A couple of questions for (Christian) Theists!

I agree. Nothing you have said here is in conflict with what I said or meant.

 

Oh. I thought you said the fact that outside forces were brought to bear sort of negated free will. My bad.

 

How many know what the term means and how it affected the creation of israel?

The reason I brought it up is to compare the intentions of the movement and the comparisons of why?

 

It was intended to be complementary to the points you made.

Additionally, the plague became air borne.
The restrictions on their mingling and travels that were experienced by the Jews who lived in small ghettos, separated and away from the mainstream community, was a factor that help lower the incidence of the plague, too.

Nevertheless, the prophecy that the Jews would be that scapegoat that was predicted in Gen 22 seems simply a matter of good Bible Sociology.

Today, when we realize that the foreigner, sojourning in the land of another, is usually ill treated and in the end, disappears either by the attrition of inter-marriage or the forces of prejudice that make life underground soon die out.

The Psychology that the Bible reveals about the choices we humans unconsciously will make when our motives are self centered and selfish instead of charitanble and to the advantages of our neighbors clearly describes the path of the Sociology that will unfold:


Rev. 11:7 And when they, (the House of Jacob and the house of Judah, the two witnesses), shall have finished their testimony (against their own suffering messiah), the (seven headed) beast (of Western civilization) that (had) ascendeth out of the bottomless pit (in The Renaissance) shall make (secular) war against them, (these Jews of the diaspora), and shall overcome them (in 1942), and kill them (with gas and starvation and brutalities).

Rev. 11:8 And, (the House of Jacob and the house of Judah), their dead bodies shall lie in the street (of Nazi Paganism) of the great city (which is the tenth horn of Western Civilization), which spiritually (in its philosophical outlook) is called Sodom, (i.e.; a place practicing pagan sexual license and libidinal excess) and (that ancient place of Jew trust in the shadow of) Egypt, (the time of their confusion: [Isa. 30:2-3]: Egypt, the land of both their beloved Joseph and also, their slavery), where, (in their blindness of scriptural truth) also our Lord was crucified (among them in 32 AD).

Rev. 11:9 And they of the (the gentile) people and kindreds and tongues (in the lands of the Jewish dispersion, from the time of the beginning of the construction of the abomination of the Dome of the Rock in 688AD until 1948, i.e., 1260 years) among them, (during the Diaspora), and nations (both) shall see their dead bodies (in Concentration Camps) three days (of years, i.e.; 1260) and an half, (1942-1945), and shall not suffer their dead bodies to be put in graves (but disposed of in the Crematoriums).


Rev. 11:10 And they that dwell upon the earth, (in Nazi Western Europe), shall rejoice over them, and make merry, and shall send (supposed Christian seasonal) gifts one to another; because these two prophets, (the holy people of the book), tormented them that dwelt on the earth.

Rev. 11:11 And after (the Holocaust), three and an half days (of years), the Spirit of life from God entered into them, (the House of Jacob and the House of Judah), and they stood upon their feet (in the land Promised); and great fear fell upon them (in Islam) which saw them, (the prophecy of the Fig Tree, blooming, Hosea 9:10, was fulfilled: [Matt 24:32].

Rev. 11:12 And (the survivors), they (collectively) heard (the commands of Zionism), a great voice from heaven saying unto them, Come up hither (to the prophecy fulfilled, where all Nations can see the Jew returned to the Holy Land once again.).
And they ascended up to heaven (by complying with the voice, gathering themselves together in this Zionism) in a cloud (of peoples from Western Europe and all the world); and their enemies (especially in Palestinia) beheld them.

Rev. 11:13 And the same hour was there a great earthquake, (i.e.; Israeli Statehood), and the tenth part of the city, (that first small piece of the Promised Land), fell (to the returning Jews), and in the earthquake (of their in-gathering) were slain of (Muslim) men, seven thousand:
and the remnant (Islamic armies) were affrighted, and (all the Judeo-Christian world) gave glory to the God of heaven (that prophecy of Daniel, 12:11-12, had been fulfilled as Christ had acknowledged and opposed the Maccabean interpretations).

 

Yup I kind of figured it was complementary content.

 

No, I said that most religions do not claim there are outside forces that mediate/control our behavior. I used Free Will as an example to show that each individual ultimately makes their own choices, regardless of outside influence.

 

Exactly.

Everyone who disagrees with what we, individually, say here is the false teacher, and we can each all insist we are the teacher revealing the Truth.

The inquisition used these 2 Peter 2 every time it was useful, and they are still available if we want to dismiss the other person's input.

