About the Holocaust

Discussion in 'Middle East' started by stan1990, Mar 11, 2019.

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Do you agree with the thoughts expressed in this thread?

Poll closed Apr 10, 2019.
  1. Yes

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  2. No

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  3. Maybe

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  1. Jazz

    Jazz Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Good news for holocaust survivors:

    German Government to Quadruple Payments to 'Holocaust' Survivors

    There are some 200,000 Holocaust survivors living in Israel. Tragically, around 50,000 of them live around or below the poverty line.
    Aviva Silberman, welcomed the agreement.

    “Finally they raised the compensation level for Holocaust survivors,” she said, explaining that the compensation law (Bundesentschädigungsgesetz) hadn’t been updated since the 1960s.
    The lengthy negotiation between the authorities resulted in the signing of a memorandum of understanding, according to which survivors will receive an additional €100-€400 per month. This increase will raise total funds that Germany pays them each year to €15 million.

    Survivors from North Africa, for example, who suffered from the Holocaust but were not directly swept up in it, do not receive compensation from Germany. The same goes for emigrants from the former Soviet Union and survivors who did not undergo forced labor.

    “It is the role of the Germans to take care of these populations as well,” Silberman added. “It’s not Israelis who are responsible for the Holocaust. It’s not you and me who have to pay survivors from our taxes.

    “While the government does need to take care of these additional populations, it also needs to come from Germany,” she said, adding that “I think they should continue to negotiate with the Germans as successfully as they did now, so that they recognize these populations as well.”

    Read full report here:
    https://russia-insider.com/en/germa..._21_2014)&mc_cid=ed0b3f2a85&mc_eid=b58c3b6d47
    ----
    I agree, the Germans should pay while they can. Less money for weapons to fight illegal wars for the US is a good thing.
     
  2. Jazz

    Jazz Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    No, I changed my mind! More money for Israel is not a good thing. Israel is a rogue terror state!

    Latest Unprovoked Israeli Attack on Syrian Civilians...

    Israeli jets stealthily approached Syria via Lebanese air space and rained missiles at multiple targets in the suburbs of Damascus and Homs in Syria!
    Sixteen people, including a baby, were killed and 21 others suffered injuries, including a month-old baby girl, who suffered burns and facial wounds.


    The missile attack constituted the violation of national sovereignty and territorial integrity of two UN member states — Lebanon and Syria.

    Israel committed a war crime by killing innocent unarmed civilians.

    Read more here:
    https://russia-insider.com/en/lates...k-syrian-civilians-was-message-russia/ri27388
    ---------
    A few years ago I read the book
    [​IMG]
    "The eleventh Command: Israel is allowed to do anything."
    Almost daily Israel demonstrates just that, and the world keeps quiet.
     
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  3. Mr_Truth

    Mr_Truth Well-Known Member

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    Bolsheviks - financed by Wall Street Republicans as I have proven many times on this forum.
     
  4. alexa

    alexa Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    and how often do we hear bout this in our news in Canada, the US or the UK, pretty much never it is such a common and accepted by Government occurrence but Iran shooting down a drone in it's own air space - top of the front page!
     
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  5. RoccoR

    RoccoR Active Member Past Donor

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    RE: About the Holocaust
    ⁜→ alexa, et al,

    Yes, you have a good observation here and an excellent follow-on question.

    (COMMENT)

    IMO, while there is a whole host of thing in play here, the two most aspects that influence the repetitious military news are:

    ◈ The lack of other more energetic new events for the DoD Press Office to release. When you have nothing new to report, but must publish something, you have to highlight something trivial to make it look like they are doing something.

    ◈ Some news articles are similar if not the same as previous articles to make it look like, a couple years down the road (on a reflection backwards in time), a history of past criminal behaviors. Should it become necessary to provide justication for possible future actions.​

    When the DoD talks about the "environmental considerations" — they are not talking about the weather. It is a spectrum of media outlets, capacity to access news events or
    that may affect the planning and execution of present and future military operations.

    While media management and public affairs are no outlets or platforms for misinformation and disinformation (ie propaganda roles), they are often used to counter propaganda through the release of true information that negates or mitigates hostile propaganda efforts. But the DoD agencies that manage media development "will only release truthful information."

    Inferences are another matter. What is released is 100% true. The inferences drawn made lead to a different conclusion. In the case of the drone events, suspicious minds may conclude that the event:

    ◈ Could have been a test on the dectection or interception of the entity under surveillance.

    ◈ Could have been to mislead the aggressor into thinking their air defense capability is better than it really is.

