Gun Laws sure do work! 67 people shot in NYC over weekend.

Doesnt change a thing that this crime is only possible because its very easy to get firearms.

And again, I dont want to ban the sale of firearms.

Wether the gun they use in crime is bought by the criminal legaly or illegaly or stolen from someone who has it legally doesnt matter , after all they are criminals, yet the ease at wich they can obtain firearms as largely thx to the easy firarms laws and the plenty of legal guns avaible.

You can keep ignoring that and make up excuses but that fact isnt going to go away or change.

Of course, thx to the ease of legally purchasing weapons.

And another thing you seem to have no clue about . LOL

 

what do you mean SO? look at you, runnin all over the place instead of sticking to the city of origin. once again you cant lump everything together, each city has its own laws and stats.

lol i love how you ignore everything that goes against your liberal bible lol. LOOK DOWN vvvv!!!!!

here is that whole quote you snipped and obviously misread big time.

"In 2008, even as gun killings fell, the number of killings committed with knives or other “cutting instruments” rose 50 percent in New York City, the Police Department said: to 125 from 83. Some other large cities saw no such increase last year, and police officials and experts are at a loss to explain what is either a new trend or a spike."

so obviously that means other large cities DIDNT see the same spike in knife homicides that NYC did. reading comprehension much?

my source goes along much better with my debate than yours. you try to change the meaning of every source you use and even use incorrect terms to describe whats really going on. you try to say its law abiding citizens giving criminals guns, which is way false. you try to say knife homicides in NYC are ok when they rose 50% after NYC made it harder to obtain guns.

dude, you are loopy lol.

no this is more about government and the way they run things. it could be so easy to make harsher punishments with no BS when talking about gun crimes or any violent crimes of any sort. but they dont, government thrives off of crime, they make their money in the court system. it could be very easy to legislate laws where it would be a hell of alot harder, much less alot scarier, to own a gun illegally. but they dont do it because its too big of a business and brings in too much money. less guns crimes, less money made through the court system.

just like drugs dude, if they made just marijuana legal do you get how much money the court systems would lose? its simple government, its greed.

apparently it did since you got some snippets from it eh? i looked back and checked the source to see if i may have accidentally posted it but it was fine until you replied to it and i saw that it had changed in your response. slick but im not gonna miss things that easily.

 

all you need to do is slice and dice and its pretty easy to make someone bleed it out real good. you obviously never tried to take a knife from somebody who is more than willing to use it, you are gonna get cut up most of the time. you would be surprised how simple it is to just cut once and make the person go down and then keep on slicing. just saying dude.

it is much easier to have a blade and cut up close that it is to hit a moving target 20 or 30ft away if you dont really know how to shoot. its easy to pull a trigger, yes, but there are a good bit more things than just the trigger. have you ever used a gun?

they carry knives, big ones acually for CQC, and in a trained soldiers hands its just as lethal as any gun. (*)(*)(*)(*) dude a soldiers bare hands are lethal weapons. you are going apples to oranges here dude, there is a big difference between a civilian with a weapon and a soldier who is trained daily in the art of killing.

never said i did and that wasnt my question. i asked if you ever been into a fight with a person using a knife against you. you see i have been considering my weekend night job has alot of (*)(*)(*)(*)(*)(*)(*)s come around. ive also been shot at from around 20 ft away, but guess what, the (*)(*)(*)(*)(*)(*)(*) didnt know how to shoot his gun so i didnt get hit. but the guy with the knife cut my hand and both my arms up pretty good before he was subdued. its easier for a person with a knife to do damage than it is for the idiot with no gun training to pull a trigger and kill you. either way both are dangerous, but both situations are equally as lethal.

i suggest you understand what you are talking about before you think you know something. been there, seen it and done it. why dont you go check it out then come back to me.

 

both are just as lethal in reality dude. but if you are gonna kill someone you are gonna try and stay as far away from the person as possible, not try and get close. and if a gun can be gotten why waste time with a knife? this is not a question of which is more deadly, they are both lethal weapons, this is just a question of a kill and a quick get away and its not as messy i.e. getting your victims blood all over you than can be used as evidence.

 

so you make harsher laws against those obtaining a gun illegally. its rather easy, just make illegally possessing a firearm an automatic 5 year prison sentence coupled with a $20,000 fine and actually make them pay it. make it so rough that the government can take $20000 of their belongings to do it. with the thought of possible bankruptcy, losing your car,home,etc. etc. etc. criminals will be less inclined to try and own a gun through illegal actions.

if we actually made it to where you truly got punished for a crime instead of the bull(*)(*)(*)(*) court system just giving you a smack on the hand people would truly be affraid to break the law.

im not ignoring that, and i pretty much agree. im just saying i hope you are for punishing the people doing things illegally, not the ones who are following the law.

make punishments harsher.

you got the Spaniards and the French, enough said.

