WWII - Eastern Front - General Remer

What claim did Germans have to Warsaw, Poland as they killed about 200,000 Polish people during the Warsaw Uprising?

 

I have no idea why they did that, IF they even did it, would have to google.
But tell me how many Germans did the Poles torture and kill before the Germans took measures to stop those atrocities? Why on earth did you hate the Germans so much? What had they done to you?

Here is a nice article that describes the whole bloody situation of how the war started:

The Unknown History of the 1939 German-Polish Conflict

Excerpt:
When war finally came, the Germans in Polish territory suffered terribly. They had to bear the unspeakable hate of the Poles. Some 35,000 of them(German authorities then claimed 58,000 murdered Germans!) were murdered, often under the most bestial circumstances. Dr. Kurt Lück (op.cit.) writes on page 271: "Poles had thrown dead dogs into many of the graves of murdered ethnic Germans. Near Neustadt in West Prussia, the Poles slashed open the belly of a captured German officer, tore out his intestines and stuffed a dead dog inside. This report is reliably documented."15 And a German mother grieves for her sons. She writes on October 12th, 1939: "Oh, but that our dear boys [her sons] had to die such terrible deaths. 12 people were lying in the ditch, and all of them had been cruelly beaten to death. Eyes gouged out, skulls smashed, heads split open, teeth knocked out... little Karl had a hole in his head, probably from a stabbing implement. Little Paul had the flesh torn off his arms, and all this while they were still alive. Now they rest in a mass grave of more than 40, free at last of their terror and pain. They have peace now, but I never shall..."16 And between 1919 and 1921 400,000 ethnic Germans fled their homes and crossed the German border in order to save their lives.

I personally once knew a German who told me that after serving in the German army he was drafted into the Polish army after 1945, and that the Poles destroyed German cemeteries and looted the graves in order to get at the golden wedding bands the corpses were still wearing.

What can one say of the hate that speaks from the pages of one of the more popular papers, the largest Polish newspaper Ilustrowany Kurjer Codzienny, which appeared on April 20th, 1929, in Cracow? "Away with the Germans behind their natural border! Let's get rid of them behind the Oder!" "Silesian Oppeln is Polish to the core; just as all of Silesia and all of Pomerania were Polish before the German onslaught!"17

"To absorb all of East Prussia into Poland and to extend our western borders to the Oder and Neisse rivers, that is our goal. It is within reach, and at this moment it is the Polish people's great mission. Our war against Germany will make the world pause in amazement."18

"There will be no peace in Europe until all Polish lands shall have been restored completely to Poland, until the name Prussia, being that of a people long since gone, shall have been wiped from the map of Europe, and until the Germans have moved their capital Berlin farther westwards."19

On October 1923, Stanislaus Grabski, who later was to become Minister of Public Worship and Instruction, announced: "We want to base our relations on love, but there is one kind of love for one's own people and another kind for strangers. Their percentage is decidedly too high here. Posen [which had been given to Poland after the First World War] can show us one way to reduce that percentage from 14% or even 20% to 1½%. The foreign element will have to see if it would not be better off elsewhere. The Polish land is exclusively for the Poles!"20

"(The Germans in Poland) are intelligent enough to realize that in the event of war no enemy on Polish soil will get away alive... The Führer is far away, but the Polish soldiers are close, and in the woods there is no shortage of branches."21

and so on, nothing but hate for the German dogs!!
WHY?

http://www.wintersonnenwende.com/scriptorium/english/archives/articles/wrsynopsis.html

 

There was indeed a Bromberg Massacre, but it happened AFTER WW2 had started, which was instigated by traitorous Germans living there who tried to sabotage the Polish war efforts, in which 300, or so Germans were killed.

Poland wasn't even prepared for war, how could they kill 58,000 people?

This is truly ridiculous.

 

Poznan never stopped being majority Polish, it was once the capital of Poland, and it's where modern Poland's founder Mieszko II was baptized.

 

Berlin was once inhabited by Lechite Polabians, who Lechite's are Polish tribes.

So, there is some Polish claims to Berlin.

Besides, the name Prussia comes from the Old Prussians a Baltic tribe, who had their land stolen by Germans, and their population decimated to extinction.,

 

October 12th huh?

Germans were killing Polish even earlier than that in Operation Tannenberg.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Tannenberg

 

Ridiculous or not, I'm no authority on that, I have to search everything on the net.
I wonder, though, why would you antagonize the Germans? Hitler made numerous attempts to negotiate with your country. WHY did you ignore that?
And not prepared is silly, when you had your army ready way before...
http://www.britishpathe.com/workspaces/BritishPathe/zSrSuPcW

 

Now, don't get picky. The German woman wrote on the 12th of October... it happened any time before that.