    ◈ Could be that the surveillance device was sacrificed in a deception operation (less capable than what it is).​

    There are simply a dozen reasons for a release of information; none of which are to bore you. In fact, some news releases are not even targeting a friendly audience.

    Most Respectfully,
    R
     
  6. undertheradar

    undertheradar Newly Registered

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    In 1099, the Crusaders conquered Jerusalem and massacred its Muslim and Jewish inhabitants indiscriminately, in the name of the gentle Jesus. At that time, 400 years into the occupation of Palestine by the Muslims, Christians were still the majority in the country. Throughout this long period, no effort was made to impose Islam on them. Only after the expulsion of the Crusaders from the country, did the majority of the inhabitants start to adopt the Arabic language and the Muslim faith - and they were the forefathers of most of today's Palestinians.

    THERE IS no evidence whatsoever of any attempt to impose Islam on the Jews. As is well known, under Muslim rule the Jews of Spain enjoyed a bloom the like of which the Jews did not enjoy anywhere else until almost our time. Poets like Yehuda Halevy wrote in Arabic, as did the great Maimonides. In Muslim Spain, Jews were ministers, poets, scientists. In Muslim Toledo, Christian, Jewish and Muslim scholars worked together and translated the ancient Greek philosophical and scientific texts. That was, indeed, the Golden Age. How would this have been possible, had the Prophet decreed the "spreading of the faith by the sword"?

    What happened afterwards is even more telling. When the Catholics re-conquered Spain from the Muslims, they instituted a reign of religious terror. The Jews and the Muslims were presented with a cruel choice: to become Christians, to be massacred or to leave. And where did the hundreds of thousand of Jews, who refused to abandon their faith, escape? Almost all of them were received with open arms in the Muslim countries. The Sephardi ("Spanish") Jews settled all over the Muslim world, from Morocco in the west to Iraq in the east, from Bulgaria (then part of the Ottoman Empire) in the north to Sudan in the south. Nowhere were they persecuted. They knew nothing like the tortures of the Inquisition, the flames of the auto-da-fe, the pogroms, the terrible mass-expulsions that took place in almost all Christian countries, up to the Holocaust.

    WHY? Because Islam expressly prohibited any persecution of the "peoples of the book". In Islamic society, a special place was reserved for Jews and Christians. They did not enjoy completely equal rights, but almost. They had to pay a special poll-tax, but were exempted from military service - a trade-off that was quite welcome to many Jews. It has been said that Muslim rulers frowned upon any attempt to convert Jews to Islam even by gentle persuasion - because it entailed the loss of taxes.

    Every honest Jew who knows the history of his people cannot but feel a deep sense of gratitude to Islam, which has protected the Jews for fifty generations, while the Christian world persecuted the Jews and tried many times "by the sword" to get them to abandon their faith.


    Muhammad's Sword ~ Uri Avnery, author, former Israeli politician and founder of the Gush peace movement.

    http://zope.gush-shalom.org/home/en/channels/avnery/1159094813/
     
  7. yasureoktoo

    yasureoktoo Banned

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    You are not being entirely honest here.
    The muslims were always ordered to kill the Jews, for 1400 years, by their God, and did quite regularly with few exceptions.
    Spain being one.
    The Jews and Muslims sided together for military protection from the Catholics.
    During this time the Muslims actually actually learned things, or at least claimed they did.
    The Jews were learned people and living with them in peace, probably had an effect on them.

    Before and after that, the muslims gathered info, inventions, etc. from the people they conquered and claimed it was their own.
     
    Last edited: Aug 1, 2019
  8. undertheradar

    undertheradar Newly Registered

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    By linking to my source I am being completely honest.

    Source?

    Learned things? More like invented things:

    From coffee to cheques and the three-course meal, the Muslim world has given us many innovations that we take for granted in daily life.

    The ancient Greeks thought our eyes emitted rays, like a laser, which enabled us to see. The first person to realise that light enters the eye, rather than leaving it, was the 10th-century Muslim mathematician, astronomer and physicist Ibn al-Haitham.

    A thousand years before the Wright brothers a Muslim poet, astronomer, musician and engineer named Abbas ibn Firnas made several attempts to construct a flying machine.

    The crank-shaft, one of the most important mechanical inventions in the history of humankind, was created by an ingenious Muslim engineer called al-Jazari to raise water for irrigation.

    Many modern surgical instruments are of exactly the same design as those devised in the 10th century by a Muslim surgeon called al-Zahrawi.

