in the form of an exodus of technology expertise. Those who can are taking opportunities elsewhere in the world. That is not a good prognosis for innovation here although I suspect that this nation is quite resilient and will adapt in the long term. For Americans lower on the skill set ladder the cost of living here in the USA might be such that it becomes more affordable for them to live in other places that are less expensive.

We are about to live through some interesting times and I believe that there could well be a shift in focus from having a rising standard of living to just being able to maintain an existing standard of living. The signs are there that Millennials are not interested in purchasing cars and houses in the same way that their parents did. That makes them far more flexible when it comes to being able to move elsewhere if the need to find work arises and the opportunity is outside of our borders. With the internet the ability to remain in touch with friends and family is no longer a barrier to emigration.

As America automates some Americans will disperse to other parts of the world IMO. Just thought that you might be interested in this perspective.

 

faith that god will solve for automation, the earthly solutions are sinful

you must labor an honest days work for an honest days pay, which means living wages for menial work.

welfare is the sin of laziness, and education is the sin of debt by jews. middle ground could be reached by free education, but paying too many taxes to ceasar is a sin too.

this divine solution may be rational as progress in society is open to interpretation, and robots would be more of a luxury than a necessity for civilians. military robots are the essential uses.

 

i respectfully disagree, free market capitalism can solve for everything.

when robots create supply, humans will create demand for other things. for example hollywood cannot be replaced by robots in the near future.

the technology required for robots to show emotions and be life like is still generations away. when that day comes generous welfare will be redistributed to the peasants so everyone can afford to experience consensual robotic relations.

 

I’m saying that able bodied adults on welfare should be working and providing for themselves instead

We do not need a new WPA.

There are plenty of jobs in the private sector being filled by illeal aliens that American could and should be doing

Enforce our immigration laws by deporting illegal aliens while at the same time remove people from welfare who should be working

 

I think your ideas make sense. We are however going to see the basic conflict between what works for the population as a whole and unbridled capitalism become more and more intense.

 

. Look at the increasing prevalence of animated films. We are almost at the point where there is no need for real actors. In five years you will be unable to tell the difference between real and animated humans. You aleady can't with animals and babies.

Just as an exercise try to actually come up with a profession that cannot be automated. About the only ones I can think of are plumbers and electricians and others who do home repairs.

 

So, we turn into a nation of actors? Doubtful.

When we moved from agriculture to industry and mass consumption, we knew where agri workers were going. We have no clue where the masses of service sector and factory workers are going. We can only wait with hope that some new sector will be created that AI and robots cannot do. Yet we have no idea what that will be. So we say, oh, the free market will solve even this problem. I do not believe it.

 

The only remaining problem, and it is a major one and reflected in Willreadmore's post, begins with Phase 2. The problem is that whereas you have laid it all out very well for the benefit of the people and society, there is absolutely no way in hell that the powerful who currently hold the reins of power and wealth will allow it. They will channel the whole situation to serve their greed for wealth and power. Work hours will not be reduced while paying the same weekly and annual wage. Rather, they will create unemployment and will take all the gains they can for themselves. All things will be brought into the service of wealth accumulation. We will continue to see the economy slide toward world domination, one world government, and monopoly because capitalism must grow to survive.

To bring any of this very logical plan into effect, we will have to have a new economic system not based on private ownership for private profit. That will prove to be the first priority.

 

You haven't yet come to terms with our history of an economy that was much, much closer to "free market capitalism" in the early 1900s and the inhumane working and living conditions thrust upon the people by the Robber Barons. It was so bad that there were two socialist parties and a communist party threatening violent revolution, and that threat produced an "FDR" and his New Deal to appease the people and save capitalism.

 

What percentage of the population do they represent?