 

So, not giving into German demands some how justified the war?

 

No, it didn't and that's not what I am saying. But Poland could at least be civil and respond in a diplomatic way instead of antagonizing and violating German space.

Read here:

Heinz Splittgerber, in his short book Unkenntnis oder Infamie?, quotes a number of Polish sources which reflect the atmosphere in Poland immediately before the hostilities commenced.
On August 7th, 1939 the Ilustrowany Kurjer featured an article "which described with provocative effrontery how military units were continually foraying across the border into German territory in order to destroy military installations and to take weapons and tools of the German Wehrmacht back to Poland.
Most Polish diplomats and politicians understood that Poland's actions would perforce lead to war.
Foreign Minister Beck... tenaciously pursued the bloodthirsty plan of plunging Europe into another great war, since it would presumably result in territorial gains for Poland."
He goes on to cite some 14 incidents where Polish soldiers aggressively crossed the border, destroying houses, shooting and killing German farmers and customs officers. One of them: "August 29th: "State Police Offices in Elbing, Köslin and Breslau, Main Customs Office in Beuthen and Gleiwitz:
Polish soldiers invade Reich German territory, attack against German customs house, shots taken at German customs officials, Polish machine guns stationed on Reich German territory.".

And you think Germany or any other country should lie down and let itself be trampled on?
Enough was enough!

 

I hate to break it to you, but those incidents were all part of Operation Himmler. They were false flag ops designed to give Germany the pretext it needed to invade.

 

1...Now that you know about The Generalplan Ost .
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Generalplan_Ost

2...Hitler seized not only Sudetenland (with the Germans ) , Hitler seized the whole of Czechoslovakia (without the Germans ) .

How can you justify this seizure?

PS
excuse me.......what for I am forgiven?

 

Why don't you now take Berlin? Mrs. Merkel would gladly let you have it. Go for it while she is still in office!

Finally I figured out why the Poles hate the Germans so much.
Read here and you can find out, too:

World War I: Poland

Background

The Polish nation once the most powerful in eatern Europe. It was, however, one of the few states where the monarchy did not become the dominant political force, the other was England. In England the result was democracy. In Poland the result was national disaster. The nobels were able to prevent the monarchy from developing a striong nation state. Poor leadership, disorganization and military defeat weakened Poland (early-18th century. Important nobels often coopetrated with foreign powers in struggles with the monasrchy. As a result, the country completely disappeared as a result of the three Polish Partitions (1772-95) Austria, Prussia, and Russia partioned Poland. Russia obtained the major share and Warsaw. The Russian Empire under Tsar Alexander III set out to destroy Polish national identity and Russify the Poles. They received more liberal treatment in Prussia and Austria-Hungry. Despite efforts to supress Polish national identity, Polish nationalism was largely preserved by the nobility and the Church. The Polish peasantry was largely apolitical. As a result of the French Revolution and ensuing Napoleonivc Wars, Polish nationalism began to grow (early-19th century). Napoleon cionsidered reestablishing a Polish State. The Russians establishedd Congress Polsnd. Polish patriots staged a series uprisings (1830, 1844-46, 1848 and 1863). All failed and were crushed by Tsarist armies. Even so, the Poles continued to resist Secret societies plotted further uprisings.

Josef Pilsudski (1867-1935)

One of the great champions of Polish independence was Josef Pilsudski. He was born (1867) and as a teenager began underground resistance (late-1880s). He was arrested by the Tsarist police and imprioned in Siberia. . He managed to escape and reached Austrian-controlled Poland (Galicia). Austria-Hungary had more accompdating policies toward ethnic minorities tjhan the Russia. And because tensions between Austria and Russia were growing, the Austrians allowed Pilsudski to plpt against the Russians. Pilsudski was able to provide the Austrians information on Russian military deployment and fortifications in Poland. He was allowed to raise a small para-military force in Austria which he named the Society (or Riflemen) of TIR (190. Men were recruited primarily in Lwow and Krakow. The Society would become the core of the World War I Polish Legions.