I do not believe Peter was thinking about confessed believers in Jesus and those who honestly ponder the scriptures and sincerely explain the message they receive by such efforts.

But I think the letter to 1Ti makes the point more clear where and what Peter says can be historically recognized as the kind of situation where it is relevant.
The false teachers appeared in droves when, at the end of the 1000 year reign of the Universal and singular Christian Church over all the Roman World gave way to a Renaissance or re-birth of the ancient cultures of Rome and Greece:


1Tim. 4:1 Now the Spirit (of Truth: [John 14:17 ]) speaketh expressly, that in the (Renaissance of the) latter times, (after the end of the thousand year reign of Universal Christianity) some (men and women) shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits (demanding sexual license), and (the liberalization of marriage vows to include no-fault divorce, gay marriages, adolescent sexual freedom, multiple sex partners, open marriages, the ridiculing of virginity, condoning multiple pre-marital sex partners, inclusion of open marriages, and such), doctrines (who are beneficiaries of such behaviors, i.e.; lawyers, Feminists traders in sexual favors, wives' second time around, non-support welfare fathers, irresponsible adolescents, politicians serving these constituients, etc...);

1Tim. 4:2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy (of even their own statistical facts and sociological studies), having their conscience seared (shut) with a hot iron (of self interest in feminism);

1Tim. 4:3 Forbidding (young people) to marry (until an average age of 26 years today), and commanding (the folly of abstinence, in order) to abstain from meats (of their God-given hormonal drives) which God hath created (in us) to be received (an exercised close to the days of puberty) with thanksgiving (for the nature intended) of them which believe (God granted satisfaction of the sexual drives he, himself, created to come forth hormonally at puberty) and know the truth, (that society manipulates the youth in order to channel their behavior onto paths useful for the society of this man-made world).

 

Your additions have no place there. Can you please not do that?

For example:

"The earth" does not mean "western Nazi Europe." You have no business limiting scripture in such a way. You can abuse the vagueness of these passages only so much to say "Oh it could mean this or that." but you are doing much worse by pinning specific dates and distorting history and prophesy to try to make them match when they don't.

 

Yeah that is why I don't get into much theology on the interwebs but you convinced me to open up and answer all five.

 

Free Will is just the exercise of those states of mind where one candecide between alternative actions as opposed to situations of either no or very limited choice.

What we are offered can be external choices between different actions we can take, or also between competing thoughts and ideas that arise within our psyche.

In either case, we can ask, What would Jesus do," which is so often ridiculed by people today who forget, men are supposed to exerise and acknowledge their good Conscience.

But John would like to discount the inferences, that Freud and Jung have supplied modern insight into these ancient reports of evil spirits. Probably because acknowledging that these are the enemy, we, in the end, discover them to be apart of ourselves.


Nevertheless, it seems good for religious counseling to accept this idea, and to encourage the Free Will of a person to turn down the temptation to feel good, based upon the cost of feeling so bad for so long later:




Why John is so adamantly against such excellent support for both the Bible and the counseling from it is strange unkless he finds it damaging to some preconceived point of view of his own.

 

Jesus would condemn, say, Natalie Portman (and other moral jews), and, say, Gandhi (and other moral Hindus, etc.) to a fate worse than Hilter could ever have dreamed about doing to the Jews in his concentration camps. Just read the fairy tale in Revelation. Jesus will come back as a warlord (hardly a man of peace) and kill the "son of Satan". Crazy, and just meant to put fear into our hearts so as to get us to obey the clergy.

 

Nah...

You misread the passages I am certain.

Jesus specifically said to obey the Jewish cleargy, but not to do the things they did.
The clergy does not appear to be the source of angry responses to perceived evals, but the teaching concern turning the cheek and loving one's enemy.

Perhaps you actually have a passage in mind that differs with this????

 

When I did check out Secular Humanism I saw immediately that it parrotted the very teachings we find explicitly stated in 1Co 13.