 

Complete and utter BS. That is ignoring reality:
"The so-called "iron pipeline" - the route traffickers use to smuggle guns into the city from southern states - was still bustling however. About 87% of guns seized in the city were traced to other states, Sullivan said."

http://articles.nydailynews.com/200...guns-gun-trafficking-operations-iron-pipeline

I cant believe anyone can be that stupid to not think criminals would just ship them from states where it legal, so you must do this on purpose.

Hey that was your source

And I didnt snip anything that was the ful quote a couple of lines UNDER what you quote.

Again
""So far in 2009, about a quarter of killings in the city have been committed with knives or other cutting instruments, about the same percentage as in 2008. But the overall homicide rate is down: 97 through April 16, the Police Department said, compared with 135 in the same period in 2008.""

So homocide is DOWN .

Youre excuse that knives now make up more is just that an excuse.

Clueless about english as well?

SOME other cities, now what does SOME mean? LOL You even have to take your own source out of context to fit the bill.

What more stupid nonsense is this, got some sources to back up how the gouvernement makes money out of crime?


And harder punishment isnt really going to stop anyone, USA already has among the toughest criminal laws.

Taking on the source of weapons and taking on legal sales that end up in the hands of criminals should be the focus.

BS it doesnt work, didnt work then and doesnt work now this is taken directly from your post "http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/28/ny...ives.html?_r=1"

the ... screws it up.

But its a great example of your paranoia and quit obssesive behaviour with this topic.

 

Reality is 5 to 10 times as much people get killed by guns. Guns who are more expensive and less easy to hide and wich carry harder punishment if caught.

reality doesnt agree with you.

 

Wont change a thing, weapons are too easy bought and discarted because they are cheap.

Sure they rob stores but are worried about the car.

And you do realise every weapon for people simply using it for self defense is legal? Or collectors or ... Plenty of people will get caught in this.

The law would have to be quit a bit more complicated but why not, but it isnt going to change a thing. You see criminals dont think they are going to get caught.

USA has the highest prison population of the western wor(in %). "slap on the hand" sure .

I dont want to punish them just make sure the weapons they own dont end up in crime.

And thats europe? And you dont have a clue about france or spain.

 

you are just proving my point that no matter if you ban all guns completely, criminals will still find them and obtain them somehow. its a given, guns are here to stay whether they get them from another state or another country, what you only think gun smuggling is an American thing?

only way to even think of keeping the guns out of criminals hands is to make harsh and swift punishments without the spineless liberal way of throwing out justice. get caught carrying a gun without a license then its automatic go to jail followed with a hefty fine. no more strike 1-2-3....15, one screw up and done.

its not an excuse, its truth. homicides may be down but killing with knives is still up 50% as a direct result of less guns being obtained in the hands of criminals, so they now use knives more often. its not that hard to understand dude.

it means NYC is one of the few cities that had the same thing happen, other cities didnt see the same spike. but word it as you want it, its there in plain english.

i just told you,with crime comes fines for the criminal. what do you think speeding tickets and everything make revenue for? duh the local governments. make more restrictments and you will have more people in jail and paying fines. why you think that marijuana is illegal for instance? because they make more money off drug money than they could by taxing it. people pay fines for every crime they may commit, from simple jay walking to murder, someone pays something to the government.

crime=money. id figure someone as smart as you would understand that.

the justice system here is a joke if you havent noticed. people who constantly commit crimes to a small amount of time and get out to repeat over and over again. its all about revenue and less about justice. we need a true justice system that harshly punishes, not keep on slapping people on the wrist and letting them go again to keep commiting the same crime or worse.

agreed, but obviously its not legal sale. when a buyer purchases a gun legally and then sells it illegally, the whole thing comes down to being illegal because of intent.

which is why i say make laws harsher on those who both sell or give their gun to a criminal and the criminal obtaining the gun. with the technology out and the power to make new laws it could be easy. but our (*)(*)(*)(*)(*) justice system doesnt like to work, they are just content with crime and getting paid off it.

um if it didnt work then how did you read it and find quotes from it? strange.

 

uh huh, i guess the world always had guns right? how were wars fought and murders commited before guns?

take away guns people will just find other objects to use to kill with period. just like i have shown you what happened in NYC when knife homicides went up 50%. yes the homicides in total may have dropped, but a certain type of homicide has risen in NYC since guns have been harder to get. take away guns and people are still gonna be murdered, then we are gonna have to ban knives,bats,rocks,bricks, shoe strings, metal poles, tire irons, beer bottles, forks or whatever else people will use in replacement of guns being gone.

you follow yet?

