German parliament declares Israel boycott campaign antisemitic

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...-declares-israel-boycott-campaign-antisemitic

Mandelus what do you have to say about this?!! Makes me wonder how much they were paid. There are Israelis who support BDS as the article shows and there are many many more Jews outside of Israel who are strongly active in it. They of course are all supposed to be antisemetic. People need to understand that action against Israel is Political. It is not antisemetic. To suggest it is antisemetic is to suggest all Jews agree with what Israel is doing. This is not true and to identify all Jews with the actions of Israel is widely accepted as being an antisemetic position. Arguably stuff like this is going to increase antisemitism.

 

I have to support it, because I call it the slippery road.
Even that I think that under the current government Israel has become the perpetrator.

In my opinion BDS will become, if not already, a base for antisemitism, which is growing.
Well, Israel helps with that, by its own actions. But than Palestinians are at fault, too. Nobody will boycott Palestinians for firing rockets, or suicide bombings.
Israel has lost it way in my eyes and feels like it is with its back to the wall.
But still, I have a strange feeling about this BDS and who is behind it and will not support it.

I am a German.

 

That ziege Merkel is still making a fool of Europe and tormenting the German population over guilt of Schicklgruber's madness.

I am waiting to see how long it will take for Angie to make it a criminal offense for Arab green-grocers who do not stock Jaffa oranges.

 

Were the partisans at fault too for sabotaging the occupying forces during WW II?

 

Who cares what Germany does?

We all know BDS isn't antisemitic; All BDS want is a boycott against Israel for violating Palestinian human rights.
Antisemitic is hate crimes against the Jewish population and then covering it up to the police; Momentum are antisemitic in London.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...embers-police-cps-investigation-a8843436.html

 

I know you are German and I do not agree with a word you say. Jewish People are also strongly involved in the Palestinian Solidarity Movement and they say that they work very hard to keep antisemitism out. I have also heard Max Blumenthal criticising Germany and suggesting its refusal to allow free speech on Israel coming more from it's nazi past which Israel is now more acting out and hence Germany approves of - obviously not all Germans.

BDS is political against Israel in exactly the same way as it was against Africa. Calling BDS antisemetic is saying that all Jews or all real Jews or all 'good' Jews support what Israel is doing and that more than any place is where I believe it will increase antisemitism. If people are being told all Jews stand for Israel then they will believe what the current extreme right/fascist Government is doing is stereotype thinking of Jews. Nothing could be further from the truth. Time and again I have read Jews mourning the lack of Jewish values in Israel.

Hence to believe BDS is antisemetic is to believe all Jews agree with what the Israeli Government is up to and hence is itself stereotyping all Jews and hence antisemetic. Further giving uneducated people the message that Israel's actions are stereotypic of all Jews and supported by all Jews makes people believe that antisemitism is things like not approving of a country stealing their homeland and resources in particular water while keeping them a prisoner for over 50 years - things no people would accept and that is just the beginning. Believing all Jews are of this mind will make people think 'if that is what antisemitism is, screw it, I am a proud antsemite' That is what one well know Jewish Journalist predicted would happen when we were just dealing with the new antisemitism several years ago.

In the 2014 war because of all the false accusations of antisemitism which were coming out, Britian's 'Jews for Justice for Palestinians' gave out papers to people on marches telling them exactly what was antisemitism and what was not. They have also worked with Muslims in the UK and discovered that once they actually met a Jew and discover that some of them are very critical of Israel and when they hear that these people lost family and friends in the holocaust, they no longer have problems believing it happened. JFJFP said they were far more supportive of them during 2014 than any British Mainstream Jewish group and that they were all keen to learn what antisemitism was so that they could avoid it.

In a study done a year or two ago around 40% of British Jews under 35 believed in some kind of sanctions against Israel. To you they are all antisemites.

 

No, to me they are not all anti-Semites and in this case it is completely unimportant what folks in the UK think.
It is about a vote in the German parliament, with which I agree.

 

In prohibiting an individual's right to participate in BDS, the current German government is only enabling the world's oldest & most murderous, foreign funded Occupation in history & ethnic cleansing agenda.

Would you have supported the earlier boycott of apartheid South Africa?

 

There is the same thing in France, a guy launched a ban against Israel after a heavy israelian operation in 2008, they were sentenced. Since then, even if I don't have much more sympathies for palestinian than israelian, I stopped to buy israelian products.
I think it's a personnal liberty to buy or not israelian products or whatever nationality. It's even more hypocrital since the government force us to not consume russian products even if we don't have any hostile feelings toward russian.

Anyway, both jews and muslim activists are causing trouble to the peace by trying to export their war world wide.