    The windmill was invented in 634 for a Persian caliph and was used to grind corn and draw up water for irrigation.

    The technique of inoculation was not invented by Jenner and Pasteur but was devised in the Muslim world and brought to Europe from Turkey by the wife of the English ambassador to Istanbul in 1724.

    The system of numbering in use all round the world is probably Indian in origin but the style of the numerals is Arabic and first appears in print in the work of the Muslim mathematicians al-Khwarizmi and al-Kindi around 825. Algebra was named after al-Khwarizmi's book, Al-Jabr wa-al-Muqabilah, much of whose contents are still in use.

    By the 9th century, many Muslim scholars took it for granted that the Earth was a sphere.

    The list goes on:

    How Islamic inventors changed the world

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/how-islamic-inventors-changed-the-world-6106905.html

    Can you give some examples of this learning, other than religious/philosophical or in the field of medicine?

    Can you give some examples which better or at least equal that of the Islamic inventors and scholars above?
     
  9. yasureoktoo

    yasureoktoo Banned

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    NO, Linking to the source does not make you honest.
    It just shows you where you got your information.
    The source for Muslims killing jews in in the Qur'an and sunnah.
    Invented things is a joke.
    There is a site, even a book, ( Might be taken down by now) 1001 inventions by Muslims, unfortunately everything can be traced to earlier sources.
    Arabic numerals are not Arabic.
    al-Zahrawi was mistakenly called the father of modern surgery and has books with drawings of tools he invented.
    Unfortunately more modern examples were uncovered from Pompei, buried 1000 years earlier.

    No. Muslims gathered info from the places they conquered, and claimed it for themselves.

    The book and info, you are reading is 100% bullshit, I have seen this before, and muslims don't even use it to argue anymore.


    Yes, there were some inventions from Muslims, but so few, they aren't worth mentioning.

    about 10 years ago when muslims were being put on a spot to explain their sicko religion, the market was flooded with these bullshit books of what they supposedly did. All have been proven wrong, wrong, wrong.
    I am surprised someone still brings them up, even Muslims don't anymore,
    it seems you are a little behind the times.

    If you wish to argue, bring up one or two examples at a time and we can look them up
     
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2019
  10. yasureoktoo

    yasureoktoo Banned

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    I lost part of my rebuttal.

    anyways there is a site, (might be down by now), even a book, 1001 inventions by Islam.
    All, with few exceptions, are proven bullsh-t.
    The inventions came from somewhere else.

    No, Muslims contributed virtually nothing to society, then and now.

    A modern example is look at the Nobel prizes.
    Muslims, 1/5th of the world population;
    So far nine Muslims have won the Nobel Prizes and this is a dismal record for a population of 1.4 billion Muslims in the world.

    Jews have been awarded 25% of all Nobel Prizes and 28% of those in the scientific research fields.

    Not bad for .02 percent of the world population.
     
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2019
  11. undertheradar

    undertheradar Newly Registered

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    So call a spade a spade and just say Mr.Averny is dishonest.

    So quote the verses. But so what? There are many versus in the Old Testament that call for the killing of non-Jews. Or are you saying the killing of Jews is a worse offense than the killing of non-Jews?


    Look at the second example I gave: Ibn al-Haytham. Wikipedia says, 'Ibn al-Haytham was the first to explain that vision occurs when light reflects from an object and then passes to one's eyes.' [23]


    Looking at that footnote we see it references: Adamson, Peter (7 July 2016). Philosophy in the Islamic World: A History of Philosophy Without Any Gaps. Oxford University Press. p. 77.


    Wikipedia continues, 'And he was the first to point out that vision occurs in the brain, rather than in the eyes.'[24]


    That one references: Baker, David B. (2012). The Oxford Handbook of the History of Psychology: Global Perspectives. Oxford University Press, USA, p. 445

    A search on those two titles shows both those books are available in ebook form and hard copy.

    You may wish to believe the Oxford University Press publishes falsehoods but you'll have a hard time convincing others of that.

    The second one, 'Muslim poet, astronomer, musician and engineer named Abbas ibn Firnas made several attempts to construct a flying machine' - about that Wikipedia refernces, John H. Lienhard (2004). "'Abbas Ibn Firnas". The Engines of Our Ingenuity. Episode 1910. NPR. KUHF-FM Houston.

    Do you want to examine the others as well?

    Their religion is no sicker than the one you appear to be defending. That one is the most hate-filled and racist one around. If you don't believe me just pick up a copy of the Old Testament and do a little reading. There are numerous verses there inciting genocide.

