Why is the existence of God not obvious?

Little late to the party, eh?

 

Einstein says that it is impossible for God to exist. He also says it is impossible for him NOT to exist. Maybe his existence is just a matter of the definition you're trying to pin on him, or of looking in the wrong places. Maybe God is the ultimate quantum mechanic. From what I hear, it's possible for particles to exist and not exist at the same time. Or to be at two places at one time.

 

While I am certain God exists, I am uncertain about God's qualities regardless of what I have been told about Him. I believe God made the Universe so it would eventually have sentient life- that that's why He made the Big Bang.

And while God can be everywhere at once, I doubt He is here as an invisible hand guiding us in life. Instead, He gave us free will and the ability to make our own choices.

As such, God wants you to live a moral, ethical life and come up with this conclusion on your own.

 

Are you comparing giving her the choice of religion to robbing a bank??

I find it insulting that you would assume that I am a bad parent because I want to let my child choose her own religion instead of TELLING her what to believe.

I can assure you her moral values are well in check. She is in 3rd grade and I have yet to have a single teacher say anything bad about her. My youngest is going to be a bit more of a trouble maker, but it wont be because I didnt force religion down her throat I can assure you lol.

Your post was insulting to be perfectly honest.

 

That's the whole point of a strawman. To compare something perfectly rational with something totally irrational and to try and make your whole argument look irrational because of the comparison.

We all know allowing your children to choose their own religious beliefs is a perfectly legal, acceptable and a rational thing to do.

And we all know allowing and even aiding your children in robbing a bank is a totally illegal, unacceptable and irrational thing to do. Yet the comparison was made to undermine your argument.

Fortunately most of us here are smart enough to see that those two things have nothing to do with one another.

 

Not at all. I am observing the absoluteness of your former statement "If my children ever decide they want to go to church I will take them because it is what THEY want. " Now do you get the point. Robbing a bank is irrelevant to the matter of you allowing them to do what they 'want to'.

I find it interesting that you will allow your children to do what they "want to".

What real 'assurance' can you offer to any one regarding your children when you have already admitted that they are allowed to do what they "want to"?

Your post was perfectly revealing in regards to how you are conditioning your children. BTW: After having raised 2 boys and 2 girls and having assisted in raising 8 grandchildren, I can assure you, that by the time they reach the age of 15 you will be seeing a side of their personalities that you thought would never be possible. Good or bad. Just wait... the fun has only just begun.

 

People should not put in writing things that are ambiguous and capricious. Doing so, allows various interpretations to be rendered.

 

When you build up another argument based on someone else's argument and attack that one because it's easier to tear down than the original argument you are in fact making a strawman. Was that simplified explanation easier to understand? Or did you have a different interpretation on the fallacy you chose to make?

 

Now you're just ignoring the context of his statement and claiming that he is somehow saying he allows his children to do whatever they please. In context he is saying he'd allow his children to choose whatever religion they want to follow/study/believe. But you just want to take it a step further to make him seem like he let's them do anything they please willy nilly even if it's illegal! Ridiculous.

There is obviously nothing wrong with allowing your children to make their own choices in life, within reason. Especially allowing them to choose their own religion.

Do you believe that allowing your child to follow their own spiritual path in life and study various religions and choose the one they most prefer is not a good thing to allow them do? Is that what you have a problem with?

 

The existence of God is obvious and at the same time unprovable. Much like your own conscience. It is perfectly alright to ignore God. Live your life.

 

The existence of those who believe and want to believe in a God is obvious.

However there is no proof or way of proving the actual existence of a God.

 

We must explain that if there is a god, why does he/she never intervene to stop all this suffering on Earth?

1. There is no god, therefore God does not exist.

2. God exists, but doesn't care, and never intervenes.

3. God is evil, and initiates suffering on Earth, and the rest of the universe.

4. God exists, and cares, but life on Earth is a test/lesson.

5. God existed, created the universe, but is now dead.



I choose to believe that there is no god. Furthermore, if there is in fact a god, I will reject him/her due to the fact that he/she has allowed so much countless suffering, and destruction. I simply cannot accept the notion that life on earth is a test/lesson, as the excuse for why this god would allow suffering to continue. More to the point, I'll never worship/idolize anyone, or anything. Humans as a whole will never advance; so long they believe they are nothing more than some supreme being's puppet. Also, if there is a god (he/she has failed us) and we should kill him/her.

