More than 52,000 Canadians left the country for medical care in 2014

Not if that is the ultimate goal of the Democratic party.

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What you did was mock my links then linked me to a biased PDF.

 

why would you suppose they come to the US? many countries have excellent medical tourism businesses going on.

,

 

Mocked? Interesting term. I said I disbelieve those studies due to the Institutes history of bias.

And in what way was my pdf biased? If you know of a history for that organization that I'm unaware of, please share.

 

quite apart from the fact that it is a minute number, I wonder how many of that number are snow birds who live 6 months a year in florida and Arizona?
Those hospital visits would be part of the total number as well.

Funny how a system that suffices for 99+% if its users, doesnt' work because less than 1% go elsewhere.

 

Yep! Glad you made that point! I was going to make the same point, but my data was a little older! Thanks!

Medical tourism is much more rampant from the US toward other countries than from other countries who enjoy more affordable and accessible healthcare!

 

It's painfully ironic that you snipped my comments about how partisan politics is a problem for US healthcare to write that.

 

Canada is struggling to meet its own wait time and access goals, and has been for a long time. That's why they had the "10 Year Plan To Strengthen Health Care" was started in 2004, wait times and access to care were unacceptable in many parts of Canada. Many areas had no access to specialized care or equipment. The 10 Year plan failed. Only one province (New Foundland & Labrador) met the goal of providing the required care within the required wait time to 90% of patients for hip replacement, knee replacement, hip fracture repair, and cataract surgery.

In Canada, the 90% goal for cataract surgery is 112 days, hip replacement and knee replacement is 182 days (6 months!), hip fracture repair is 48 hours. Canada wide, 24% of people needing knee replacement and 18% of people needing hip replacement had to wait more than 6 months - in pain, sometimes immobile, unproductive, unable to do their job.

No wonder people come to the US for health care.

Canada documents their problems very well in their govt run Canadian Institute for Health Information (www.cihi.ca). The Canadian system has problems and is heading for a lot more, but the Canadians are honest about it and are trying to solve the problems.

 

Why are so many people assuming that all those Canadian going to other countries for some healthcare come to the US?
Actually there are more Canadian going to Thailand, Mexico and England than those coming to the US! And there are many more US citizens going to those same countries to get healthcare also!

So. . .what is it about all that wrong premises?

 

Waits,

Are they influenced by location?

Is the wait as long in Ottawa as it is in InuitLand?
I mean they all are, "averaged".

Figures don't like but, liars can . . . . ​

Moi
Glad to see ya Sadanie.


r > g

View attachment 34258 ​

 

Because it works so well in the UK?

Dementia victims 'have twice the risk of dying in hospital while a third are not properly diagnosed by staff'

University professor, 37, dies from lung cancer after string of doctors dismissed symptoms as 'anxiety and depression'

Premature twins died after being given 10 times too much morphine, nursing tribunal hears

Failings in NHS cost 30,000 lives every year

Inspections highlight 'barbaric' home care failings

NHS watchdog to tackle malnutrition in hospitals

Elderly warned of growing isolation as face-to-face care cut

Family of RAF's finest who shot V1 rockets out the sky forced to sell medals to pay for care home

Closing the Independent Living Fund shows how low the government will go

Elderly patients diagnosed with 'acopia' - a disease that does not exist

Mid-Staffs scandal: Sir David Nicholson could face corporate manslaughter and misconduct charges

Growing fears of Bolton hospital death rate 'cover up'

Patients 'are still in danger from nurses who can't speak English' say MPs, as they call for urgent action

Older diabetics are suffering 'needless' amputations and blindness because they get the worst care

Pensioner placed on Liverpool Care Pathway WITHOUT family's permission dies after spending eight days without food or water

‘Basic errors in care cause kidney deaths’

Choosing a GP means gambling with your life – this must stop

Seventeen NHS hospitals have dangerously low numbers of nurses

Hospital patients won’t complain for fear of retribution

New avoidable-deaths scandal to put more pressure on NHS chief

Nurse linked to the death of premature twins killed by '10 times too much morphine' is allowed to keep working

NHS neglect: elderly patients ‘denied help with food’