 

You are speaking double dutch. First you believe that people who believe in BDS are antisemetic. Now you are saying not all Jews who believe in BDS are antisemetic. Would you like to tell me what makes you or your Parliament make you believe you have the right to tell Jews what is antisemitism. Your Government called Max Blumenthal and David Sheen I think it was antisemites for going into Gaza and reporting on what happened there in 2014.

If you decide that supporting BDS is antisemetic, you cannot then claim some of the people who do so are and some are not. Your Government which you support in this has decided they all are. What you are supporting is that they all are. You are supporting the harming possibly imprisonment of people for support of the Palestinians to get some rights and justice after over 50 years without.

I see when your country is criticised you run and hide and do not want to hear what other people have to say. I do not notice you keeping quiet about what the UK does. Of course it is important what Germany in the heart of Europe does. You chose to give your opinion. Now you are trying to run away because it has been answered.

If you agree then you are being dishonest when you say that you do not believe all the 40% of British Jews under 35 who support some form of sanction against Israel are antisemetic. One thing or the other and do not come on a Political Forum and answer posts if you believe your country is so precious it need answer to no one.

 

It is a massive attack on the right of political freedom. I know France has this problem as well. For some time your courts kept people's rights to political freedom but I think it was your supreme court or something which eventually gave way.

To date English Courts have refused to allow anyone to be found committing a crime concerning things like supporting BDS or Universities being very critical of Israel. They have given up trying to use our courts but it goes on. The assault on Corbyn and the lies spread against him is just one aspect of it. He was forced...not a free choice as it should be in a democracy but forced to bring in the IHRA with all its caveats which basically make criticism of Israel antisemitism, though I believe they think they have put something in there to allow it but what the Tories and the Labour Right, both strong in Friends of Israel an organisation run from the Israeli Embassy, are doing is finding anything, absolutely anything,even making it up, by releasing to the public information which has been altered - that is video and sound which has been cut and fixed to give a different position to the one which was being given Giving an antisemetic position where none was there. Anyone who has ever said boo is now a Nazi antisemite. By the way when I speak of Corbyn being forced to accept the full IHRA a couple of extra things to add. It was the Tories who were accusing him of being antisemetic if he did not. May also wrongly told all our councils that by law they had to accept the IHRA ...and wait for it the Tory Party have not accepted it. This IHRA is widely spoken of as the world wide standard for antisemitism but I think only 31 countries or possibly 31 countries and organisations have accepted it. The man who wrote it has said he is disgusted at how it has been used to stop freedom of political thought/expression and Labour (Corbyn) had 40 Jewish groups supporting him not to sign the 4 examples which do not allow criticism of Israel.

I am glad you put your opinion in on this despite not having a position on the Israel/Palestine issue because this is about far more than that. It is about political freedom and that is why to date the English courts have not found anyone guilty of a supposed crime concerning this. They say we are a democracy and in a democracy people are free to choose their political beliefs.

 

I repeat myself, it is completely unimportant what people on Your Island think, or do, or not do.
The German Parliament voted based on the historical experience of Germany and naturally on the questionable background of the organizers of this campaign.
It is not a vote, which endorses what Israel is doing

 

Re:

How much longer do you think that today's Germans will be required by their influential Zionist activists to act based on the "historical experience of Germany"?

In the 1930s, Germany's government worked with the German Zionist Federation to train Jews for life in Palestine & establish a Zionist Colony in Palestine via the Haavara Agreement.

Later, in the 1950s, Germany built virtually all of Israel's initial infrastructure(1) including power plants, the grid work, highways, railroads and the trains to go on them, steel mills, 60+ ships and provided Israel with extensive weaponry.

All of this is in addition to countless $ Billions in incessant reparations over recent decades however the demands for more money never stop & never will.

For example, do you think that based on the "historical experience of Germany", do you think that Germany is also responsible for this recent shakedown:

"Holocaust Survivors' Children Sue Germany for Therapy Fees"
https://www.haaretz.com/1.4952800

EXCERPT "Suit, filed in Tel Aviv, seeks funds to pay for biweekly therapy sessions for up to 20,000 affected by the scars of their parents.

The lawsuit marks the very first time that the German government will be asked to take responsibility and to care for those of the second generation in Israel and indeed, worldwide, attorney Gideon Fisher said before filing the suit at the Tel Aviv District Court."CONTINUED

Meanwhile, Israel's right wing government continues its foreign subsidized war Crimes, land theft, & ethnic cleansing.

(1) “Inside the Germany/Israel Relationship”
http://www.momentmag.com/inside-germ...-relationship/

EXCERPTS “Federal Republic of Germany laid the groundwork for Israel’s infrastructure—including roads, railways and shipping—while simultaneously rebuilding West German industry.