    Where have they been proven wrong? The Oxford University Press certainly doesn't seem to think so.
     
  12. undertheradar

    undertheradar Newly Registered

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    The awarding of Nobel prizes is a complete farce. That Bob Dylan can be awarded the prize for literature yet literary giants like James Joyce and Leo Tolstoy get ignored smacks of nepotism and favoritism.

    And war criminals like Henry Kissinger receive the peace prize. What a disgrace.

    Besides, where were all the Jewish scientists, inventors, artists, etc a few hundred years ago when all the discoveries and inventions that fuelled the industrial revolution were happening?
     
  13. CCitizen

    CCitizen Well-Known Member

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    I disagree 100%.

    I agree 100%. Jews made great contributions to World Culture. Jewish medical discoveries saved billions of lives. Here.
     
  14. Jazz

    Jazz Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    No, not bad at all! These 0.02 % also murdered 66 Million In Russia, including the Tsar family.
    https://rense.com/general77/bols.htm
     
  15. CCitizen

    CCitizen Well-Known Member

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    That is absolute nonsense. By the time USSR became Totalitarian, Jews were driven out of power.

    Under Stalin's Rule, about 800,000 people were executed, 1.4 million died in camps, and a million died in exile. Definitely Joseph Stalin had great sins.

    Joseph Stalin also had great virtue -- he played the greatest role of all mortals in saving Humankind from Nazis. He built USSR into a Superpower.

    Most Old Testament kings had great sins and great virtues.
     
  16. CCitizen

    CCitizen Well-Known Member

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    Along with 6 Million Jews, 4 Million Soviet POWs and 11 Million other civilians were murdered by Nazis. Nazis were orders of magnitude worse then Communists.
     
  17. Jazz

    Jazz Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    That is truly shocking news!!
     
  18. Scott

    Scott Well-Known Member

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  19. CCitizen

    CCitizen Well-Known Member

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    Holocaust had no historical parallels. Nazis did also kill 15 million other civilians and POWs. Nazis were orders of magnitude worse then Communists.
     
  20. Margot2

    Margot2 Banned

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    Never heard of this guy before.

    Genrikh Yagoda | HolodomorInfo.com
    https://holodomorinfo.com/glossery/jewish-bolshevik-murderers/genrikh-yagoda
    Genrikh
    Grigoryevich Yagoda born Yenokh Gershevich Iyeguda (7 November 1891–15 March 1938) into a Jewish family in Rybinsk. He joined the Bolsheviks in 1907 and was a director of the NKVD, and intelligence agency. Responsible for the deaths of at least 10 million people, as head Yagoda’s black vans went out every night in St.…
     
  21. bigfella

    bigfella Well-Known Member

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    No, they weren't. The Nazis killed a lot of people in a relatively short time. More than Stalin and likely more than the USSR as a whole (the figures you gave in another post are laughably low BTW). However, Mao racked up a truly massive body count, and Pol Pot was responsible for the death of over 25% of Cambodians in 4 years.

    Does that somehow make the Nazis less evil? Not remotely. At a certain scale the evil is just so big that trying to decide which evil is more evil than another evil is basically pointless. Unfortunately there are some people who, for political, ideological, nationalist or racial reasons (or a combination) try to minimise the evil of particular regimes. This thread & a few others on this forum are a monument to the damage that does to a person't mind and their soul. Not a path to walk down.
     
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  22. An Taibhse

    An Taibhse Well-Known Member

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    Some people have open minds... the kind that are receptacles for any refuse tossed their way.
     
  23. Jacob E Mack

    Jacob E Mack Well-Known Member

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    This is 100% false; gas chambers were found and photographed; survivors spoke on what they saw too.
     
  24. Grau

    Grau Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Firstly, I'd like to welcome you to this forum even though we obviously differ on this particular topic. I feel that it is entirely possible to differ on issues and do so calmly, civilly & respectfully.

    I've lived, studied and worked in Europe where I had the opportunity to meet at least a dozen holocaust survivors. Like the post war Red Cross interviews(1) with thousands of former work camp inmates, not one of them saw or had any experiences with homicidal gas chambers.
    The only form of "gas chambers" at the German run camps were delousing chambers used to kill typhus bearing lice in old clothes, blankets, mattresses etc.
    I have already written extensively on this topic in related threads where you are welcome to review the evidence I have already submitted.
    http://www.politicalforum.com/index.php?threads/about-the-holocaust.552312/page-20

    For the last few days, I have been discussing this topic on the following thread:
    http://www.politicalforum.com/index.php?threads/9-11-truthers-holocaust-deniers.474495/page-13

    I am currently waiting for someone among those who believe the standard holocaust narrative (holocaustians) to answer the following 3 simple questions. So far, the holocaustians at this forum have only responded with evasions, character slurs and specious, unsupported claims.