Austria-Hungary was determined to punish Serbia for the assaination of Archduke Franz Ferdinand. When Austria-Hungary with German backing declared war on Serbia, Russia was committed to defend the Serbs--fellow Slavs. Kaiser Wilhelm and Tsar Nicholas exchanged telegrams, but ther personal relationship could not restrain the developing tragedy. The Tsar ordered a mobilization. France also began to mobilize its troops. Russia had the largest army in Europe and once moibilized posed a forbidable danger to Germany. Germany thus felt impelled to strike at France before Russia could mobilize. Germany declaring war on Russia (August 1) and France (August 3). The strike at France followed the Schlieffen Plan which meant invading Belgium. German armies crossed the Belgian birder (Aufudy 4). This brought Britain, which had treaty obligations to Belgium, into the War. Britain may have entered the War with out Germany invasion of Belgium, but the invasion provided both the causus bellum and popular support for war. Germany's decession to support Austria's desire to punish Serbia turned a Balkans crisis into a major European war. Germany probably would have prevailed in a war with France and Russia. The invasion of Belgium provided tactical advantages, but at the cost of brining Britain and the Empire with its immenense military and material resources into the War.

Polish Participation

Poland was an important battlefield in the first years of the War (1914-15). Although there was no Polish state, Poles participated in the the World War. Poles fought Poles as part of the armies of the three empires that had partioned the country. About 2.0 millions fought in the War. Poles were conscripted into the Russian Army. Poles were also conscripted into the German and Austrian Armies and fought with the Central Powers. As far as I know, the only Polish units organized were fielded by the Austrains who formned the Polish Legion. Nearly 0.5 million Poles were killed in the War.
Division

Polish nationalists were divided by the conflict. Many right-wing Poles led by Roman Dmowski's National Democrats promoted the Allied cause which on the Eastern Front meant the Russians. Dmowski thought that a grateful Russia might agree to autonomy for Poland, perhaps even independence in the future. Josef Pilsudski led the Polish Socialists. He also commanded the Polish Legion in the Austrian Army. He had no confidence in a Russian victory and thought that Russia might well be knocked out of the War. Austria which had gained Galicia in the Partitions had been the most willing to allow a measure of Polish autonomy. Thus he fought with the Austrians.

Fighting in the East

World War began in the west when the German Army stormed across the border of neutral Belgium. Russia honored its treaty with France and with forces assembled in POland invaded East Prussia. The Russians forced the Germans to deploy substantial forces inthe East, essentially dividing their forces in a two front War. (Coropral Adolf Hitler would later inist that he would never commit a similar mistake.) The massive Russian armies were stopped in their tracks, first with the disaster at Tannenberg (late- August 1914). It was a great victory for the Germans, but won at the cost of moving two corps from the Western Front to the Eastern. This was a major in the Miracle on the Marne (September 1914). Depleting the western forces contributed to opening a gaping hole in the German advance that the French were able to exploit. With the destruction of two Russian armies in East Prussia (1914), the war in the East became essentially a battle over Poland. Unlike World War II, almost all of the fighting on the Eastern Front during World War I was fought in Poland and the Baltics, at the time also part of the Russian Empire. Civilians suffered terribly. Relief efforts were inadequate are entirely unavailable. The Austrians launched the Battle of Galicia, but in the course of the fighting the Austro-Hungarian armies without German support were defeated and forced out of Galicia and the Russians captured Lemberg, The Russian advanced toward Kraków, but were finally beaten back by the Germans (late-1914). The Russian offensive caught the Austrians by surprise in an area unsupported by the Germans and achieved some initial success. The Russians had poor communications and logistical capabilities and were unable to exploit their initial success. They did, however, severely weaken the Austrian Army. The Germans launched a massive Spring offensive (1915). Heavy fighting occurred around Gorlice and Przemyśleast of Kraków in Galicia. The retreating Russian army emulated the scorched earth policy employed against Napoleon in 1812. Some 1 million Polish civilians fled east with the retreating Russian Army. Neither the Russians or the Germans were sure of the loyalties of the Eastern enthnic groups (Baltas, Jews, Poles, Ukranians, and others). Russian troops abandoing their positions looted the towns and villages they passed through. [Horne and Kramer] The Russians also evicted and deported huge numbers of people suspected of collaborating with the Germans Austrians. [Chickering and Förster] After very difficult fighting, the Germans finally enered Warsaw (late-1915). The Russian army assembled massive forces and launched an attack to resume the offensive. A large attack on the southwestern front. General Aleksey Brusilov led the offensive (June 1916). It would be the last important Russian offndive of the War. The Russians attacked the Austro-Hungarian sector of the front and achieved considerable success against the demoralized Austrian forces. The Germans shifted reinforcements from the Western Front. Romania etered the War, but was quickly defeated. The Western Allies were unable to make any progress in pnentating the Western Front andthe Russian advance ground to a hauly (September). After the Brusilov offensive the fighting moved east of Poland and the poorly led and supplied Russian Army begins to crack. The Russian Revolution overthrew the Tsar (February 1917). At the end of the War after the Russian Revolution, the Germans entered the Ukraine, but most ofthe hardest fighting had been in Poland and the Baltics.