 

it can change alot depending on how the offense is punished and how the punishment is given and carried out.,ake obtaining guns illegally a "no possibility for parole" crime with a minimum of 5 years and an automatic fine of $20,000.

and for those selling or giving the guns illegally make it a "no possibility for parole" offense with a 10 year minimum sentence and a $50,000 fine for every gun thats gets traced back to them as being sold or given away illegally.

our laws today dont do much to put the scare into people, they have little to lose so they dont care most of the time when they get caught.

of course they are worried about their own belongings, doesnt matter if they steal from other people they still protect what is theirs.

but if you are not supposed to have a gun on you or in your home because of your background its not legal for you to use it. felons and such are not allowed in any way to have a gun, not even in their home as they are not even permitted to buy one in most states.

and laws work a lil differently for collectors. as long as the collector is a law abiding citizen and doesnt carry any of his/her collection without a permit and only has the guns for collection then they are not doing anything wrong.

once again trying to lump everything together, stop ignoring the differences, its really getting old.

criminals know what they are doing is wrong and know they have a chance of getting caught. the thing is our justice system is so pussified that they hardly care to get caught. make the law and punishment truly hit home and they will be less inclined to commit the crimes they do. its all about discipline.

the only reason we have the highest population in prisons is because they give crimes that are basically bull(*)(*)(*)(*) and not violent a jail sentence. people here go to jail for a friggin blunt full of weed. most criminals in prison arent even violent which is why prisons are so packed, we put everyone into a prison.

also most prisoners are repeat offenders which is another problem where our justice system is retarded. you go in and get out most the time.

its weird, you can get a sentence of 5 years for having a pound of weed, but you can also only serve 5 years for molesting a child? i mean you figure the child molester would be given a harsh punishment but na, our justice system releases them with low time served and let them out to go on and do it all over again.

im with you on that.

those 2 sissified countries is all you need to know about europe honestly. the only thing we have in the United States than can compete with Europes spinelessness is San Francisco lol. one city vs. two pansy countries lol.

 

I never said that more BS.

Weapons are brought in from outside NYC so limiting the discussion to just that is BS.

Weapons are brought in because the USA still is flooded with weapons mostly from legal purchases.

Again what does this matter? That is an excuse . homocide was down, gun crime was down, and that was WITH almost 90% of the weapons coming in from outside.


Apperently you like your ease of buying fireamrs soo much you are will to sacrifice lives for it .

BS fines are to discourage people to do things that are HARMFULL for society. Like crashing your car, 1 deadly carcrash costs a lot more to society then a speeding ticket.

YOU claim the gouvernement directly benefits from crime, but as usual you only got excuses when asked for proof of that.

Sure the 3 strikes law doesnt excist anymore? There arent more people in jail in the USA then any western nation (and almost all nations on earth)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:U.S._incarceration_rates_1925_onwards.png

incarceration rate has been going up and has incerased 5 fold the last decades.

Again you focus on small things not the bigegr picture.

The first step sometimes is legal sales. SO the ease of buying firearms is directly related of the ease of buying firearms on the black market.

Because you gave another one? LOL

 

LMAO sure we can compare 2011 to the beginning of the Renaissance .

In case you dont realise most people dont buy guns to kill people with. Guns are bought as deterent as a way of forcing people into actions.

Its a lot harder to rob a bank with a halbard. And thats the point make it HARDER for criminals, not EASIER like you want .

If capital punishment doesnt deter people why would a fine do that?

plenty of people who collect guns have illegal, hell some might even have firearms without knowing its illegal, not everyone keeps up to date on such laws.

And you just said the system didnt punish anyone and was "pussified " .

But not the violent criminals? LOL

And again you just claimed criminals can do crime after crime without any punishment.

Again you are clueless.

 

What is it with you and 'liberals'? Anyone takes a view that is opposed to yours and you automatically assume you know what their political stance is? The loser is you; assumption, as they say, is the mother of all screw-ups.

 

No there wouldn't. The more guns the less criminals. They get shot and stop comitting crimes. It's called natural selection.

 

Yep, when you outlaw guns, People die. So sad.

 

it is already too late. Some are real concerned about the fiscal cliff...I'm more concerned about the socio-poli cliff we just ran over.

 

NYC has no shortage of gun laws but they are not vigorously enforced in minority neighborhoods. Is that failure to enforce due to racism?

 

The process continues unabated.