There is only the universe, and all its relativity. All elements within the universe are intertwined. That means we (our bodies, and mind), along with the rest of this universe are one. There is no separation, and there is nothing different, nor will there ever be.

People can continue to believe what they want, but the bottom line is, always was, always is – we are all one. To deny relativity, and oneness, is to deny logic. It is all meaningless, really.

 

Suffering and destruction are part of reality, to deny them is to live in a false reality. To accept the whole of reality we must include the good with the bad. If this makes ones life meaningless or if it makes reality unjust or cruel then it makes perfect sense to disbelieve in or hate God or creation. If you could create your own reality what would it be like? Would it include parts of the reality you live in? The things we call beautiful only exist because of the reality we live in and have been created as much through suffering and pain as they have been from pleasure and joy. To cut out the part of reality you hate can only destroy the part you love.

 

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I understand, and accept the notion of reality, that without misery, we would never experience joy. I'm perfectly fine with death, and the end of one's life cycle. However, it's not how we die, or how long we live, but how well we lived.

However, in this world, and especially in modern times, the misery on this Earth far outweighs whatever joy is left.

Now, if we went back a couple of thousand years ago, life was more natural, and there was more freedom for all (humans, animals, insects, etc.) inhabitants of the Earth, the planet was healthy. Today, the world has been polluted, raped, and ultimately destroyed by Humanity's society. Society is using up all the resources, polluting the air and water, ripping up the ozone layer, destroying whatever landscape is life, and murders, tortures, and enslaves more humans, and animals than ever. To top it all off, the condition of Earth will only get worse, and humans will ultimately kill everything along with themselves. Where's this almighty great god, when you need him/her the most? No-where! What sickens me about the delusional religious folk, is that they keep waiting for some supreme being to intervene, when logically they should look deep inside, and fix this mess, rather than passing the buck.

 

Well as badly as you twisted my words around in here, I can assure you that you never won any parent of the year awards.

I said I would let my kids do what they want when it comes to RELIGIOUS CHOICE. That doesnt mean I let them do whatever they want in other things. Chores have to be done on a daily basis, homework has to be done before you can go play.

Do you advocate NOT letting kids choose their religion? Do you think we should force religion down a childs throat? Do you think YOU should choose your childs religion??

If you did that with your kids, you never gave them a chance to analyze and think. They probably follow orders really well, but they probably dont come up with too much on their own.

 

To stop pain and suffering would make everyone happy, Not destroy love. God is just a crutch for weak people that need someone to tell them what to do. I don't hate god he just don't exist.

 

Perhaps you need a God helmet to help you find God.

 

---You sound a lot like me.

---Through my own experiences, trials and errors I am currently at the conclusion that I have focused too much on the externalization of God. I have always looked everywhere to find traces of divinity, searching tirelessly for clues as to its nature or even its existence. My efforts seemed to always follow the same pattern: I would search, find something I thought had merit, indulge in the novelty of its newness and hold it aloft as the epiphany I had been looking for. Then, after some time its glory faded and the dullness of acclimation set in. Soon that void opened again and I was off in search of "it", because clearly I hadn't found "it" yet.

---Then one day I thought to myself, "Why am I looking out there, instead of in here?". I turned my eye inward and began sifting for traces and clues for the existence of some divine spark. I took inventory of my flaws, my vices and habits as well as my virtues. To my horror I found that looking inward revealed less evidence about God than I had found looking outward. I had spent so much time denying my own goodness that I did not bother to cultivate it. I had projected all of my worthy attributes onto the concept of an external deity and then sought to find him in order to somehow restore them to me.

---I think when you get down to the principle the whole thing is far simpler than the details suggest. If you earnestly want God in your life then do good and infect your world with goodness. Once you have infected those around you with your divine spark some will see the light. Among those that share in this with you, will be what you have been looking for.

---That is my ideal. Science is another thing altogether.

 

Threads like these just further segregate individuals of the human race.
Sad.

It is always religious extremist or arrogant atheist.
Learn to be an apatheist.