    Those 3 questions were/are:


    1. Where are homicidal gas chambers and the auxiliary rooms with extensive fans & ventilation systems that were needed to heat the Zyklon B to a gaseous state and then introduce the gas into the gas chamber and, later, exhaust the deadly gas from the room so that the bodies could be cleared?


    2. Do you believe that the morgue at Auschwitz that is falsely labeled as a "gas chamber" is genuine or simply a fake used to deceive gullible & poorly informed individuals?


    3. Why are there no reports of seeing cherry red skin by any of the survivors? (2), (3), (4), (5), (6)

    Finally, you may not be aware that the vast majority of the world does not believe the standard holocaust narrative(7) as promoted by the fraudulent Holocaust Industry(8).


    (1)“The Problems of Mass Gassing”
    http://truedemocracyparty.net/2012/05/was-there-really-a-judaic-holocaust/

    EXCERPT "The Vatican and Red Cross interviewed thousands of freed camp inmates at the end of the War about alleged gas chambers. The response was always the same, "The detainees themselves have not spoken of them" (Red Cross document No. 9925, June 1946)." CONTINUED


    (2)"Johns Hopkins"
    http://www.centerforhealthsecurity.org/our-work/publications/cyanide-fact-sheet
    Signs and Symptoms

    EXCERPT "Other: acute lung injury, nausea and vomiting, cherry-red skin color."CONTINUED


    (3) "Cyanide Toxicity"
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK507796/

    EXCERPT "Patients with cyanide poisoning will not be cyanotic but will have a cherry red color due to excess oxygen in the bloodstream."CONTINUED


    (4) "Cyanide Poisoning Treatment, Symptoms & Effects - eMedicineHealth"
    https://www.emedicinehealth.com/cyanide_poisoning/article_em.htm


    1. EXCERPT "The skin of a cyanide-poisoned person can sometimes be unusually pink or cherry-red because oxygen will stay in the blood and not get into the cells."CONTINUED

    (5) "Cyanide poisoning"
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyanide_poisoning

    EXCERPT "A cherry red skin color that changes to dark may be present"CONTINUED


    (6) "Cyanide toxicity: Dx
    https://www.openanesthesia.org/cyanide_toxicity_dx/

    EXCERPT "…cherry-red skin, bright red retinal arteries and veins,"CONTINUED


    (7)”THE WORLD IS FULL OF HOLOCAUST DENIERS”
    https://www.theatlantic.com/interna...he-world-is-full-of-holocaust-deniers/370870/

    EXCERPT “Only 54 percent of the world's population has heard of the Holocaust.

    This is the most staggering statistic in a new survey by the Anti-Defamation League (ADL) of more than 53,000 people in over 100 countries, conducted by First International Resources.

    Only a third of the world's population believe the genocide has been accurately described in historical accounts.

    Some said they thought the number of people who died has been exaggerated; others said they believe it's a myth.

    Thirty percent of respondents said it's probably true that "Jews still talk too much about what happened to them in the Holocaust."

    - Hindus were most likely to believe that the number of Holocaust deaths has been exaggerated.

    - people younger than 65 were much more likely to say they believe that facts about the Holocaust have been distorted”CONTINUED


    (8) "HOLOCAUST CLAIMS CONFERENCE FRAUD LIKELY ‘MUCH HIGHER’ THAN $57 MILLION"
    http://www.jpost.com/Diaspora/Holoc...aud-likely-much-higher-than-57-million-408298

    EXCERPT "Writing to the Claims Conference’s board last week, recently terminated ombudsman Shmuel Hollander asserted that, while reports had said organizational insiders had siphoned off $57 million in German taxpayer funds meant for survivors, “the final sum is in all probability much higher.”CONTINUED
     
  25. CCitizen

    CCitizen Well-Known Member

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    Nazi Ideology was built on the plan of extermination of all minorities. Jews were the first priority, thus Six Million Jews were killed. But 14 Million other POWs/civilians were also killed.

    Communist Ideology was built on bringing Well-Being and Positive Rights to all Humans. Unfortunately, Communists did not care if many people were hurt in the process. Thus, 3.2 Million people died as a result of Joseph Stalin's penal policy.

    Nazism was much more evil then Communism, but Communism also had enormous excesses.
     

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