Government General (1915)

The Cental Powers divided up Poland. The Germans took control of Warsaw and the north. The austrians took control of southern Poland. The Germans set up the Government General in their sector. Those readers familiar with the German Government General in World war II, would be surprised at what the Germans did in the Government General during World War I. The Russians had suppressed Polish nationalist movements even more severely than the Germans before the War. The Germans moved to reopen the University of Warsaw. They allowed the Poles to open Polish language schools that the Russians had supressed after moving against Congress Poland in the early-19th century. The Germans set up municipal governments and permitted elections--something unheard of in Tsarist Russia. The German military government permitted a Jewish press and permitted Jewish self government at the local level. The German policy was to demonstrate that they were both liberators and enlightened rulers. The Allies in the early stage of the war could not present themselves as either democratic or promoting national self determination because Tsarist Russia was such an important part of the Allied war effort. This could have strongly turned Poland toward the Central Powers. Russian looting and destruction as they retreated alinated many Poles. The behavior of the German Army, however, undermined the effort of the Central Powers to gain the alliengence of the Poles. German arraogance and rough, treatment of the Poles and other occupied people created a great deal of illwill. While nothing like the NAZI actions, the Germans did pursue some of the same policies. There were seizures of properity and land justified by military necessity. There were also forced populaion transfers. The Germans wanted to set up a buffer of German settlement along the eastern marches.

Domestic Situation

Much of the fighting on the Eastern Front occurred in Poland. The Russians launched an offensive from Poland into East Prussia. The Austro-Hungarians launched an attack from their area of Poland (Galicia). The After the defeat of the Russian offensive at Tannenberg, the fighting on the Eastern Front turned into a fight for Poland. Civilians suffered desperately in the intensive fighting that ocuurred. Inlike the Western Front , the fighting was not confined lrgely to the elatively narrow area of opposing trenches. and large numbers were displaced. Some 1 million Poles apparently followed the retreating Russian Army east. Some suffered forced removals. Relief agencies were overwealmed and the Germans controlled food supplies. And unlike Belgium there was no way of getting food aid from neutral America to the Poles. Only after the War was America about to get relief supplies to the Poles. Poland had been partioned by Austria, Germany, and Poland in the 18th century. Most of Poland including Warsaw was seized by the Russians, the rest went to Prussia and Austria to placate them. The Poles had generally seen the French as liberators during the Napoleoic Wars. This was not the same with the Central Powers. Polish attitudes varied and we have seen different assessments. Some sources suggest that the Poles sympathized with the Russians. There was some support for the Russians who were fellow Slavs. The Russians had been the primary mover in dismantling the indepndent Polish Kingdom (18th century) and brutally suppressed the Polish nationalist movement after the Napoleonic Wars (19th century). And Tsar Alexander III has begun a Russification effort. This had changed with a liberalization effort began after 1905 Revolution. German policy toward the Poles was one of relentless Germanization and there was no liberalization effort. Instead the Września school strike, severe restrictions on Polish education in Pomerania (Pozna&#324, and the Destruction of Kalisz all inspired anti-German feelings. Even Pilsuski who was oriented towad the Austrians was disturbed by German policies. The Poles did not harassment retreating Russian soldiers. Some attempted to care for the wounded. Russian behavior, however, especially the behavior of undisciplined Russian troops and the scorched earth policies of retreating Russian forces began to change attitudes toward the Germans. The Germans a new kingdom in Poland in an effort to win over the Poles. There was widespread destruction throughout Poland. Some cities were badly damged. The Central Powers exploited Eastern European Region for its resources. We are not sure just what resources occupied Poland provided the Germans. Food was certainly one of these resorces. Until late in the War, the primary area occupied in the East was Poland and the Baltics. Jews were among the people most affected. The area of the Russian Empire occupied had nearly half the Empire's Jews--the heartland of Eastern European Jewey.