Hip fracture patients suffering 'indefensible postcode lottery'

Snap inspections expose scandal of 'institutionalised abuse' in care homes and hospitals

Children's lives are being put at risk by a 'chronic shortage' of hospital doctors on weekends and evenings

Hospital that left patients lying in soiled sheets and shivering with cold is given a stark warning to improve by health watchdog

Mother-of-three dies of meningitis just five days after being admitted to hospital with EARACHE

A&E patients being forced to wait in ambulances for up to eight hours because of lack of beds

An unprecedented crisis is approaching, say the health service’s most senior figures

Number of patients being tied up and locked in rooms by care staff DOUBLES as MPs issue warning about hospital abuse

Thousands dying of thirst on NHS: Watchdog forced to issue guidelines on giving patients water

Woman who was sterilised is horrified to discover metal surgical clip had travelled from her groin to her CHEST

'My daughter was sent home from A&E to die of croup': Grieving mother to sue hospital after one-year-old's death

The little girl who could have been saved from meningitis - by jab NHS refuses to fund

Concerns over nursery worker who raped child 'were not investigated'

GPs predict longer waiting times - survey

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Pensioner died in agony after developing a horrific bedsore in hospital which left her spine exposed

Grandmother, 55, died from cervical cancer after her GP dismissed her symptoms as the MENOPAUSE

Children left disabled by meningitis after GPs failed to diagnose them are paid £28m in compensation

Girl, two, 'died after doctors failed to talk to each other about MRI scan that showed she had water on the brain'

Surge in elderly abuse and neglect claims

'I would worry if my family was taken to hospital at weekends': NHS boss admits he is concerned about staffing levels

How GPs are paid £50 bonus to put elderly on 'death lists'

Christian missionary, 49, died of heart failure and brain damage after waiting more than an HOUR for ambulance to arrive

'You condemned my sweetheart to death'

Doctors, nurses and managers to face five years in jail if they neglect patients

Dehydration and malnutrition led to 2,162 deaths in care since 2003

Jeremy Hunt says 32 hospitals are under investigation over links to claims of sexual abuse by presenter

Colchester hospital faces criminal investigation over waiting list figures

Brain haemorrhage patients face unnecessary delays, study finds

Four hospitals understaffed, says NHS watchdog

Royal College of Nursing claims that as many as one in six nursing posts at some NHS hospitals are lying vacant

Thousands of seriously ill NHS patients reportedly denied drugs

‘Postcode lottery’ denies patients access to treatment despite obesity crisis, surgeons warn

Midwives and patients warn of ‘devastating’ staff shortages

'He loved the NHS, but it let him down': Councillor, 78, died after waiting 15 months for triple bypass and a new heart valve

'Our son died because he dropped off the appointments list': Parent's heartbreak after crucial scan for boy, 3, was missed

Scandal-hit Mid-Staffs NHS Trust to be broken up after hundreds died as a result of appalling care

The hospital blunders that allowed a new mother to die

Heart failure cases do not get specialist care, doctors warn

Man mistakenly given vasectomy instead of minor procedure

Transplant patient wins payout over kidney from donor with cancer

Essex care home worker arrested on suspicion of assaulting elderly resident

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Victory for widow awarded £50,000 in damages after GP misdiagnosed her husband's deadly bowel cancer as PILES

NHS patients not treated fast enough, say MSPs

NHS patients in uproar over 'incompetent' drug delivery service

Cancer waiting time figures reveal first breach of target

Mother-of-five, 46, died from breast cancer after being misdiagnosed with TENNIS ELBOW for two years

'My baby died of whooping cough after doctors sent him home three times': Mother's devastation at death of baby boy

Breast cancer victims ‘left in needless pain’: Terminally ill failed by care system

The British mum killed by a 'drunk' doctor in C-section blunder: Devastated partner says he is 'going to let justice do its job'

Yet ANOTHER NHS horror story from Wales: Dying elderly cancer patient left 'screaming in pain' on a trolley in A&E for nine hours

Great-grandmother, 89, left lying on pavement in the rain for two hours because of 'high demand' for ambulances

Grandmother had six months of gruelling chemotherapy only to discover she NEVER had terminal liver cancer

Twinkle in my eye turned out to be cancer: When former Hull City chairman Paul Duffen had sparks in his vision, GPs diagnosed a sinus problem. The truth was more sinister...