Based upon the work of the first president of the American Secular Humanistic Society, Abraham Maslow, the item by item correspondence could hardly be more duplicitious when we realize St Paul listed the same 15 Charateristics of the Self Actualized Person, but 2000 years before Maslow independently derived the same:



Abraham Maslow's 15 Characteristics of a Sane Person, in Caps, are compared here with 1Co13:4-9;13

1Cor. 13:4 (The altruistic attitude), charity, suffereth long (IN MEDITATIONS), and is kind (IN ITS ACCEPTANCE OF SELF AND OTHERS); charity, (Altruism), envieth not (BY RESISTING SUCH ENCULTURATION); charity, (the atruistic attitude), vaunteth not itself (BUT IS COMPASSIONATE), is not puffed up (BUT IS NATURAL, SPONTANEOUS AND SIMPLE),

1Cor. 13:5 Doth not behave itself unseemly, (BUT IS CREATIVE), seeketh not her own (IN A MORE EFFICIENT VIEW OF REALITY), is not easily provoked (IT HAS A BIG BROTHER ATTITUDE), thinketh not evil (BUT DISCRIMINATES BETWEEN GOOD AND EVIL);

1Cor. 13:6 Rejoiceth not in iniquity (BUT IS UNHOSTILE AND OPEN-MINDED IN HUMOR), but rejoiceth in the truth (THAT IS PROBLEM CENTERED);

1Cor. 13:7 Beareth all things (IN A DEMOCRATIC RESPONSE), believeth all things (AS REGARDS THE PEAK MYSTICAL EXPERIENCE), hopeth all things (THROUGH PERSONAL AUTONOMY), endureth all things (IN A CONTINUED FRESHNESS OF APPRECIATION).

 

There was no clergy when it was written.

 

Hahahaaaaaa...

True...

But Jesus only had Satan locked up for the 1000 years of his reign over the Roman mpire:


Rev. 20:1 And I saw an angel, (a social manifestation of inter-generational authority), come down from heaven (manifesting in the enactment of Law in 380AD, Emperor Theodosius I, established Catholic Christianity as the official religion of the Roman Empire and ordering pagans and other sects of Christianity to be called heretics), having the key,(the authority of Universal Christianity), to the bottomless pit (of history) and a great chain (of cultural restraints) in his hand (by which to implement social change).

Rev. 20:2 And he laid hold on the dragon, (the subtle cultural system of exploitative sexual mores), that old serpent, (cultural Paganism), which is the devil (of sexual license), and (libidinal lustfulness of) satan, and bound him, (the dragon), a thousand (1000) years (during the reign of Christ throughout the DARK AGES),...

Rev. 20:3 And cast him, (this dragon, the subtle cultural system of exploitative sexual mores, that old serpent, cultural Paganism), into the bottomless pit (of time), and shut him, (Satan), up (1000 years so as to inhibit the culture of libidinal freedom and sexual excess), and set a seal, (THE CROSS), upon him, that he (could not maintain that pagan, astrological/mythological promiscuous religious subculture that) should deceive the nations (in the Western world) no more (with his pagan culture), ...

... till the thousand years (of the Dark Age of Monasticism) should be fulfilled (and the Renaissance of the Beast begin):

and after that, (in The Renaissance), he must be loosed (to open the adolescent subculture of ever increasing sexual permissiveness) a little season (since the end of the singular one Church over all Rome).

 

No. What John. would like is for you to stop making false claims and attributing them to Freud or Jung, who did not say the things that you claim they said.

I don't operate from a preconceived notion here. I operate from a set of facts that inform me, on other words knowledge, that what you claim is not in regard to what their respective philosophies were.


What I am against is scumbags who insist on lying because they don't have actual evidence for what they are claiming.

If you have a problem with that, you can always remedy it but refraining from misrepresenting Freud and Jung and spreading falsehoods.

 

If you regard revelations as a a fairy tale, maybe you should read it like an academic of literary studies would actually read a fairy tale. You are aware that Little Red Riding Hood supposedly isn't really about being eaten by a wolf, aren't you? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Little_red_riding_hood#Interpretations

 

You said nobody follow the Bible that alone is already a lie because thousands follow the Bible so until you can reconcile and accept that is the case there will be no answer to this question for you.

Who said God created Adam and Eve white? only you and white people are claiming that God clearly said he created Adam and Eve He didn't say they were white, black, brown or yellow. Understand that first then I will be able to answer your question why different skin colors.

Anyone who do good including those who do not persecute Christians will go to heaven. To be sure one is following the right Christian group that Christian group must have (1) Apostolic succession (2) History (3) Tradition (4) Universal or Catholic

The Jews are chosen people meaning to deliver God's message that all humans are children of God it does not mean that Jews are exclusive people of God. Jews were targeted because of their success.

Sex drugged craze place is part of what hell is combine with burning heat and everlasting pain so no matter how much drugs those spirits take to shut out the pain it won't work no amount of enhancing drugs will help them ease the pain and sorrow. In Heaven the spirits will have no need for any of those enhancing drugs because it will be everlasting happiness.