Polish Legions

With the outbreak of Wotld War I, Pilsudski placed his Legions under Austrian command (1914). He insisted that the Legions be used only to fight the Russians with the objective of creating an independent Polish nation after the War. After Austrian Emperor Karl attempted to exit the War, the Germans took control of Austria. Thus Pilsudski anf the Legions had to deal with the Germans. When the Bolsheviks quit the War (1917), the Germans became a new impediment to a Polish state. They began preparing a massive Westertn offensive to end the War. And they wanted to use the Legions in the West against the French and other Allies. Pilsudski refused to allow the Legions to be used against France and to take an an oath of allegiance to the Kaiser. Not only would that not help establish a Polish state, but the French were sympsthetic to the Polish cause as were the Americans who had entered the War. The Germans arrested Pilsdudski and held him at Magdeburg Castle. They appointed a German commnder, Von Bessler, to command the Legions. The Legions refused to accept this and most of the units simply disbanded. The only unit to join the Germans were the 2nd Brigade. They swore an oath to join the Germans (April 1917). The Germans arrested many Leguonaires and held them at Szczypiorna, Lomza and (officers) Benjaminow. Many Legionnaires escaped internment and went underground. Some joined resistance groups like Polska Organizacja Wojskowa (POW). Others joined the Austrian Polish Auxiliary Corps or German Polnische Wehrmacht units. The Germans transported others to Germany to workin war work. Some escaped the German net and reached Russian controlled areas where they orh\ganized resistance groups. . Yet others fled to Russia to organize units there.

German Control--Polish Kingdom (1916)

The poor performance of the Austrian Army on the Eastern Front and Emperor Karl's attempt to exit the War, resulted in the Germans assuming command. The Central Powers primarily as the result of German forces had seized Warsaw (1915) and much of eastern Poland (1916). The Central Powers proceeded to proclaim a Polish Kingdom. While a Council of State was organized, the Germans retained effective control. The Germans with the Russians defeated, formed a Regency Council as the governing authority of the Polish Kingdom they claimed to have created. German military authorities, however, continued to exersise full control. The Russians had been the principal target of Polish resistance. Now the Germans held most of Poland. And the Allies now firmly endorsed Polish self-determination dramatically cghanging the political dynamic.

Russian Collapse (March 1917)

Russian collapse changed the political situation in the East. With the fall of the Tsar, the Provisional Government which contuinued to persue the War, recognized the right of Poland to national self-determination.
America Enters the War (April 1917)

America by 1917 had joined the war on the Allied side. While the United States only fought on the Western Front, American involvement was very important for Poland. President Wilson promoted the 14 Points which included as a key point national self determination. This of course appealed to the ethnic minorities in the United States that had fled Russian and tom a lesser extent and Austro-Hugarain oppression. Poles were an important ethnic minority in the United States. Most Polish-Americans had emigrated from Russian-controlled areas of Poland. Britain and France were less enthusiastic, because Russia and the Tsar was a key part of the Allied war effort. With Russian knocked out of the War, the British and French also endorsed Polish self-determination. The French then allowed the Poles to form a provisional government in Paris.

Polish Units Unite

General Jozef Haller commanded the Legions Second Brigade. He had accepted Austrian and German claims that they would establish an independent Poland after the War. Thus unlike Pilsudski, he swore an oath to the Kaiser and agreed to fight in the West in the German Spring 1918 offensive designed to end the War. General Lucjan Zeligowski also agreed to fight with the Ger\mans. The Polish Army formed under German command was a sizeable force (late 1917-early 1918]. The provisions of the Brest Litovsk Treaty which the Germans had begun to implement, convinced the Poles that the Germans were not being honest. It for example transferred Chełm to the German-controlled Ukrainian state. In addition, Von Bessler's appointment confirmed to most Poles that the Polish state the Germans were establishing would be a puppet state and not a real independent Poland. Thus Haller with the 2nd and 3rd Regiment in Bessarabia attempted to break through the Austrian lines s at Rarancza (mid-February 1918]. Many were captured by the Austrians and interned at camps in Hungary and Bohemia, including Huszt, Maramaros and Sziget. Haller and others who managed to cross the border joined the Polish 2nd Corps in Russia. This was the remains of the Polish units which had fought on the Tsarist side, including the Pulawski Legion. There was also a Polish Army in France fighting with the Allies--the Blue Army. It was composed of American and Polish Canadian Volunteers, mostly recent emigrants, who had traveled to Europe to fight for Poland before America entered the War. After the Armistace, they made theit\r way to Poland to help establish an independent Poland.

The Armistice (November 1918]

Although the Germans had achieved their goals in the East, reverses in the West changed the political landscape. The Germans had hoped that victory in the East would enable to move sizeable forces west and once and for all defeat the British and French. But a new American Army was now reinforcing the Allied lines in the West. The Germans failed in their great spring offensive (1918]. The Allied Armies launched the 100 Days Campaign led by the Americans and British. The Allies by the Fall cracked the Siegfried Line and were pushing the Germans back toward the borders of Germany itself. Revolts broke out in German cities. The Allies made it clear that they would not negotiate an armistice with the Kaiser or the German High Command. The High Command informed the the Kaiser that they could no longer guarantee his safety. The Kaiser abdicated and fled to Holland. A civilian Government was formed and an Armistice was finally signed.