In addition to money, Israel also needed weapons. As early as 1954, German reparation funds were secretly being used to buy patrol boats, tanks and arms. Germany itself supplied Israel with weapons through a variety of back channels. Many details remain untold, but a 2006 U.S. Congressional Research Service report concluded that German-supplied arms “played a considerable role” in building up Israeli military might in the wars of 1967, 1973 and 1982."CONTINUED

 

Apple and Oranges.

Germany has, because of its history, a responsibility to fight or take a stance against what ever, that has the smell of antisemetism.

It has nothing to do with reparations or any other help Germany has given Israel.

"Holocaust Survivors' Children Sue Germany for Therapy Fees". I disagree, that Germany has still a guilt or should continue to pay any kind of reparations, be it to Jews, or countries like Greece or Poland or who ever.
It is absolutely incorrect to hold generation after generation responsible for what their forefathers have done.

But all that, will not release Germany from its duty and responsibility to fight anything, or take a stance against anything, that has the smell of antisemitism.

 

Why? Are we to blame every single generation for the faults of their predecessors....that's a very weak argument.

 

I don't see where this is a case of comparing "apples to oranges" because there is absolutely nothing anti semitic about protesting the well documented criminal actions of a foreign government.

Germany's influential Zionist apologists for continued Israeli ethnic cleansing and land theft try to conflate anything critical of Israel's destructive right wing government with "anti Semitism" simply to silence critics with the former "Epithet of Mass Destruction" and perpetuate the status quo which is good for neither Israel nor the Palestinians.
Nearly half of Israeli Jews support ethnic cleansing(1) and the cold blooded killers in the IDF(2), (3) are happy to accommodate them.

While America's complicity in Israeli government aggression, ethnic cleansing & land theft is much worse, Germany will not expunge its past crimes by aiding and abetting in Israel's similar crimes of today.




(1) “Nearly half of Israeli Jews believe in ethnic cleansing, survey finds”
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...nians-wake-up-call-survey-finds-a6919271.html


(2) "The Israel Massacre Forces"
https://www.haaretz.com/opinion/.premium-the-israel-massacre-forces-1.5962852

EXCERPT "The shooting on the Gaza border shows once again that the killing of Palestinians is accepted in Israel more lightly than the killing of mosquitoes"CONTINUED


(3) "Independent investigation details Israel’s deliberate targeting of civilians in Gaza"
http://mondoweiss.net/2015/01/independent-investigation-deliberate/

 

As I said, it is wrong to blame generation after generation after generation for the faults and crimes of its ancestors.
But never the less, history can put a duty and responsibility on a country and its people, so that history does not repeat itself.

 

Apples and oranges.
It is whom you support, BDS, as I explained, has the smell of antisemitism and in my opinion the Bundestag rightfully pointed that out.
It has nothing to do with Israel
Israel's actions against Palestinians, have been very clearly criticized in the Bundestag and by the German government, with which I fully agree, too.
Israel, by its actions, has lost the moral high ground over a decade ago.

As you know I do not value your opinion, because of the stench of antisemitism.

 

You clearly do not believe in freedom of speech at all. Why are you on a political forum when you do not believe people have the right to speak on political issues in another country - and an American one as well. What right do you have to be on an American forum when you believe no one has a right to speak about the actions of Germany.

 

This however does not. What you are supporting is a country with the mentality from which antisemitism emanated - extreme ethnic nationalism. This has nothing to do with hating Jews. That is the cover you are using so that you can support extreme ethnic nationalism by Israel against another people - something which many Jews are absolutely opposed to resulting in your stance calling them antisemetic because of their political and moral stance against this treatment of people of a different ethnicity. You are abusing Jews because of your desire to call people who do not believe in ethnic nationalism antisemetic.

Nothing to do with antisemitism. Just a little excuse for Germany once again supporting extreme ethnic nationalism which is again destroying another people and an attempt to imprison or destroy people who do not think the same as yourself. Everything to do with supporting the political views of Nazi Germany in supporting extreme ethnic nationalism and the attempt to ethnically cleanse those of a different ethnicity to those of the Zionists who as Grau correctly said Nazis had approved of and Germany has since.

I can see why Blair first approached Germany in order to get Europe to stop from working as it was morally obliged to, to implement the two stage solution.

http://www.politicalforum.com/index...-years-of-1980s.555700/page-8#post-1070577613

 

two State solution obviously at the end in the above post.

 

Isn't that the purpose of the EU or NATO or UN or the German People?

 

You quoted some poll data from the UK, which is absolutely unimportant concerning a vote in the Bundestag and the rest is just BS.

 

You should educate yourself about the folks behind BDS and the ties they have and were the money comes from.