Mother left brain damaged and needing 24-hour care after doctors missed signs of deadly infection wins six-figure payout

Mum called NHS 111 helpline 23 times before death

'Insufficient' Government funding threatens NHS's ability to provide universally safe maternity care, says MPs

Maisha Najeeb: Girl to receive multimillion-pound payout from hospital after accidental injection of glue into brain

More than 11,000 lives could have been saved if heart attack care in Britain matched that in Sweden

Waiting times at five-year high in British National Health Service

Are five-hour waits for ambulances the sad state of our healthcare system?

'Insufficient' Government funding threatens NHS's ability to provide universally safe maternity care, says MPs

Data reveals six NHS trusts with 'persistently' high death rates

Maisha Najeeb: Girl to receive multimillion-pound payout from hospital after accidental injection of glue into brain


More than 11,000 lives could have been saved if heart attack care in Britain matched that in Sweden

Thousands of seriously ill NHS patients reportedly denied drugs

Four and a half hour wait for ill 81-year-old

Pensioner with broken hip waited TWO HOURS for ambulance

Schoolboy with back pain left lying in field for TWO HOURS

Woman with serious illness told of EIGHT HOUR wait to see doctor

Concussed horse rider waited FOUR HOURS for ambulance

Crashed biker waits nearly 90 mins for ambulance

 

Canadians are like Italians in Northern Italy ... we tend to go to Switzerland [despite public Italian health assistance ...].

 

Who in America does not have access to health care?

 

So do you have waiting lists up there or not?

Your PDF was put together by Canada. Bias?

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Yes I snipped it because the dems want single payer which does mean we have politics in the mix. And since single payer offers nothing better than what we had before, why should we go there?

 

Before Obama Care............

"Uninsured" didn't mean can't get health care. The HRSA on-line finder has a low cost/no cost Federally funded Health clinics.

There are many State and County programs you can find on line as well.

Now when you take away all the people with access to these Health Care programs, how many actually had no access.

 

For the third time now, yes. But other then a few cases, they aren't causing a lot of deaths.

Uh....what? Put together by .. Canada?? You realize that the Institute you cited is also Canadian....right?

 

So your waiting lists aren't 'causing a lot of deaths'. My God.

I linked you to pages of sources to pick from.

 

Yes. A few. Sorry if that seems callous, but people die from neglect by health care systems world wide. It's not something to be proud of, to be sure, but it is the reality of the situation.

And if you had read both of your own sources, you would have seen they are both from the same place that has a well documented bias. I offered a competing source (from the same country of origin) and you have also accused it of bias, yet mine does not say one way or the other, as the information gathered is insufficient to make fully informed decisions. So I then ask you, from where do these sources get their info, and how reliable is it?

 

Your system is built to neglect. Who you kidding?

I gave you a link to pages of sources confirming what you already agreed with.

 

There is nothing "wrong" with people exercising free choice. If a Canadian wants to go to another country for health care, fine.

The issue is the hypocrisy of the people who claim national health care is great and the solution to everything. During the obamacare fiasco in 2009, they held up Canada and the UK as models for the USA ignoring (or ignorant of) the problems with those countries health care systems. The UK is a disaster. Canada is having trouble and its not getting better. People who are forced to pay for the govt system are not getting the care they need and if they can they are going outside of the UK and Canada for care.

 

Our system is built to reach as many people as possible, regardless of how much money they have. I'll take that over the US system (pre and post obamacare) any day.

You linked to a search of wait times, which we both have acknowledge exist. The original question was how many DIED due to these wait times.

 

Your system rations and tries all they can do to keep costs down like any govt agency.

The fact that you accept a govt system of HC that allows for deaths due to lack of resources says plenty.

 

Well if you have a system that reaches everyone, regardless of financial situation, with full resources to deal with everyone in a timely manner, then I'm all ears.

 

Yours doesn't. It kills people because the govt runs it. I'll take ours any day.

 

So I'll take that as a no, you dont' have a system that does so. Alright then.