Polish Republic (November 1918]

The Poles, as the German position in the West deteriorated moved to seize control of the country. The German established Regency Council in Warsaw became the de facto authority in Poland (October 12). The Poles proclained a new Republic (November 3). German authorities released Pilsudski from Magdenburg Castle (November 10, 1918]. He immeditely headed for Warsaw. He arrived there on the same day the Armistice on the Western Front went into effect (November 11). Understanding that a Polish national rising was about to take place, the German-appointed Regency Council resigned in favor of Marshal Pilsudski (November 14). The German garrison in Warsaw chose to evacuate by train. Pilsudski assumed dictatorial powers. The Allies recognized the new Polish state set up by Pilsudski. He proceededc to form a coalition government with the different Polish factins, incluing the provisional government in Paris. A coalition government with Pilsudki as president and famed pianist Ignace Paderewski as primier (January 17, 1919). The Poles than elected a constituent assembly which drafted a provisional constitution.

Versailles (1919)

At Versilles the Poles demanded the boundaries of Poland before the 18th century partitions. They had already seized Galicia and Posen in the west (191. The Allies at Versailes were very generous with the Poles [June 28, 1919]. The Poles were granted a corridor along the Vistula through former German territory to give them access to the Baltic. They also received substantial areas in Posen and West Prussia. Danzig was made a free city and the Poles given rights they could use it as a port. The border in Silesia was to becdetermined by plebecite. Poland's more difficult eastern border was turned over to the new League of Nations.

War with the Bolshevicks [1919-21]

The Poles had moved quickly in the east, engaging the Bolshevicks in Lithuanian and Beylorusia. They captured a primary objective--Vilna (April 19, 1919]. The League's answer was the Curzon Line (December 8, 1919]. This would have left most etnic Poles with in the boundaries of the new Republic. It did not, however, satisfy the Poles. They wanted the pre-partition boundaries even though the population beyiund the Curzon Line was mixed with many non-Poles, including many Ukraines, Beyelorusians, and Lithuanians. The Poles demanded that the Bolshevicks negotiated a new border well east of the Curzon Line (March 1920). Negotiatins got nowhere. Poland declared war (April 25). The Poles with French assistance moved east, even taking Kiev in the Ukraine May 8. The Bolshevicks launched a counter offensive (June) and drove the Poles back almost to Warsaw. At that point the Franco-Polish Army struck backmand defeated the bolshevicks in several sharp engagements. The two sides reached a cease fire (October 12, 1920). A factor here was the Civil War in Russia and the Bolshevicks need to end the war with Poland so thaey could focus in the White armies. The Treaty of Riga confirmed Polish possession of large areas in the east beyond the Curzon Line (March 18, 1921).

Inter-War Poland

Inter-war Poland included a German minority in the west and eastern areas where Lithuanians, Beylorusians, and Ukranians often out numbered Poles. There was also a sizeable Jewish minority, the largest in Europe outside of Russia.


World War II

No country suffered during World War II more than Poland. Of all the terrible situations during World War II, Poland was the worst place to be and the Polish people suffered terribly. Poland was part of an alliance with Britain and France that confronted the NAZIs in World War II. Both Poland and France were defeated and occupied. Unlike the French, Poland continued to resist and was a valiant and valued ally throughout the War. World War II began with the German invasion of Poland (1939). The Soviets of course also invaded Poland in 1939, but Britain and France wisely only declared war on Germany. The subsequent Cold War between the Soviets and the western Allies also had its origins in Poland. Stalin's repressive measures in Poland, especially the murder of Polish officers in the Katyn Forrest was revealed by the NAZIs in 1942. Soon Soviet measures against the Polish Government in exile, the creation of a rival Polish Governmrent, and the abandonment of the Polish Home Army in Warsaw (1944) were some of the major issues which began the separation of the Soviet and Western Allies even before the end of World War II. Poland was a major issue at both Yalta and Potsdam. Many critics hav charged that tht President Roosevelt in particula abandoned Poland to the Soviets. [Olson and Cloud] The simple fact is, however, that the Red Army destroyed the Whermacht. If it had not been for the relentless pressure of the Red Army in the East, D-Day would have never been possible. The Soviet domination of Poland and Eastern Europe after the War was a simple reflection of that basic fact. America and the Western Allies could not have rescued Poland from the Soviets without war. In the end it was the Polish people who would prevail. It was in Poland with Solidarity in the 1980s that the Soviet empire began to unravel.

http://histclo.com/essay/war/ww1/cou/w1c-pol.html

 

Geez, I didn't know. Thanks for the enlightenment!

