Should Muslims convert or?

At this point in time I agree, but that simply is not true historically.

 

The last 200 years was the quietest time in Islam history,
They were driven out of Europe and the Med sea.
They stayed in the Mid east because everybody had them beat militarily,
until oil money of the last 30 or so years brought them out again.

 

Where in the biblical fairy tale does it specifically say that women will get into the golden cube?

 

So, which side is out of date, behind the times, open to criticism today? Which progressed?

 

And at what cost, interesting you see it as sides!

 

Revalations is such a fu-ked up book, where everything is symbolic and can mean whatever your preacher wants it to mean.
I doubt there is a real answer.

 

Right, except you also said "I don't care what Muslims do to each other within their culture". You say that you consider Muslims to be the victims, yet your suggestion is a wall, which just shuts them in with one another.

I don't agree that Islam is one ideology. Many Muslims will say it is, like Erdogan, because it happens to further their goals, but since when do you take their words for things?

Hitler is not where the buck stops either. Maybe it's convenient to blame Hitler and use that as an excuse to not better oneself. I'm not saying Hitler isn't worthy of blame, I'm saying making the world a better place requires solutions like the Marshall help rather than solutions like the peace of Versailles.

You have yet to justify why blame is the appropriate way to look at the situation.

 

Dont think for one minute I am a Hitler fan, but I did read somewhere that he was the first leader
to introduce penalty rates for workers...not sure if thats a proven fact......

 

What is your suggestion? Perhaps let them in and turn our countries into Islamic ****holes?

So that they (Muslims) can realize they are doing it wrong and we are not going to put up with it.

 

Who is we?

 

That is an interesting question, isn't it?
You'll have to figure that out for yourself.

 

I'll go out on a limb here.

Any non-Muslim who learns about the religion.

 

Just trying to work out if that we included me! I am against any religious courts in the UK, the funding of religious state schools and jail sentences for preachers who preach violence.

 

Great, so now you can issue a sentence against Islam for preaching violence towards the "infidel" (you and me) in their sacred text - the Koran?

 

A couple things here.
Infidel is a Christian word.
Kaffir is the correct Muslim one.
And the Qur'an just touches on the violence.
It is found in the sunnah, and there is a lot of it.

 

"Infidel (lacking fidelity, untrue)" is a translation of "kaffir". Untranslated "kaffir" is a meaningless word, like every foreign word.
I agree with the rest.

 

Treating them fairly, clearly and consistently, as with anyone else. We shouldn't fail to address the problems, but we shouldn't make improving ones behaviour harder than it needs to be.

Do you think that is what is happening? If the hostility of westerners towards Muslims have taught them anything, it's that we're not putting up with them no matter what they do, so what'd be the point in improving their behaviour?

 

LOL so being a Christian ******* nation is somehow better?

Not according to such founders such as Jefferson or Paine at least.

 

Christian is much better than Muslim.


BTW, Jefferson or Paine had no way of knowing anything about Islam.

 

Yes just like the christian scum arrested in Bristol for preaching hate from the disgusting bible fairy tale. Lets get religion out of society.

 

LOL so you are claiming to be more informed concerning world religions then Jefferson and Paine and that is kind of amusing.

 

Just Islam

 

Nonsense...........

Islam was a major part of the world religions for somewhere in the range of 700 years by the time of the US founders and there was no way that such founders as Jefferson who have one of the largest libraries in the colonies and who even re-editor the new testament or Paine who wrote the book the Age of Reason would not have one hell of an understanding of Islam as well as all the other major religions of the time.

 

That makes no sense whatsoever.
Where would Jefferson get his information.
Jefferson had the first English translation of Qur'an, ( Nobody knows if he even read it), And not an accredited version.
He had no way of knowing the correct way to read it. And no way to know if what he was learning was right or wrong.
He had no way to learn about Muhammed.

 

Strange as the details of the early Roman Republic or Carthage and their religions was no secret from the founders however for some strange reason a major world religion hundreds of years later in history was a deep dark secret to them.

He and his fellow founders would had been far better off like Trump getting their information from the internet religion haters of today if that had been possible.

Note Jefferson had other books in his large large library that touch on Islam such as the Pufendorf book On law and Nature.