 

Caused by whom? What's the motivation for Satan to torture those who are on his side? Is Satan just an insane torturer? Does god knowingly consign people to the care of an insane torturer? Or is god himself the one who causes the eternal pain?

Whatever way you spin it, god doesn't come off looking like a nice guy at all.

 

Many aspects of these questions can be be clarified by reading not only the Bible itself but authors like Thomas of Aquinas, Origen, Augustine, etc., and someone mentioned Strong's and Concordances and the like. I'm not Catholic but the early, pre-12th century Catholic scholars are excellent primers. My favorite is Aquinas.

Didn't read but the first page, so if somebody already recommended these writers, my apologies for the redundancies.

 

1.) We believe that immortal life is a good thing becuase we will live without pain, disease, suffering, war, etc. There will be nothing in our immortal life that is bad. We will have immortal physical bodies at the peak of their performance and have supernatural powers. We will have total knowledge of all things. There is so much information to give on the wonders of our immortal lives that it would require a thread of it's own. Everything you said, after the first sentence, is opinion on your part and not anywhere close to the Christian faith. If you are not Christian, don't presume to say what the Christians believe.

2.) Rather than type everything here in my answer to this question I refer you to this link:

http://gracethrufaith.com/ask-a-bible-teacher/where-did-different-races-come-from/#more-36867

3.) Wow, a shotgun question. It would sure be easier if you just asked one question at a time, you've got almost ten in this one question. I'll do my best to answer: You dont go to hell if you "pray to the wrong God", you go to hell if you dont accept God's free gift of grace by believing that Jesus died to pay the penalty for your sins. That's what Christianity is all about, accepting God's forgiveness for your sins through Jesus. It's a very simple gospel.

It's YOU that are saying that different denominations are wrong. Salvation deals with the individual, not the denomination he belongs to. As for me, I dont belong to any denomination. I am just a simple Christian, no more, no less. Having the wrong "Christian" belief is not believing that Jesus died for your sins. If you dont believe that He did then you are not a true Christian. You can call yourself anything you want, that doesnt mean you are what you call yourself.

I suggest you go here for this answer: http://gracethrufaith.com/selah/the-story-behind-the-redeemer/#more-39293

4.) Because men are not without sin. Many are CINO's (Christians in name only). Even true Christians are sinners and dont adhere to the precepts set forward by Jesus, but they are still saved because of their faith in the atoning blood of Jesus. Salvation doesnt depend on your actions, it depends on your faith.

5.) It's hard to answer this question because it's not even close to reality, but, again, let me try: Satan doesn't "work for God". Satan is the accuser, constantly accusing Christians of their sins. He has access to Heaven right now, but will lose that access very soon. Satan was Lucifer, the highest angel in Heaven. He tried to overthrow God (as if that's possible) and 1/3 of all the angels joined Him. He lost but still thinks He can thwart God's plans by any means possible, causing Jesus, the man, to sin (didnt work), causing all mankind to sin (he's good at that) and making life miserable for Christians if he can. Hell is nothing like anything you can comprehend. It's not like Dante's Inferno. It is a place of despair, lonliness and pain. There is no time in hell so it seems like it is eternal, whether it is or not eternal, the people that go there will find out one day. If you go to hell you wont be partying with anyone, you wont even see anyone.

 

To quote you: Everything you said is your opinion. Your first words were "we BELIEVE" meaning there is no proof , it's just a belief.

And no. 4 is a hoot!

""""4.) Because men are not without sin. Many are CINO's (Christians in name only). Even true Christians are sinners and dont adhere to the precepts set forward by Jesus, but they are still saved because of their faith in the atoning blood of Jesus. Salvation doesnt depend on your actions, it depends on your faith.""""



So all the murderers, rapists, theives, only have to believe some fantasy and then they go to heaven?....your god has very low standards and obviously you don't think christians should be responsible for their own actions.....

 

Do you partake in the sacraments? Isn't it a requirement to be baptized, partake in the sacraments of body and blood? Without those, faith alone isn't enough.

 

I like augustine, and then later, Calvin.

 

That's correct dude. Where is your "proof" for anything? At least I tell the truth.

Glad you liked #4. There you go bloviating again. Stating your opinion as fact. Your fantasy is my truth. I dont claim it to be a fact like you do. ALL sinners that accept God's free gift of forgiveness go to Heaven. Salvation is not based on actions but on acceptance of forgiveness. Christians are held to God's standards for their actions, but it has nothing to do with salvation. The difference between you and I as far as salvation is concerned is I want salvation and you dont. So be it.