 

I'll be back in the morning.

 

Gleiwitz incident, and all these incidents are proven fake.

They're false flags by the Germans.

 

It must have nothing to do with Germans coming here to spread their anti-Polish agenda, making up lies that Polish killed 58,000 Germans in Bromberg?

 

If you knew, then why are you passing them off as Polish actions?

 

I gave it a shot a few pages back. I don't think his pro-Nazi content will make him understand that 99% of the scientific community worked on these issues and have proven them fake. Some people just won't believe anything which flies in the face of what the Nazi propaganda used to claim.

Too bad...

Poland wasn't actually the first target of Hitlers military aggression, just to clarify. Austria's resources were already in the 4-year plan in 1936, and Hitler claimed in later years that one of his biggest mistakes was that he didn't get WW2 started against Czechoslovakia in 1938 because France and Britain wouldn't had been that well prepared for a conflict. He wanted a war, no matter what, and independent from Jazz's sources, it wouldn't have been prevented even if Poland hat agreed to the crazy demands in 1939...

 

Sure, Right, Uh-Huh, Take It To The Bank,

NOT!​

My best buddy and I can recite most WW2 documentaries as we watch them.
So I treated him to
[video=youtube;0A6UWkK2U4s]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0A6UWkK2U4s&list=PLnNmfyY_ccRHl0yAJZy3r5Nf q2-Xr22di[/video]
from computer to Big Screen.

There are horrible battles not mentioned in History Channel's interpretation.
Mostly those termed, "the Rzhev meat grinder".
What percent of Soviet soldiers were treated as POW's and made it home at the end of the war?
Near zero
So when the media tells me only some 5-10% of Nazi POW's from Stalingrad made it back to Germany in the early 1950's, I figure that is 5-10% to many or representative of Soviet humanity compared to Nazi.

Too bad Germany was not treated to the Morganthau Plan after WW2 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morgenthau_Plan
Also overlooked was the return of property deeds held by Jewish persons returned to some Jewish authority rather than allowing those properties to fall into gentile ownership as was done, furthering Hitlers solution.


Moi


r > g

Across an immense, unguarded, ethereal border, Canadians, cool and unsympathetic,
regard our America with envious eyes and slowly and surely draw their plans against us.​

 

Since the question of POW came up, I have found a good source, a Russian Journalist, Yuri Teplyakov:.

Stalin's War Against His Own Troops​

The Tragic Fate of Soviet Prisoners of War in German Captivity​

At dawn on June 22, 1941, began the mightiest military offensive in history: the German-led Axis attack against the Soviet Union. During the first 18 months of the campaign, about three million Soviet soldiers were taken prisoner. By the end of the conflict four years later, more than five million Soviet troops are estimated to have fallen into German hands. Most of these unfortunate men died in German captivity.

A major reason for this was the unusual nature of the war on the eastern front, particularly during the first year -- June 1941-June 1942 -- when vastly greater numbers of prisoners fell into German hands than could possibly be accommodated adequately. However, and as Russian journalist Teplyakov explains in the following article, much of the blame for the terrible fate of the Soviet soldiers in German captivity was due to the inflexibly cruel policy of Soviet dictator Stalin.

During the war, the Germans made repeated attempts through neutral countries and the International Committee of the Red Cross to reach mutual agreement on the treatment of prisoners by Germany and the USSR. As British historian Robert Conquest explains in his book Stalin: Breaker of Nations, the Soviets adamantly refused to cooperate:

"When the Germans approached the Soviets, through Sweden, to negotiate observance of the provisions of the Geneva Convention on prisoners of war, Stalin refused. The Soviet soldiers in German hands were thus unprotected even in theory. Millions of them died in captivity, through malnutrition or maltreatment. If Stalin had adhered to the convention (to which the USSR had not been a party) would the Germans have behaved better? To judge by their treatment of other 'Slav submen' POWs (like the Poles, even surrendering after the [1944] Warsaw Rising), the answer seems to be yes. (Stalin's own behavior to [Polish] prisoners captured by the Red Army had already been demonstrated at Katyn and elsewhere [where they were shot]."

Another historian, Nikolai Tolstoy, affirms in The Secret Betrayal:

"Hitler himself urged Red Cross inspection of [German] camps [holding Soviet prisoners of war]. But an appeal to Stalin for prisoners' postal services received a reply that clinched the matter: 'There are no Soviet prisoners of war. The Soviet soldier fights on till death. If he chooses to become a prisoner, he is automatically excluded from the Russian community. We are not interested in a postal service only for Germans'."

Given this situation, the German leaders resolved to treat Soviet prisoners no better than the Soviet leaders were treating the German soldiers they held. As can be imagined, Soviet treatment of German prisoners was harsh. Of an estimated three million German soldiers who fell into Soviet hands, more than two million perished in captivity. Of the 91,000 German troops captured in the Battle of Stalingrad, fewer than 6,000 ever returned to Germany.

As Teplyakov also explains here, Red Army "liberation" of the surviving Soviet prisoners in German camps brought no end to the suffering of these hapless men. It wasn't until recently, when long-suppressed Soviet wartime records began to come to light and long-silenced voices could at last speak out, that the full story of Stalin's treatment of Soviet prisoners became known. It wasn't until 1989, for example, that Stalin's grim Order No. 270 of August 16, 1941 -- cited below -- was first published.

"What is the most horrible thing about war?"

Marshal Ivan Bagramyan, three-time Hero of the Soviet Union Alexander Pokryshkin, and Private Nikolai Romanov, who has no battle orders or titles, all replied with just one word: "Captivity."
...
...

Stalin's Order No. 270.

If ... "instead of organizing resistance to the enemy, some Red Army men prefer to surrender, they shall be destroyed by all possible means, both ground-based and from the air, whereas the families of the Red Army men who have been taken prisoner shall be deprived of the state allowance [that is, rations] and relief."

The commanders and political officers ... "who surrender to the enemy shall be considered malicious deserters, whose families are liable to be arrested [just] as the families of deserters who have violated the oath and betrayed their Motherland."

Just a few lines, but they stand for the hundreds of thousands of children and old folks who died from hunger only because their father or son happened to be taken prisoner.

http://www.ihr.org/jhr/v14/Teplyakov.html
---------------------

There is also the sad story of the Cossacks which I will find next.

 

.....It is difficult to argue, but.....

....but .....Are You crawling away from thise question?,,,,

 

We, Russian, (*)(*)(*)(*) you, Poles, with 16-century ...
So you their "opinion" shove up your ass "pshek" dropped ...
--------------------------------------
your opinion - to expose their "Dupuy" under Russian or Americans ..

=====================================
So - go (*)(*)(*)(*) "pshek"

 

It was land that belonged to Germany until they took it away after WWI.
Read about it in Wiki
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sudetenland

All clear now?

 

Indelibly imprinted in the history of the Eastern Front of WWII is the story of the tragic Karma of the brave Cossacks. My heart goes out to them... I wish I could have prevented their terrible fate.
Read their story here:

Aftermath​

The Cossack officers, more politically aware than the enlisted men, expected that repatriation to the USSR would be their ultimate fate. They believed that the British would have sympathised with their anti-Communism, but were unaware that their fates had been decided at the Yalta Conference.
Upon discovering that they would be repatriated, many escaped, some probably aided by their Allied captors;[8] some passively resisted, and others committed suicide.

Of those Cossacks who escaped repatriation, many hid in forests and mountainsides, some were hidden by the local German populace, but most hid in different identities as Ukrainians, Latvians, Poles, Yugoslavians, Turks, Armenians, and Ethiopians. Eventually, they were admitted to displaced persons camps under assumed names and nationalities; many emigrated to the US per the Displaced Persons Act. Others went to any country that would admit them (e.g. Germany, Austria, France, and Italy). Most Cossacks hid their true national identity until the dissolution of the USSR in late 1991.

After the death of Stalin in 1953, partial amnesty was granted for some labour camp inmates on 27 March 1953 with the end of the GULAG system, then extended it on 17 September 1955.
Yet, some specific political crimes were omitted from amnesty: people convicted under Section 58.1(c) of the Criminal Code, stipulating that in the event of a military man escaping Russia, every adult member of his family who abetted the escape or who knew of it is subject to five to ten years’ imprisonment; every dependant who did not know of the escape is subject to five years’ Siberian exile.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Repatriation_of_Cossacks_after_World_War_II#Judenburg.2C_Austria
----------------------
The bolshevistic Stalin-Regime was, without doubt, the most brutal and most feared regime at the time. WHY is it that the Western Allies still to this day proclaim the evil Nazi-Regime was the worst ever?
To appease the Russians they still fear?
To hide their own atrocities? https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2014/dec/09/cia-torture-report-worst-findings-waterboard-rectal
Probably both!